Great News! The 2015 Cadet Encampment Assistance Program

[Spam]

Wing requires 3 sets of BDU's.  We have two kids that just started out and have no BDU's at all. 

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Local unit has been doing their best to help, it's just a lot for a new cadet.

This, honestly, is part of why I don't approve cadets to go to encampment who join less than four or five months or so out. It is unfair to the encampment staff, and stressful to the cadets, unit and parents, to expect to take a raw recruit off the street, rush them through their first stripe, and push them into the encampment environment.  We see some of these every year from inexperienced or outright lazy/careless unit staff who send nearly brand new cadets off, where their inability to march and ignorance about CAP prove training obstacles, their marginal uniforms and grooming and painful new boots not broken in, and their uncertainty and inexperience magnify the chances for an adaptation failure to military style training. In some cases, they can be safety risks as well, given that they're "drinking from the fire hose".


Encampment is not, emphasis NOT, basic training.


If your cadets don't have even one set of BDUs and blues each, and thus haven't earned the stripe to wear on them (note, that promotion is mandatory to attend), then they should wait until next year, and spend the time preparing (financially, as well as personally) for what will be a far more rewarding investment of time and effort.


V/R,
Spam

[Ned]

We applied around the third week of May.  I emailed HQ and was told that we would most likely not be getting any assistance because a majority of the money had already been used for priority 1 requests. Not sure when the final deision will be made, but we're running out of time.

And we have more Great News!  Although it looks like we have obligated almost all of the original $490,000 on Priority 1 cadets, we have been able to identify some new funding, and it appears that we should be able to fulfill all requests for assistance this year.  I can't make promises quite yet, but we should have an update in the next day or two.

(And yes, we know that encampments are starting all over the country . . ..  But government money is tricky to move around at times.)

We once again thank our AF colleagues for making this special funding available to help our cadets and their families.


Ned Lee
National Cadet Program Manager

[Luis R. Ramos]

Honestly!

Some people in here complain that cadets go to Encampment to unlearn what they learned on their units.

Others state that Encampments are for cadets to learn what to do on their home units.

Now we have someone saying that new cadets should learn on their home units.

Is it not better for a cadet to learn what they should correctly, how to do things, without any previous baggage?

Is it not having to unlearn what they learned at home, a greater barrier? [Edited, typo. Meant Is it not having to unlearn what they learned at home, best for them to learn properly?]

Is the view of most posting here that maybe NHQ should set a prerequisite that those cadets with Curry should not attend Encampments?

[edited to add]
I agree there may be cadets who are too inexperienced to participate in an encampment. But that is not just CAP achievement level, it includes their age and motivation. And parental involvement!

[xray328]

Wing requires 3 sets of BDU's.  We have two kids that just started out and have no BDU's at all. 

---

Local unit has been doing their best to help, it's just a lot for a new cadet.

This, honestly, is part of why I don't approve cadets to go to encampment who join less than four or five months or so out. It is unfair to the encampment staff, and stressful to the cadets, unit and parents, to expect to take a raw recruit off the street, rush them through their first stripe, and push them into the encampment environment.  We see some of these every year from inexperienced or outright lazy/careless unit staff who send nearly brand new cadets off, where their inability to march and ignorance about CAP prove training obstacles, their marginal uniforms and grooming and painful new boots not broken in, and their uncertainty and inexperience magnify the chances for an adaptation failure to military style training. In some cases, they can be safety risks as well, given that they're "drinking from the fire hose".


Encampment is not, emphasis NOT, basic training.


If your cadets don't have even one set of BDUs and blues each, and thus haven't earned the stripe to wear on them (note, that promotion is mandatory to attend), then they should wait until next year, and spend the time preparing (financially, as well as personally) for what will be a far more rewarding investment of time and effort.


V/R,
Spam

While I'm sure that happens all the time, that's not the case here. I'm a former Mitchell cadet myself, mom and I are both prior USAF enlisted, the kids are more than ready.  They really aren't being "rushed" through their first stripe, they have a join date of 28 May, encampment's 25 July.  They are attending summer encampment at my request so they are leadership ready for the next one. Our son is targeting the USAFA but is already 15 and needs those leadership roles, so if anything I'm the one pushing for them to attend.  But I'm also taking the responsibility and personally preparing them for it.

Let's assume they already had their one set of BDU's, and one set of blues (that's all I had through probably C/TSgt).  That's still 4 sets that would need to be ready. Ok, so now I'm at $640 in BDU's and $270 in encampment fees.  Still over $1000.  The advice has always been to seek out local resources through the unit, and then if need be, try the Army/Navy surplus stores.  I've had very limited luck there, most of what you find is a step away from the bin, or cheap Chinese knock offs.

The point of my post wasn't to complain but to illustrate how expensive special activities can be, especially to parents of new cadets.

[xray328]

Honestly!

Some people in here complain that cadets go to Encampment to unlearn what they learned on their units.

Others state that Encampments are for cadets to learn what to do on their home units.

Now we have someone saying that new cadets should learn on their home units.

Is it not better for a cadet to learn what they should correctly, how to do things, without any previous baggage?

Is it not having to unlearn what they learned at home, a greater barrier?

Is the view of most posting here that maybe NHQ should set a prerequisite that those cadets with Curry should not attend Encampments?

Very much agreed.  Our units cadet leadership consists of two cadet officers (1st/2nd LT) and the rest are enlisted ranks.  Great kids, great unit.  But I think the encampment is an excellent opportunity to learn from some very experienced/outstanding cadet staff outside of the home unit. My hope is that the kids not only benefit from the training, but also get a better understanding of what goes on outside the squadron.  Up until now their exposure to CAP has been the weekly meetings with only a handful of cadets. As we all know, the weekly meetings aren't what makes this fun for cadets, its the state/national acitivites they look forward to all year.

[Eaker Guy]

Honestly!

Some people in here complain that cadets go to Encampment to unlearn what they learned on their units.

Others state that Encampments are for cadets to learn what to do on their home units.

Now we have someone saying that new cadets should learn on their home units.

Is it not better for a cadet to learn what they should correctly, how to do things, without any previous baggage?

Is it not having to unlearn what they learned at home, a greater barrier?

Is the view of most posting here that maybe NHQ should set a prerequisite that those cadets with Curry should not attend Encampments?

Very much agreed.  Our units cadet leadership consists of two cadet officers (1st/2nd LT) and the rest are enlisted ranks.  Great kids, great unit.  But I think the encampment is an excellent opportunity to learn from some very experienced/outstanding cadet staff outside of the home unit. My hope is that the kids not only benefit from the training, but also get a better understanding of what goes on outside the squadron.  Up until now their exposure to CAP has been the weekly meetings with only a handful of cadets. As we all know, the weekly meetings aren't what makes this fun for cadets, its the state/national acitivites they look forward to all year.

+1

[Offutteer]

CAP is a bargain as compared to some other camps. 

http://www.nationalflightacademy.com/    $1,250 (though they do offer scholarships)

http://www.spacecamp.com/http://www.spacecamp.com/  Space Academy 12 -14 year old, $939

The kid would get a t-shirt or two, rather than full sets of uniforms.

[xray328]

CAP is a bargain as compared to some other camps. 

http://www.nationalflightacademy.com/    $1,250 (though they do offer scholarships)

http://www.spacecamp.com/http://www.spacecamp.com/  Space Academy 12 -14 year old, $939

The kid would get a t-shirt or two, rather than full sets of uniforms.

CAP has always been a bargain in my opinion.  There's very few groups out there that offer as much as it does, and not just in regards to special activities. 

That being said, I'm not sure that either one of those are really an apples to apples comparison to a wing encampment....

MER Powered Flight Academy, $1200

http://www.ncsas.com/?mer_powered_flight_academy&show=career_fair&careerFairID=15

Space Command Fam Course, $450

http://www.ncsas.com/?space_command_fam_course&show=career_fair&careerFairID=7

Those prices are on top of whatever you'd need to spend on uniforms to attend them.

CAP is still the better bang for the buck in my opinion though (if that's what it came down to - and of course it doesn't).

Both the Nation Flight Academy and Space Camp are 1 week camps that you attend, come home and really don't take a whole lot away from. CAP provided me with so much more than just a "summer camp" experience. It forced me to grow up, take personal responsibility, and to be accountable.  Then theres integrity, perseverance, service above self, courtesy, etc.  I'll glady put my time, money and effort into what CAP gives our kids over some corporate run "money maker" summer camp any day of the week (and twice on sunday of course)     

[Spam]

Honestly!

Some people in here complain that cadets go to Encampment to unlearn what they learned on their units.

Others state that Encampments are for cadets to learn what to do on their home units.

Now we have someone saying that new cadets should learn on their home units.

"Honestly", Luis, I don't understand your point in all your words. The program requires a valid Curry Achievement with all that entails prior to encampment, period. That's not "someone" saying it, that's the requirement. Beyond that, the pace of and level of intensity of training should fit the student, which it does not at encampment for most teen agers who have joined 60 to 90 days prior.

... Good luck to your guys, Xray.

... Nice work, Ned!

V/R,
Spam

[lordmonar]

Spam,

yes....an encampment requires a Curry.....but a Curry does not require what it used to.  However, it seems that what some encampments expect from first time attendees has not changed.

If new cadets with only 2-3 months in the program at struggling at encampment......maybe your curriculum need to be adjusted.

JMHO and YMMV.

[Luis R. Ramos]

Spam,

Lordmonar replied for me. That is my entire point.

If you think those cadets are not ready, do not approve their application.

If you think that cadets 60-90 days should not attend, ask through channels that as part of the requirements something like cadets should have at least 100 days of CAP membership. But where do you stop? 100? 105? 200? 365?!!!

However it seems the problem is... Your expectations, as Lordmonar put it nicely!

[Eaker Guy]

The Curry Blues program doesn't help with keeping the standards for the Curry Achievement high. It's like national wants to rush them in to their first stripe as quickly as possible.

Great Start does this as well. It isn't as bad, because the cadets actually do get an education before earning their first stripe. Those that don't have orientation programs just let the cadets figure it out themselves(like my squadron). In my squadron, I could definitely see some of the cadets that have the Curry struggling at encampment.

[xray328]

I don't think you'll ever be able to put a blanket policy out there. What works for a mature 12 year old may not work for an immature 15 year old. Some put in the effort, some don't. Some squadrons have excellent cadet programs, some don't. Some parents drop off their kids and run, some are more actively involved.

I think getting the kids through the Curry gives them a very basic foundation for what can be expanded upon at the encampment. Our wing has a "basic" encampment along with an "advanced" portion for cadets that have been to one in the past. I think that might be the best approach.

And I also agree with Luis that these decisions need to be made by the squadron commander. If they're sending cadets that clearly aren't ready, that falls back on them.

[Al Sayre]

The Curry Blues program doesn't help with keeping the standards for the Curry Achievement high. It's like national wants to rush them in to their first stripe as quickly as possible.

Great Start does this as well. It isn't as bad, because the cadets actually do get an education before earning their first stripe. Those that don't have orientation programs just let the cadets figure it out themselves(like my squadron). In my squadron, I could definitely see some of the cadets that have the Curry struggling at encampment.

So as the Cadet Commander, what are you doing about it?

[Eaker Guy]

The Curry Blues program doesn't help with keeping the standards for the Curry Achievement high. It's like national wants to rush them in to their first stripe as quickly as possible.

Great Start does this as well. It isn't as bad, because the cadets actually do get an education before earning their first stripe. Those that don't have orientation programs just let the cadets figure it out themselves(like my squadron). In my squadron, I could definitely see some of the cadets that have the Curry struggling at encampment.

So as the Cadet Commander, what are you doing about it?

Haha. I knew I would get myself into trouble!

I plan on talking with the CDC about setting up a recruiting and retention/orientation plan to be implemented early August.

Fortunately, none of the cadets that I think would struggle are going to encampment, so no problems there. Until we set the orientation program up, we'll just take it on a case by case basis.
We definitely rely on the trickle in method of recruiting, and we just recently placed a "Cadet Training Officer" to handle orientation. I know the position isn't in the 20-1, but I feel it's necessary for our current state. Still working through the kinks in the system, but we'll be running smoothly soon. I might pull some materials from Great Start for those that trickle in.

Have any suggestions? PM me if you do.

Thanks!

[Eaker Guy]

I don't think you'll ever be able to put a blanket policy out there. What works for a mature 12 year old may not work for an immature 15 year old. Some put in the effort, some don't. Some squadrons have excellent cadet programs, some don't. Some parents drop off their kids and run, some are more actively involved.

I think getting the kids through the Curry gives them a very basic foundation for what can be expanded upon at the encampment. Our wing has a "basic" encampment along with an "advanced" portion for cadets that have been to one in the past. I think that might be the best approach.

And I also agree with Luis that these decisions need to be made by the squadron commander. If they're sending cadets that clearly aren't ready, that falls back on them.

In your opinion, who bears the burden of basic cadet orientation? Squadrons or encampments?

[xray328]

Squadrons without a doubt. Which is why I believe that the squadron commander/deputy commander of cadets (with the help of cadet commanders) shouldn't send any cadet that isn't ready to go.

I might go as far as even saying that a cadet that isn't encampment ready shouldn't be given the Curry.  That being said, there needs to be established expectations on what "encampment ready" means.

[Eaker Guy]

Squadrons without a doubt. Which is why I believe that the squadron commander/deputy commander of cadets (with the help of cadet commanders) shouldn't send any cadet that isn't ready to go.

I might go as far as even saying that a cadet that isn't encampment ready shouldn't be given the Curry.  That being said, there needs to be established expectations on what "encampment ready" means.

Thanks for the response.

[Eaker Guy]

Squadrons without a doubt. Which is why I believe that the squadron commander/deputy commander of cadets (with the help of cadet commanders) shouldn't send any cadet that isn't ready to go.

I might go as far as even saying that a cadet that isn't encampment ready shouldn't be given the Curry.  That being said, there needs to be established expectations on what "encampment ready" means.

Thanks for the response. For the most part, I agree. Not sure about holding back the Curry if they aren't encampment ready. I think that cadets should go to encampment around the grade of C/SSgt-C/SMSgt. That way, they know what the CAP is all about, and they leave for encampment prepared. Sometimes, this is a luxury, and the 17 year old who wants to push for his/her Mitchell must go to encampment as soon as possible. However, these cadets are motivated and prepared to go to encampment when he/she has the Curry. We shouldn't ship off our cadets to encampment as  soon as they earn the Curry.

[xray328]

Again, it's all about the individual. No two cadets are going to the same despite age, or rank which is why the decision should be left up to their squadron commanders. Like you said, there are some highly motivated individuals out there. There are also cadets that only go because their parents need a break from them for a week [emoji5]️