Squadron Flight Sergeant

[68w20]

the senior cadets should have been training the junior ones to replace them.

One of the recurring themes in the handbook is the idea that there is no "cookie cutter squadron," and I feel that that applies here.  In a perfect world, CP SMs should be taking a backseat role; observing their Cadets in leadership positions at all levels and stepping in ONLY to provide necessary feedback, requested input, and to prevent potential safety/hazing issues.  Unfortunately, this is generally not the case.  The senior Cadets should absolutely have been training their replacements, but what if they didn't?

[abdsp51]

Then they have set the junior cadets and potentially the unit if the SMs are not watching the dynamic up for failure.

[68w20]

Then they have set the junior cadets and potentially the unit if the SMs are not watching the dynamic up for failure.

My apologies, I was not asking for a direct answer, but rather trying to continue the discussion in a slightly different direction.  Let's say you join a new Squadron which is experiencing the circumstances that we've described.  It's a very rare situation, but still an interesting thought experiment.  What would you do in order to fix the issues that we've discussed?

[abdsp51]

Take a look at the dynamic.  The OP stated they were top heavy well there is a good chunk of leadership there.  Now they should be training someone to take their place for when they leave for what ever reason, just as the C/CC should be doing for when he/she steps down, leaves etc.  If you have a dynamic C/A1C or SrA give them a shot they may surprise you in a leadership dynamic.  Now that is if the senior cadets are unable or unwilling to fulfill those roles.  I took over as C/CC in my first unit as a cadet NCO, and before anyone says something this was in the 90's before there was the staff handbook and everything else. 

In the event you are that bottom heavy, you can still fill your slots and have the rest sit empty until someone can fulfill the role.  In this aspect the CPOs in the unit should take a more active role in instructing the cadets in the materials that a senior cadet would be doing.  The should also take an active role in mentoring and helping those filling the roles to be the best they can be especially if the cadet/s in question are filling big shoes. 

In an ideal unit the CPOs would observe and mentor the cadets especially the cadet staff in executing the program, to ensure that the goals are met IAW with established policies. 

[Struts]

We seniors are here for more reasons than our good looks and charisma .

I forgot! You guys have to supervise us also!  Just messing. But how many SMs would function well in those positions?

What makes you think that SMs wouldn't "function well"?  What are your specific concerns over the idea?  My questions are sincere, I'd like to better understand where you're coming from with this line of argument.

Here are my sincere answers, In the Learn to Lead materials it says something along the lines of, "You don't have to be a commander to lead." Senior members should be supervising and guiding the cadets, not directly leading them and training them. I am not saying that senior members are not capable. The OP said that there would be junior officers soon who should be training the cadets. The SMs are perfectly capable of assisting the cadets and training them.

Edited for clarity.

[abdsp51]

We seniors are here for more reasons than our good looks and charisma .

I forgot! You guys have to supervise us also!  Just messing. But how many SMs would function well in those positions?

What makes you think that SMs wouldn't "function well"?  What are your specific concerns over the idea?  My questions are sincere, I'd like to better understand where you're coming from with this line of argument.

Here are my sincere answers, SMs would not have the same training as the cadets for handling a flight and running it. Even if they were ex-cadets it would be difficult for them to adapt. That is also not the role of the senior member. That is the role of a cadet. In the Learn to Lead materials it says something along the lines of, "You don't have to be a commander to lead." Senior members should be supervising and guiding the cadets, not directly leading them and training them. The OP said that there would be junior officers soon who should be training the cadets. There should be no need for senior members to be filling direct cadet positions.

There does not take much "training" to be a flt sgt.  Many SMs are managers, section chiefs, or whichever titles are used in their day to day jobs.  Be careful in throwing assumptions around.

[SarDragon]

Here are my sincere answers, SMs would not have the same training as the cadets for handling a flight and running it. Even if they were ex-cadets it would be difficult for them to adapt.

Oh, really? Are you suggesting that when a cadet turns SM that they suddenly and magically lose all the skills they worked so hard to learn as a cadet?

[Struts]

Sir, I just realized my mistake and changed my post to reflect more on my opinions. Senior members often have more leadership experience than cadets. What I meant to say was that cadets should be furthering their education, not that senior members could not do that job. Stuck my foot in my mouth...   

[abdsp51]

Sir, I just realized my mistake and changed my post to reflect more on my opinions. Senior members often have more leadership experience than cadets. What I meant to say was that cadets should be furthering their education, not that senior members could not do that job. Stuck my foot in my mouth...   

It happens which is why it's always wise to think about how something sounds prior to clicking post or send.  Humility is a good attribute to have.  You saw the error of your ways and took responsibility for it.  Now let's get back to the discussion on hand.

[Danger]

Thanks a lot gentlemen, I'll definitely try to get to C/SSGT before the next staff selection. And if not, I hope my staff will see leadership potential in me. I'll definitely study hard on D&C and C&C. I appreciate the advice.

[commando1]

I have known cadet commanders who were C/A1C's...There is usually a difference between what is preferable and what actually happens. The important thing is to do what you can, when you can, with what you have, when you have it. My two cents anyway...

EDIT: Grammar  its late...

[titanII]

I have known cadet commanders who were C/A1C's...There is usually a difference between what is preferable and what actually happens.

In other words, a C/A1C cadet commander is not usual and NOT preferred.

[Danger]

Cadet Commanders at A1C? CHALLENGE ACCEPTED (;

[Eclipse]

I have known cadet commanders who were C/A1C's...There is usually a difference between what is preferable and what actually happens. The important thing is to do what you can, when you can, with what you have, when you have it. My two cents anyway...

The thing that is right for the cadets involved is to allow them to progress naturally as the program dictates, and have the seniors do the commanding
until such time as a cadet gets to officer level.

having an A1C as commander is a real good way to burn him out and frustrate him early and accelerate his leaving CAP.  A unit with that few cadets
is already "challenged" in a number of areas, having a cadet commander who can barely spell CAP isn't going to make things easier.

[Danger]

Some A1C's can be pretty proficient and knowledgeable. It depends on the person. Myself and other A1Cs are very different. It all depends on the person, not their rank.

[Eclipse]

No, it actually doesn't.

Sharp or otherwise, there are experiential lessons that are one of the reasons you can't challenge Spaatz.  You're supposed to wear the grade and walk under it for a while, performing the follower ship long before you geta chance to be a leader.

[titanII]

There's simply no way that a C/A1C can have the necessary experience to fulfill such a high-up officer role. Plain and simple.

[Sgt. Papa]

i agree with Sergeant Donovan, you can NOT take on such a high responsibility with that low grade. Being an C/A1C can mean a few things, either that you're new to the program, so you don't have enough experiance, or that you've been in a while and are just too lazy to promote, which shows alot about your character.

[AngelWings]

i agree with Sergeant Donovan, you can NOT take on such a high responsibility with that low grade. Being an C/A1C can mean a few things, either that you're new to the program, so you don't have enough experiance, or that you've been in a while and are just too lazy to promote, which shows alot about your character.

Not a 100% correct. I couldn't pass PT for the longest time because I was 60 pounds heavier than I am now. I worked real hard then, with commendations to prove it. Now I am a Flight Sgt (and a SSgt going for TSgt). Not promoting is an area that can be black and white in most situations, but some times it is a grey area. Just food for thought because a huge part of leadership is knowing your men and knowing what holds them back or what pushes them forward.
EDIT: I don't want this to come off any more than simply don't judge the book by it's cover (or in this case judge the rank by the actions). Some cadets do flop in and out of physical fitness, especially if the standards get harder.

[a2capt]

There is a lot more to the cadet program than attending 8 meetings per stripe.

Thus two years of A1C does not make you "more qualified" at anything except A1C.