Help Wanted - Hazing Analysis

[Nathan]

A CAP encampment should not resemble FMJ, nor "Hell Week" in Navy SEAL training, nor the similar physical and mental stress testing faced by
USAF PJ candidates.

It should teach teamwork, leadership, followership, personal responsibility,attention to detail.

Accomplishing this sometimes requires motivation, individual attention, team building events and the like.

It may require a bit of over the top 'acting' by the leaders/instructors, for instance, the flight commander's shock and dismay at the condition of cadets' quarters.

Obviously, any encampment staff needs thorough training for seniors & cadets -- RST is a starting point, not simply a box to mark on a checklist.

And cadet leaders need constant guidance and monitoring by senior leaders, particularly when interacting with cadet trainees. "The line" leading to humiliating or harming a cadet can be approached inadvertently or unintentionally; the senior's role is to call a time out and steer the cadet leader back on track before things get too far.

If it helps anyone understand my position, I am 100% in agreement with this post.

[Senior]

Ned,
I found Pressure Point entertaining.  It brought back a lot of memories
of Army Basic.  The DI was very professional in teaching "paying attention to detail".  I didn't see any hazing in this video.
I think those that have been through "basic" will remember the training they received in "basic".  Those that haven't may feel that
the Jack Webb or Pressure Point videos are to harsh. 
I learned from "basic":
Pay attention to detail.
You better listen, no one else will take care of it for you.
It pays to be a winner, you don't want to be last.
You can be replaced.
The mission will be accomplished with or without you.
Mission is ALWAYS more important than the individual.
I never felt like I was hazed in the military.  We all were treated
the same.   I never felt hazed in CAP as a cadet

[Karen95B30]

52-10 explicitly addresses only sexual and physical abuse. The definition of hazing applies to "another" (read individual), causing many to rationalize that "As long as I do it to ALL of them and don't single anyone out, then it's okay."

That said, I feel that the events in the DI video clip are in no way applicable to a cadet encampment, and I think it can be dangerous to compare encampments to Basic Training or Boot Camp because they serve completely different purposes.

Having been enlisted in the Army and completing Basic Training (in the mid 80s) I understand the necessity of "breaking them down to build them up" because the Drill Sergeants are responsible for MAKING soldiers. It is not the duty of encampment staff to MAKE cadets -- they are already cadets when they arrive. It's this difference that causes me to question whether screaming and yelling is actually abusive, rather than if it meets the definition of hazing. If there is another purpose, and screaming and yelling is warranted and/or necessary, I would be very interested in learning what that is.

What greatly concerns me is the young airman who says to himself "I can't wait to come back next year as Staff so I can scream and yell at the cadets," and the senior members who seem amused by watching it happen. I feel very uncomfortable sending one of my senior cadets to serve as Staff at an encampment knowing they will be told to yell at the basics, as it goes against EVERYTHING they've learned at the squadron level about leadership.

[Dracosbane]

Having been hazed at an encampment, I have to say that the Jack Webb video was not hazing.  Not every action he was taking in that scene would be appropriate to CAP.  I would hope that no one would ask a cadet to kill 500 enemies.  I would see that stepping up to a cadet and asking a relevant question for a quick answer helps them think on their feet, so to speak.  The addressing of their training (outdated insults aside) wasn't handled poorly or cruelly.  He did not get in their faces and use his command voice, a la Gunny Hartman/FMJ. 

And aside from the repetitive up and down of the trashcan scene, which is tedious at best and not effective or relevant at encampment, banging on a trashcan to get attention or as a wake up call is not hazing.  I've had cadets that "EVERYBODY UP" or similar did not wake up.  And I'd left my alarm clock at home, so a couple of loud taps on a metal trashcan from across the room is just as effective as a loud beeping noise.  Notice, however that I didn't say that you should bang it in their ear, nor excessively or repetitively.  That would be inappropriate.  And if you disagree, I submit that I've been to encampments that we cadets were in rooms with doors expected to be shut during the night.  Banging on a trashcan in a squad bay type dorm is no different that walking up and down the hallway banging on doors to wake the cadets up inside.

As far as cadets going to encampment and finding a military environment, shouldn't they be going to the unit meetings and finding a military environment?  Yes, it's going to be more intense than your normal two hour weekly meeting for the simple fact that you're at an activity that is like unit meetings for 24 hours for five (plus) days.  No, there is no reason for it to be pedal to the firewall, all go no quit, FMJ for a week, but it will seem more intense than normal because of the length of time.  That's the perception.  We are a military program, cadets should expect a longer military experience because that's the nature of being at it for so long.  No, it's not boot camp, no it's not Hell Week, but by gawd I remember feeling like it had been at the end of the week.  That was my perception.

I went to three different wings for encampments over my cadet career.  And I only saw once (because I was the target) anything that would be considered hazing at any of them.  That scenario was handled properly (without sending any cadet home or undue punishment) and professionally, and it became a learning experience for both sides of the equation.  And I have never felt that the encampment as a whole was destroyed by that. 

My guess is now, however, that the things I experienced as a cadet might be construed as hazing by timid or politically correct officers.  I never felt they were, punitive PT and all.  I was a better cadet for having experienced it. 

[C/Martin]

In reality I do not think it is hazing.

Definition form yourdictionary.com: ☆ to initiate or discipline (fellow students) by forcing to do ridiculous, humiliating, or painful things

In no way is he doing anything "humiliating." Or at least on the scale that is done by Gunnery Sergeant Hartman on Full Metal jacket. Kinda hard to explain my view so here are some videos:

Hazing -

CAUTION: LANGUAGE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IXB-DQj5VM&feature=related - 3:39
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVA-cqASg8k&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1trZQcY7gts&feature=fvw - I dont think there is any "language."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzQBx2Ij2xk&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAV2B1nNnR4&aia=true
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqnaBeV5Isk

One thing I want to point out with the Drill Sergeants, Drill Instructors, ect. They take classes so they are supposed to know when they are pushing someone TOO far and when they may snap, ect.