Meritorious Unit Commendation [US Navy] earned for Civilian Service

[RiverAux]

Bottom line is that a civilian cannot officially earn a military award.

Too broad a statement. 

CG Aux members can and do regularly earn military awards granted by CG authority.  Most CG Aux awards are not military members, but Auxies are eligible for many USCG awards.

[Stonewall]

Bottom line is that a civilian cannot officially earn a military award.

Too broad a statement. 

CG Aux members can and do regularly earn military awards granted by CG authority.  Most CG Aux awards are not military members, but Auxies are eligible for many USCG awards.

That's because they are, in fact, actual uniformed members of the Auxiliary. Just like CAP members earned the AFOEA.

It's not hard, but people will make it hard to benefit them.

As I said, 99% of the time no one in CAP will care, as long as you're not wearing something completely outlandish, like a Combat V or a MoH. So, do what you want, but be prepared to own it if its sketchy.

[Shawn Stanford]

I don't care about unit awards; I've got a pile of them and most of them I earned sitting behind a computer. A couple did require more, but for those I also got campaign medals and whatnot. I can only read ribbons down to the level of ARCOM/NAVCOM/AFCOM. Below that it just looks like someone vomited Froot Loops. I genuinely don't even recognize most of them. You want to bling it up with something you earned sitting on the toilet at a depot? Knock yourself out.

Chief, out.

[PHall]

Bottom line is that a civilian cannot officially earn a military award.

Too broad a statement. 

CG Aux members can and do regularly earn military awards granted by CG authority.  Most CG Aux awards are not military members, but Auxies are eligible for many USCG awards.

That's because the Coast Guard regulations say they can be awarded to the Auxiliary. Simple as that.

[N6RVT]

How about this, earned as a civilian supporting a USAR unit I was assigned to as a reservist at the time.

The fact they gave me that instead of the actual Army Achievement medal that would have actually meant something (though not much) says a lot about why I retired at 20 years instead of 30.

I had to go look this up as I actually *discarded* this award shorty after receiving it. Hadn't even thought about it for over 30 years.

And no, never wore it on anything after the first 20 minutes as it was meaningless.

[Stonewall]

How about this, earned as a civilian supporting a USAR unit I was assigned to as a reservist at the time.

The fact they gave me that instead of the actual Army Achievement medal that would have actually meant something (though not much) says a lot about why I retired at 20 years instead of 30.

I had to go look this up as I actually *discarded* this award shorty after receiving it. Hadn't even thought about it for over 30 years.

And no, never wore it on anything after the first 20 minutes as it was meaningless.

Not sure what you're getting at. You earned it as a civilian. It is a DA award for DA civilians. It is not a medal that can be worn on a military uniform.

[baronet68]

We have a former Marine in my unit with a CAR. He said he should get the Air Force CAM because the CAR transfers over. Nope. Wear your CAR, be proud.

Actually, the Navy/Marine Combat Action Ribbon CAN be transferred over the Air Force Combat Action Medal.

A14.17.1.2.  Members who receive the Army Combat Infantryman Badge, the Army Combat Action Badge, the Army Combat Medical Badge, or Navy Combat Action Ribbon may submit a copy of that award, along with other documentation, to the appropriate chain of command for conversion to the Air Force Combat Action Medal.  Approval authorities will coordinate with the applicable Military Service headquarters to arrange revocation.

[THRAWN]

We have a former Marine in my unit with a CAR. He said he should get the Air Force CAM because the CAR transfers over. Nope. Wear your CAR, be proud.

Actually, the Navy/Marine Combat Action Ribbon CAN be transferred over the Air Force Combat Action Medal.

A14.17.1.2.  Members who receive the Army Combat Infantryman Badge, the Army Combat Action Badge, the Army Combat Medical Badge, or Navy Combat Action Ribbon may submit a copy of that award, along with other documentation, to the appropriate chain of command for conversion to the Air Force Combat Action Medal.  Approval authorities will coordinate with the applicable Military Service headquarters to arrange revocation.

Is there a comparable CAP regulation? If not, wear the CAR. Or just your CAP awards and stop all this silliness.

[Eclipse]

Or just your CAP awards

As always the answer is right there, but...

[Stonewall]

We have a former Marine in my unit with a CAR. He said he should get the Air Force CAM because the CAR transfers over. Nope. Wear your CAR, be proud.

Actually, the Navy/Marine Combat Action Ribbon CAN be transferred over the Air Force Combat Action Medal.

A14.17.1.2.  Members who receive the Army Combat Infantryman Badge, the Army Combat Action Badge, the Army Combat Medical Badge, or Navy Combat Action Ribbon may submit a copy of that award, along with other documentation, to the appropriate chain of command for conversion to the Air Force Combat Action Medal.  Approval authorities will coordinate with the applicable Military Service headquarters to arrange revocation.

I should have clarified, he didn't want to trade in his CAR for a CAM, he wanted the CAM, too. In this particular case, he earned the CAR in 2003, before the CAM was created, and I may be wrong, but the AF did not allow for the CAM to be awarded for actions prior to its creation.

As an aside, I disagree with that regulation. However, the supporting documentation is what is key. The AF CAM is a bit harder to qualify for than the CIB/CAB.  I don't have the AFI in front of me, but for the CAM you require to have been engaged in direct fire with the enemy. I have a good friend I was deployed with who lost his leg on a patrol and got a Purple Heart, but NOT a CAM. Because it was not direct enemy fire. All the Army guys we were with got CABs and CIBs for indirect fire, but we didn't get CAMs. To me, enemy fire is enemy fire, direct or indirect.

[N6RVT]

Not sure what you're getting at. You earned it as a civilian. It is a DA award for DA civilians. It is not a medal that can be worn on a military uniform.

That was just me griping about something that happened over 30 years ago. They gave me that instead of an AAM specifically for that reason.

Question is though - why is there a ribbon for this?

[THRAWN]

Not sure what you're getting at. You earned it as a civilian. It is a DA award for DA civilians. It is not a medal that can be worn on a military uniform.

That was just me griping about something that happened over 30 years ago. They gave me that instead of an AAM specifically for that reason.

Question is though - why is there a ribbon for this?

Guess you could always ask the Army...

[baronet68]

Is there a comparable CAP regulation? 

Yes.  CAPR 39-3:

A. (3) b.  Decorations, ribbons  and  badges  authorized for wear on  the  U.S.  Air  Force  uniform  may be  worn  on the  CAP  AF-style  uniform  when earned  through qualification  and  awarded by  competent authority  to a  member for service  performed in  any  branch of  the  Armed Forces  of  the  United States or  its  allies  as  outlined in  CAPM  39-1.   

AFMAN36-2806 refers readers to follow additional instructions in AFI 36-2903 (AF uniform manual).
In the same way, CAPR 39-3 refers readers to follow additional instructions in CAPR 39-1 (CAP uniform manual).

Or just your CAP awards and stop all this silliness.

^^ That's the simplest way of handling it. 



You know... when I worked at Domino's Pizza back in the 80's, I earned a bronze medal for my 2-tray time (tossing and saucing 16 pizza crusts) in less than 8 minutes.  While it was nowhere near Waheed Asim's time of 2 minutes and 56 seconds, I still managed to 'Avoid the Noid' and should certainly be allowed to wear THAT medal on my CAP uniform, right?      

[heliodoc]

Maybe outdated  AR 672-20 LOLOLOLOL

[N6RVT]

Or just your CAP awards and stop all this silliness.

^^ That's the simplest way of handling it. 

You know... when I worked at Domino's Pizza back in the 80's, I earned a bronze medal for my 2-tray time (tossing and saucing 16 pizza crusts) in less than 8 minutes.  While it was nowhere near Waheed Asim's time of 2 minutes and 56 seconds, I still managed to 'Avoid the Noid' and should certainly be allowed to wear THAT medal on my CAP uniform, right?      

This is why everybody just wears polo shirts.

[Shuman 14]

Conversely, if a CAP member earned the Air Force Organizational Excellence Award (AFOEA) like we did a few years back, that member would NOT be allowed to wear that ribbon on their military uniform if they joined the military in the future (or already serving).

Maybe, Maybe not.

I took the AFOEA memo awarding it to CAP to S-1 Section at my Army Reserve Unit, they uploaded it into my i-PERMS and I wear it proudly on my Army Uniform, the same with every decoration awarded to the USCGAux, I took the documentation to the S-1, they uploaded it into i-PERMS and I wear them all without issue.

[Shuman 14]

Not sure what you're getting at. You earned it as a civilian. It is a DA award for DA civilians. It is not a medal that can be worn on a military uniform.

Ummm, yes you can.

In order of precedence, US Government Civilian awards and decorations, authorized for wear, are worn after U.S. military personal decorations and unit awards and before U.S. military campaign and service awards.

[Shuman 14]

That was just me griping about something that happened over 30 years ago. They gave me that instead of an AAM specifically for that reason.

Question is though - why is there a ribbon for this?

Because AR 670-1 says you can wear Civilian awards and decorations.  In order of precedence, those U.S. non-military awards and decorations, authorized for wear, are worn after U.S. military personal decorations and unit awards and before U.S. military campaign and service awards.

Also civilian uniformed employees such as DA Police Officers and DA Firemen would need the ribbon for their uniforms as well.

[LSThiker]

Just as a source of information, here is the AR 670-1 and DA PAM 670-1 authorizing the wear:

The following list indicates the order of precedence, by category, when medals from two or more categories are worn
at the same time:
a. U.S. military decorations.
b. U.S. unit awards.
c. U.S. nonmilitary decorations.
d. U.S. service (campaign) medals, and service and training ribbons.
e. U.S. Merchant Marine awards.
f. U.S. nonmilitary unit awards.
g. Foreign military decorations.
h. Foreign unit awards.
i. Non-U.S. service awards.
j. State awards for ARNG Soldiers.

c. U.S. nonmilitary decorations. U.S. nonmilitary decorations authorized for wear on Army uniforms are listed below in order of precedence. This list is not all-inclusive. Personnel will wear other U.S. nonmilitary (Federal agency) decorations based upon date of receipt. If more than one decoration is awarded by the same agency, the decorations are worn in the order of precedence as established by the awarding agency. Personnel will not wear U.S. nonmilitary decorations that duplicate recognition for service or an act for which a military decoration has already been awarded. Awards given by a jurisdiction inferior to the Federal Government are not authorized for wear on the Army uniform,
except as specified in paragraph 22–5j.
(1) Presidential Medal of Freedom.
(2) Presidential Citizen's Medal.
(3) President's Award for Distinguished Federal Civilian Service Award.
(4) DoD Distinguished Civilian Service Award.
(5) Secretary of Defense Medal for the Defense of Freedom.
(6) Secretary of Defense Meritorious Civilian Service Award.
(7) Office of the Secretary of Defense Exceptional Civilian Service Award.
( Secretary Distinguished Service Award.
(9) National Intelligence Distinguished Service Medal.
(10) National Intelligence Superior Service Medal.
(11) National Intelligence Exceptional Achievement Medal.
(12) Surgeon General's Exemplary Service Medal.
(13) National Aeronautics and Space Administration Space Flight Medal.
(14) Public Health Service Commendation Medal.
(15) Public Health Service Achievement Medal.
(16) Department of State Distinguished Service Award.
(17) Department of State Distinguished Honor Award.
(18) Department of State Superior Honor Award.
(19) Department of State Meritorious Honor Award.
(20) Decoration for Exceptional Civilian Service.
(21) Meritorious Civilian Service Award.
(22) Superior Civilian Service Award.
(23) Commander's Award for Civilian Service.
(24) Achievement Medal for Civilian Service

[heliodoc]

Well with that list and the Col's iPERMs....maybe CAP could track all of former DoD types and soldiers and airman and award all these ribbons and awards and maybe make an Annex to 39-1 and explain it all....might settle these ribbon issues