I will be attending an SLS/ CLC at Scott AFB next month. A newer member asked if we (CAP) had O Club privileges. (We are staying in the base hotel)  Now from previous posts Ive gathered that it is usually up to the base commander and varies from place to place.

My question is this: how would I go about finding out? Do I just call the Services Sq. ?   And if we are eligible do we fork over the fee for annual membership or just a few bucks for the weekend or what?

Calen,
I'll see you there!!

I haven't been there myself but have heard about many a CAP officer downing a few beers there (at the All Ranks Club).

If there's any question ask Lt Col Gale - he'll confirm for sure.

Murph

It should be in the MSA for the actvitiy... The same document that is used to authorize use of billeting.

It stands to reason that if your MSA includes officer billeting, you could use the O-club, but ask, just to be on the safe side.

The key is to behave, and act like you belong there. . . . .

If you dress decent (polo shirt & slacks or CAP uniform), then using the dining room should not be an issue.  I can't imagine them asking for ID or membership cards (just don't pick membership appreciation night).    

I wouldn't worry about trying to be a member.  I think just about every club now requires a formal membership and that use to require getting a major credit card issued through the club so they can automatically bill your dues to it.  

If you intend to hang in the bar, you might want to make sure it is spelled out first in the MSA.   You never know who might be having a bad day and you accidently piss them off and get a formal complaint.

AF and Army Club systems use CHASE credit cards now.  They are AWESOME about billing your dues.  PLUS the card is a "rewards" card, that is the more I drink  eat  on post/base or shop at the commissary or buy anything AAFES, I earn 2 points per dollar, and 1 point off post.  After so many they let you chose gift cards, gift certificates ETC.  I am currently working on a Home Depot Gift Card.

I usually get orders for CAP events on military bases that say whether we have exchange and O-club.

On an MSA you normally have the privileges of a TDY officer.  That includes the O-club.  Don't get all drunk and silly, act like a gentleman. 

Enjoy.

The project Officer emailed me back and said yes we do get TDY-Officer privileges. So my next question is this: is there any protocol I should know about when in the place? Dining room or bar?
And ... As Im not a member what is the usual routine to get in or pay for items?
Thanks.

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on October 19, 2007, 02:46:29 PM
The project Officer emailed me back and said yes we do get TDY-Officer privileges. So my next question is this: is there any protocol I should know about when in the place? Dining room or bar?
And ... As I'm not a member what is the usual routine to get in or pay for items?
Thanks.

Carry your MSA with you.  Just walk in, (if I am not mistaken it is a consolidated, all-ranks club right?) and do as you would at a restaurant or bar.  I would presume that they have a lunch buffet, perhaps an evening buffet, dinner service and drink service from 1400 to 2359.  No need to wear the CAP uniform, a polo and some pants work rather well.  Don't be too loud, strike up some conversations, and have a nice time.  Most AF/Army clubs in the system allow non-members to buy at a slightly "higher" price off the menus, and make sure you tip the servers, or tenders.  If it is one of those fancy clubs, they may offer other services like a pizza shop, a concessionaire, barber....etc.  No better place to drop some $$ on base/post than at the club.  Have a good time!

While we are on the subject of O-Clubs.....has anyone noticed more and more O's are becoming CONSOLIDATED OPEN MESSES?  Weird right?  Guess financial play a big part!

Some lessons I have learned from various O-Clubs:

There is often a dress code.  ie - No t-shirts or shorts.  Slacks/pants and a button-down or polo/golf shirt normally work fine.

Sometimes you have to have a club membership to go to the club.  But, they often sell a temporary membership if they require it. 

You're at an O-Club, so act like an Officer.  I.E. clean appearance, no inappropriate comments, etc.  Many of them that I have been to are more like a upper class lounge/club than a bar/restaurant.

Remember that chances are that someone important is there, and if you make that person mad, they can revoke CAPs ability to use the club or base. 

Some O-Clubs have "rules" and they are available for you to review at the membership desk.

Quote from: mikeylikey on October 19, 2007, 03:19:49 PM

Quote from: SAR-EMT1 on October 19, 2007, 02:46:29 PM
The project Officer emailed me back and said yes we do get TDY-Officer privileges. So my next question is this: is there any protocol I should know about when in the place? Dining room or bar?
And ... As I'm not a member what is the usual routine to get in or pay for items?
Thanks.

Carry your MSA with you.  Just walk in, (if I am not mistaken it is a consolidated, all-ranks club right?) and do as you would at a restaurant or bar.  I would presume that they have a lunch buffet, perhaps an evening buffet, dinner service and drink service from 1400 to 2359.  No need to wear the CAP uniform, a polo and some pants work rather well.  Don't be too loud, strike up some conversations, and have a nice time.  Most AF/Army clubs in the system allow non-members to buy at a slightly "higher" price off the menus, and make sure you tip the servers, or tenders.  If it is one of those fancy clubs, they may offer other services like a pizza shop, a concessionaire, barber....etc.  No better place to drop some $$ on base/post than at the club.  Have a good time!

While we are on the subject of O-Clubs.....has anyone noticed more and more O's are becoming CONSOLIDATED OPEN MESSES?  Weird right?  Guess financial play a big part!

That , and we are in a new geneartionof military. When I was leaving active duty in 1999, they were doing away with O-clubs and NCO clubs. New generation troops complain about why we have seperate clubs based on rank. it gives an aire of superiority and discrimination to have a club "just" for officers or a club "just" for NCO's. It sends a message that offuicers somehow live or are treated better that enlisted folks. Do i agree withit? No. But it is what it is.

Another thing. The culture of the military has changed a lot. Back inthe day a typical officer was a West Point grad, came from a good,affluent family. Today you have a ;ot of offices that arre prior enlisted that came up through OCS (nyself included) They dont really see a need to segregate themselves rom enlisted folks since they used tobe one. SO, they feel very comfortable chiling with Privates and Specialists and Sergeants. They dont see themselves as "above" enlisteds. whereas in the old days officers thought they were all that.

Also, you talk about dress codes. You have to remember that 2LT's are still young people. They dress pretty much the same as that new Private out of basic. a 22 year old 2Lt is inthe same generation as a 20 year old Private so they have similiarities when it comes to social things.

Quote from: flyguy06 on October 19, 2007, 03:36:24 PM
Another thing. The culture of the military has changed a lot. Back inthe day a typical officer was a West Point grad, came from a good,affluent family. Today you have a ;ot of offices that arre prior enlisted that came up through OCS (nyself included) They dont really see a need to segregate themselves rom enlisted folks since they used tobe one. SO, they feel very comfortable chiling with Privates and Specialists and Sergeants. They dont see themselves as "above" enlisteds. whereas in the old days officers thought they were all that.

Also, you talk about dress codes. You have to remember that 2LT's are still young people. They dress pretty much the same as that new Private out of basic. a 22 year old 2Lt is inthe same generation as a 20 year old Private so they have similiarities when it comes to social things.

hold up, wait, wait, Wait, hang on there!  I am going to have to make a stand against everything you just typed.  First, West Point (great as it may be) has never produced the number of Officers that ROTC/OCS/Direct produces (since what.....1920), so the assumption that Officers used to be more affluent and came from better families, although true when Commissions were sold in this country, no longer has merit. 

Second, I will ruin an Officers career if he or she CAN NOT make the distinction between what he or she was and what he or she NOW is.  I have no tolerance for blatant socializing and fraternizing with enlisted Soldiers just because the Officer used to be one.  If that "click" did not happen in OCS or wherever that turned the soldier from enlisted to Officer, I will click it for them.  Granted, there are times when socializing is a good thing.  Senior NCO's, and Officers are usually permitted to join the same O-club.  However you will very rarely see anyone below E-6 in the O-club.  I also enjoy the occasional BBQ with my Senior NCO's at my place or theirs.  I will say this is not the 1950's.  That is, the whole Officer Enlisted total separation thing has almost gone away.  I remember reading the third edition of the Army Officers guide that said "Officers shall have free play to go where they wish on Post, while Enlisted members shall be precluded from venturing on the Officer side of the Post".  Crazy right?   

Third, I stress that Officers are not any better than enlisted members.  However, because it is the military, there is a certain "throw-back" culture.  Officers are expected to be well mannered, well behaved, they should not swear, or talk bad about people.  So act like a lady or gentleman.  That means no cutoffs, and tie-dye t-shirts on those days when all you need to do is "run to the PX" for a case of beer.  I busted my Officers at the PX if they were not clean shaven, or had torn-up clothes on.  No excuse.  That old adage, "An Officer is an Officer, whether on duty or not" APPLIES!!!

Finally, that generation thing you stressed about the similarities between junior Officers and junior Enlisted.  I don't buy that.  Sure people like similar things, but when it comes down to it, those two (the 2LT and Private) will NEVER be found at an all night Beer-Pong tourney together, will most likely not even run into each other unless they are getting gas on Post. 

I will end on.......The segregated club system was in place for over 150 years.  It has given Enlisted and Officers places to go to GET AWAY FROM the OTHER.  You spend all day at work with PFC Jones.  Do you want him to be drinking across the table from you as you are telling your friends about your day?  He does not want that either.  Historically the military is beginning to drop the social and statutory rules and regulations concerning the day to day interactions of Enlisted and Officers.  I can not tell if it will be a good thing or not.  I only hope it does not turn into a similar situation that can be seen in the Netherlands where the enlisted guys vote for their Officers, decide whether they want to train, or even wear a uniform.  (Perhaps I am mistaken about the country, can someone let me know if it is in fact the Netherlands?)

Also, flyguy, spell check makes it ALL WORTH IT, even if it only cathes half of the mistakes!

OK, I am completely confused. Please someone straighten me out before I do something stupid.

I will be going to the GLR Region conference at Grissom AFB next weekend. The only uniforms I intend to bring will be flightsuit and BDU.  I will not be staying on base; I will be at a hotel. ZI have no idea what an MSA is.

Can I use the officer's club? What services are there? Bar, restaurant? Is a BDU uniform acceptable?

My only real motivation for going to one of these is to socialize with the military folks, etc.

My personal experience

MSA is as close to documented orders as CAP gets.  they are written by the LO shop and issued to give you an official status on base. 

All bases have different services.  Most bases have some form of Club. 

Most O clubs are nice dinner/cocktail establishments.  Usually BDU's. and Flight Suits are NOT appropriate for the club. 

Even the flightsuit is inappropriate for a Region Conference. For an O-club blues or civilian suits are most often worn, and many O-clubs require service coat with the blue uniform after 1800.

Quote from: Nomex Maximus on October 19, 2007, 07:18:57 PM
OK, I am completely confused. Please someone straighten me out before I do something stupid.

I will be going to the GLR Region conference at Grissom AFB next weekend. The only uniforms I intend to bring will be flightsuit and BDU.  I will not be staying on base; I will be at a hotel. ZI have no idea what an MSA is.

Can I use the officer's club? What services are there? Bar, restaurant? Is a BDU uniform acceptable?

My only real motivation for going to one of these is to socialize with the military folks, etc.

You're going to a Region Conference and all you are bringing is flightsuits & BDU's?

Gee, I guess they do things a little different up north.....

Also, If you are attending a CAP conference, your leisure time might best be spent socializing and networking with other CAP members than trying to absorb the ambience at the local O-club: they are not what the movies and TV portray them to be.....

I specifically asked the organizer of the event if BDUs were OK for the conference and she said yes. The information brochure for it only listed blues or flightsuits but she said BDUs were OK too.

Hides under the table as the incoming uniform barrage begins