WILL THE CADET PROGRAM SURVIVE???

[Tueboron]

I am writing this as a concerned parent and former cadet. I have read several documents that indicate a steady decline in cadet membership. I believe a primary cause of this decline can be summarized by a statement made to me by my children's Deputy Commander for cadets that "this is a volunteer organization the rules won't be followed". This statement says it all.
   The statement was made to me when I was asking both of the senior deputy commanders about several violations of the Cadet Program and the CPPT as well as other regulations. Another surprising statement made at this discussion was that there was nothing I could say that they already didn't know about what happened at the other squadrons. This was surprising as I thought considering there was an ongoing investigation concerning those events that such was "Privileged and Confidential". However after some diligent consideration it occurred to me a similar statement was made by the Wing Administrator (who is married to the squadron commander) at a previous meeting thus, one can conclude this is where they got their information. So much for confidentiality.
   First let me state that in my opinion, if the Cadet Program is run in accordance with the already established regulations and simple common sense it would be beyond reproach. That being said if the regulations are not followed then nothing but chaos can result and there will be no consistency within the organization. Sadly this is the path CAP has taken.
   Let me explain. My children are currently in their third squadron. The first squadron lost it charter in primary part due to a failure of maintaining records and did not have an adequate senior staff. However the squadron did give training on a weekly basis in the various CAP areas such as emergency services, Leadership, Moral leadership ect. Further the unit commander did not allow meritless decisions to become effective.
   The second squadron refused to follow even the most basic requirements of the cadet program (i.e. testing and required class work) and based their decisions not on any CAP standards or merit system but instead on their personal desires and motives. One example of this is that the squadron had 3 C/SMSgts and a C/TSgt  that were active in the squadron, however all of these cadets were repeatedly passed over for cadet staff positions in favor of C/AB and C/Arm this still occurred after the C/TSgt and one of the C/SMgts were promoted. Another is placing a person not a member of CAP in direct charge of the cadets and pretending that he was in fact a member. After bringing these issues to those in authority my children were constantly retaliated against and we chose to try another squadron except my oldest that decided the problem was not worth the headaches. To my understanding this squadron is now currently under restructuring.
   The current squadron at first seemed ok not perfect but trying, then after the official complaints regarding the last squadron was filed everything changed. The key members of the squadron then began to actively discourage and prevent my children from even attempting to advance in CAP examples of this are discouraging my daughter from participating in the wing supported operation strip and ordering her to march her mile run test instead of running it. As for my son they have thus far refused to critique his Goddard essay or allow him to present his speech. When he asked about it he was lied to by his Deputy Commander for Cadets. And as with the other squadron although my children are higher ranking cadets in the squadron and had been active at every unit activity they again are passed over for all leadership positions in favor of cadets that have not even received their Wright Brothers award. My children were not even considered for any position, while those that were hand chosen were "trained" for the respective positions. Further, the squadron has not taught a single leadership class since my children joined the squadron (approx 5 months). What a great way to teach leaders do nothing.
   During this time other events and examples of what not to do occurred. These include allowing a male cadet to drive around at a squadron function unaccompanied with a non member female in a vehicle clearly marked with CAP emblems. (it was the same cadet different times with different females) Being that this was the squadron commander's son it does not show a good example to the rest of the cadets. Such was attempted to be justified by them stating he was a senior member flight officer, but over a month later he is still listed as a cadet on the roster. At this same activity the squadron commander placed someone that was not a member in charge of the cadets, claiming he was a senior member.
   Another example is the model rocketry activity that the squadron conducted. First, CAP standards were not followed, and the key staff rejected suggestions for following the program set forth by CAP. In fact they wanted to use "old rags" for the fire resistant wading Their failure to follow established procedures and simple common since endangered the safety of all present. Under the watchful eye and assistance of the key senior staff engines were modified, engines were attached to other objects and launched, damaged rockets were modified, ect. This resulted in several incidents occurring. (luckily no injuries)
   Yet another example is obvious favoritism. A cadet recently joined the squadron, and wished to attend encampment. He was told he could attend next year after he learned more. In contrast to cadets that became members after him were giving a special testing opportunity not offered to the other cadets and were promoted the day they joined and the squadron allowed them to attend encampment. Of course these two cadets were the children of a key staff person in the squadron. Further these same two cadets needed the help of the mother to read the cadet oath after they were promoted in contradiction to the requirement of "must recite the cadet oath from memory" as  required in CAPR 52-16. This occurred in front of the entire squadron and guests.
   Don't get me wrong the squadron has good points as well, such as the squadron paid the majority of the cost for those cadets that were allowed to go to encampment, they do fund raising, and teach the cadets from the aerospace modules.
   All the problems I have mentioned would not have occurred (in my belief) if the regs were followed. Even if they wish to retain my children in grade there is a proper way outlined in CAPR 52-16 provided there is a valid reason.
   Now I am completely torn, my experience as a Cadet was extremely positive. What I see happening to not only my children but other cadets as well is extremely upsetting and it appears to be a wide spread problem.
   Although it may be too late for my children corrective action now can prevent others from being exposed to this same type of behavior and strengthen cap as a whole. Allowing this type of behavior to continue may lead to the death of CAP.
   Also, any advice on how to deal with the current situation would be greatly appreciated.
Sorry for the long post.

[Rotorhead]

Sounds like it may be time for the IG to step in.

To answer the question posed in your subject line,  Yes, it will survive.

Your experiences are not representative of how things are done everywhere.

Having said that, there are two sides to every story.

[jimmydeanno]

Tueboron,

First, I'm sorry that you haven't had too great of luck in finding a "good" squadron.  But, as for the thread title, "Will the cadet program survive," I think it will, but only if we can solve one major problem.  Our organization has a fundamental lack of good leaders at the local level.

In one of the more recent threads I noted that this lack of good leaders is widespread throughout our organization, and unfortunately, I don't know how to fix it - other than recruiting a bunch of good leaders to run things.

It does sound like you've a good handle on how things should be run in the unit's - perhaps you could volunteer a bit of your time to assist in those areas.  Sometimes, I've found that things aren't run the way they should be because the people running it just don't have enough time to do all the things that should be done.  This leads to cutting corners, etc, etc.

Without a real insight into the actual causes, personal experiences that you and your children are experiencing I can't say I can offer any specific advice as to how to remedy your problem.  Perhaps discussing them with the local leadership in a respectful way might give some insight.

[RiverAux]

File an official complaint and if the facts are as you say, then something should be done.  Posting this sort of very local issue on this board won't help you out any. 

[BrandonKea]

File an official complaint and if the facts are as you say, then something should be done.  Posting this sort of very local issue on this board won't help you out any.

X2, an IG complaint is your best option at this point.

[FW]

It is not true that,nationally, cadet membership is on the decline.  Latest statistics show an increase in cadet membership over last year. 

As a cadet's parent, you have every reason to complain to the squadron commander if you see real dangers and hazards when cadets are at squadron functions.  Other examples of perceived or actual unfairness should be handled with more tact.  However, if you are not a current member, it will be difficult to make a formal complaint to the IG.  If what you say is accurate regarding your daughter's PT test, I would call the Wing Commander and complain about harrasment.  There is no "wiggle room" for this. This is a very serious accusation.  It will be investigated and dealt with.  If it is not, call NHQ. It will be dealt with.
And, if a SQ/DCC actually says they won't follow the rules because of our "volunteer status", I would just pack up my children and find squadron #5.  But, before doing so, I would "figurativly" rip is heart out.

[afgeo4]

As another poster said, there is more than once side to every story.

However, if EVERYTHING you're saying has been true, I would guess that the real problem lies with the Group or Wing commander. Problems this widespread cannot be a coincidence.

I would draft a letter, as detailed as possible with as many facts as possible about these events and send it to the Wing commander. If you don't get a satisfactory answer from them, send the same letter to the Region Commander and copy the Wing Commander on it (e-mail works great for this), apprising him/her of what has happened to that date, including the action/lack of action from Wing HQ.

If you don't have any proof of any of this then I would question the whole situation, but it seems like a lot of these things can be proven simply by looking into online/paper records.

TO SUMMARIZE: No, CAP isn't in danger. CAP isn't run this way. Your area's units are. BIG DIFFERENCE.
Go ahead and report the incidents you've witnessed and let the system work itself out. It's been around since 1941 and it had a tendency to be able to correct itself once it's made aware of its mistakes.

The big problem IS the lack of well trained, experienced and smart leaders in CAP, but the problem isn't at the unit level. The body always rots from the head. Our local leaders have no one to learn from, no one to teach them, and no one to follow, and as we know, leadership is taught by example. Thankfully, there have been improvements at the National HQ level recently and hopefully that will trickle down to regions, wings, and groups, but it until it does... we'll make do with what we have.

[STG3, USN]

I was in the Cadet Program for 6 1/2 years and throughout that time I seen that some Squadrons were better then others and some Commanders were better then others I also seen alot of dirtbags come and go and thats generally what dirbags do they show up and realize that the program will not cater to them sometimes this just takes awhile but usually the good members are the ones that stick around and are the ones who make Civil Air Patrol the outstanding organization it is. I feel I was fortunate to be a part of an outstanding Squadron that had leadership that strived for a great Cadet Program. Does the Cadet Program have a place yes it does and I feel it does a great job at preparing young adults for the real world I was pretty greatful for having been a member when I was at Boot Camp in Great Lakes thats for sure I also feel it has taught me the leadership skills that I apply in the United States Navy today.

STGSN Thomas Nellenbach, USN
Former Cadet Lieutenant Colonel, CAP
Eaker Award#1769
Fremont Cadet Squadron NCR-NE-010

[EMT-83]

Huh?

[Spike]

I think we need to add "how to write sentences" into the CAP Cadet Program.   

[Major Lord]

The above post just wreaks of being a scam.....it sounds like it was written by a 13 year old cadet masquerading as a parent, or at best, a "little league" parent trying to stir up some trouble. There is nothing wrong with bringing issues like this up here, but we have mechanisms for dealing with most of the problems mentioned, and it sounds like our anonymous newbie poster is pulling your chain to me. BS meter pinned.....

Major Lord

[Spike]

Comment removed

Ah hah..........

Not cool to remove what you said. 

Everyone saw it anyway. 

[MIKE]

I heart edit logging.

[dwb]

Yes, the cadet program will survive.

[Polecat]

This looks like he is just trying to stir trouble to me.
Apply as needed:

[afgeo4]

**Everyone breaks out into "I will survive"**