The Oldest Plane in the USAF inventory?

[Smithsonia]

The oldest plane in the Air Force Inventory is often said to be the B-52. Huh - pikers
Is not the B-52. It is the Cessna family of 180-182 airplanes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessna_182  (entered inventory in 1956)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessna_180  (entered inventory in 1953)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_B-52_Stratofortress (entered inventory in 1955)

The difference between BUFF drivers and Skylane drivers? We are usually older than the planes we fly. 

[Eclipse]

Any way to figure out what the oldest physical airframe still flying is?

[spacecommand]

Well it's subjective depending on how you look at it.  "Oldest plane in USAF inventory"  by year the model was introduced, or by year the actual airplane flying was built.

How many 180s and 182s actually flying with CAP were built in 1953, 1956 vs. the number of existing B52's currently operating that were built between 1955-1962 (abiet with modern upgrades of course).

[Smithsonia]

All the BUFFs are Frankensteins. They've been rebuilt, rehabbed, upgraded, re-engined every year of their lives. The last one came off the line in like '62. That said, they all carry their original paperwork. So somebody's got to know sumthin' about the actual oldest one of the Five-Twos. But it isn't me. The oldest plane and the oldest model plane are 2 different things but since I stated it ambiguously - I go for C-182s. 

[Al Sayre]

Wouldn't the oldest in the inventory be the Wright Flyer at the Air Force Museum?  There are also a lot of aircraft on poles that are still in the inventory on bases around the country that are a lot older than the BUFF's...

[spacecommand]

If wikipedia is to believed, the 1909 Wright Military Flyer on display at the Air Force Museum is a reproduction made in 1955.

[Smithsonia]

^^^^^^^^^

Al good point.
Change to "oldest model in active inventory? That fixes that. The Navy keeps the USS Constitution (Ol' Ironsides) on the active rolls so they can take it to sea every few years. They don't do the same with the Wright Flyer, museum pieces, or gate guards - I believe they have all been decomissioned.

[PHall]

Oldest USAF aircraft currently flying today is probably a KC-135.  The oldest ones were the 1955 models. The newest were the 1964 models.

[bosshawk]

The Sq to which I belong thinks that it possesses the oldest C-206 in the CAP fleet and it is a 1972 model.  I have flown a number of 206's and it is the best flying one of the bunch.  In CAWG, I doubt that there is a 182 that is any older than 76.  Of course, technically, the CAP airplanes do not belong to the AF: they only paid for them.

[Al Sayre]

The U2 is also still flying, 1st one flew in '55.

[SarDragon]

The oldest specifically identifiable a/c in the FAA database, belonging to CAP, is a SCHWEIZER SGU 2-22C glider, from 1959, and the oldest Cessna is a 172 from1967. That's out of a list of 243 planes. Fourteen of them have no dates, including the 8 GA-8s.

[jimmydeanno]

So somebody's got to know sumthin' about the actual oldest one of the Five-Twos. But it isn't me.

My B-52 Maintenance buddy says that all of the B-52s that are currently active in the AF inventory are all H models, which rolled off the lines in 60 & 61.  However, he noted that NASA uses a D model out at Edwards for test flights.

[PHall]

So somebody's got to know sumthin' about the actual oldest one of the Five-Twos. But it isn't me.

My B-52 Maintenance buddy says that all of the B-52s that are currently active in the AF inventory are all H models, which rolled off the lines in 60 & 61.  However, he noted that NASA uses a D model out at Edwards for test flights.

NASA's B-52 is a B-52H, they just got it about 5 years ago after they retired the B-52B (52-0008) to their museum.
B-52D's were all retired in the early 80's.

[Smithsonia]

Does anybody know what the status of Bone Yarders is? In Tucson there must be 50 of them just catchin rays. Some of those are earlier models... but inactive, retired, decommissioned, and mothballed are differences that look the same from the outside. And, I am on the outside.

[PHall]

The U2 is also still flying, 1st one flew in '55.

Those "first generation" U-2's are long gone. The current U-2S and U-2T aircraft were  built in the 80's as U-2R's and TR-1's.
They have been modernized with GE F404 engines and "glass" cockpits.

[PHall]

Does anybody know what the status of Bone Yarders is? In Tucson there must be 50 of them just catchin rays. Some of those are earlier models... but inactive, retired, decommissioned, and mothballed are differences that look the same from the outside. And, I am on the outside.

Most of the B-52's in the "Bone Yard" have been scrapped to comply with the START I treaty.

[Smithsonia]

The golf course at Davis Monthan ran next to the bone yard. I once used a B52 to ricochet a ball back on to the fairway. I've always thought that is the toughest shot I ever made... the least duplicated in history... (how many guys use a real Bomber to avoid a drop) and likely a contributing factor to its obsolescence. (START 1 aside)

[sarmed1]

6th SOS at Hurlburt Field has (or at least had) a C-47 (tehcnically a Basler BT-67...turboprop upgrade); With the training foreign air forces mission they have crews trainined and qualified on operations and maintainence on the air frame (and many other non standard inventory aircraft).  I dont know the actual age of the aircraft; but I imagine that it has to be older than 1950....

mk

[flyboy53]

Interesting discussion, but not quite correct. If you're talking about operational inventory, I would guess the B-52. In terms of actual inventory, however, each museum piece or gate guard at the various Air Force museums or standing watch as a gate or building sentry is still in the Air Force inventory.

So, that means that there is an inventory, which I actually saw once, of every B-17, B-24, C-47, etc., on every base. These aircraft, though admittedly some would be a long stretch, are supposed to be maintained in a way that they can be made flyable/operational once again under an Air Force historical program.

So that means that the B-17 at Grissom AFB/ARB, was the last operational B-17 when it was removed from the flightline in 1968 as a weather recon bird. The last B-24, which by the way sits at the Lackland AFB parade field or "Bomb Run" as we used to call it, was the last operational B-24 when it was removed from flying status as a research aircraft in...1971.

It means that the Air Force maintains them as an inventory for spare parts. So the fuel lines and an internal bulkhead was removed from the Grissom bird for the Air Force Museum restoration of Sho, Sho, Sho, Baby at Dover AFB. When the Alaskan Air Command and Air Force Academy were still flying T-33s, many of the engine parts or other items actually came from the boneyard or aircraft on static display.

This also means that the three CAP aircraft at the Air Force Museum are actually in the Air Force Inventory. I wonder whose inventory the 0-1 at Maxwell is in...I suspect AF as well. Wouldn't it be a gas if some AT-6 or T-34, C-45, C-47 or B-25 sitting on some AFB was actually once a CAP aircraft. That would be an interesting project to research and I wonder if the base officials would consider remarking the aircraft in it's original CAP markings?

[sarmed1]

I think the discussion was leading toward operational aircraft.  It is important to remember too when discussing the "gate planes" not all of those were operational aircraft.  Some are parts assembled just for static purposes (I think the P-38 at Lackland for example is one of those "parts kits")
Same applies to the boneyard aircraft.  Some are kept in an "able to be returned to flyable status"; those are basically the ones you see with the white wrappings.  Others are there just as parts.  Not sure if "just parts" is still considered an aircraft in the inventory or not.

mk

[SarDragon]

For Navy a/c, if it's in the boneyard, or a "plane on a pole", or a gate guard, it's been stricken from the inventory, and is accounted for in a different manner than active a/c.

As for being flyable, I wouldn't trust anything that hasn't been given long term preservation. Pigeon poop does a real job causing corrosion on aluminum. I saw the remains of the F-8 and F-4 that used to be out in front of NAS Miramar, and you could stand under the wings, look up and see sky.

[sardak]

While this doesn't really answer the question, a study released last month by the Mitchell Institute for Air Studies provides some insight. The report sought to document the number of aircraft, by type, in the USAF active inventory from 1950 to 2009. The report provides some analysis, then lists the inventory by general categories of aircraft and finally by specific type for each year from FY50.

From the foreword:
This Mitchell Study presents a valuable new resource for research on airpower. Printed in the Appendix are tables of the United States Air Force aircraft inventory from 1950 through 2009. Before this, there was no single source for such extended data on the airpower inventory as it became a dominant element of US national security.

The "active inventory" which the report tried to capture is defined as "aircraft assigned to operating forces for mission, test, or maintenance. It includes primary, backup, and attrition reserve aircraft."

The authors note that this was not a trivial matter since the USAF has had almost 400 different types of aircraft in the inventory since 1950. Aircraft designators, categories, and how the Air Force tracked them have changed over the years.

As an example, the report shows the only active bombers in the inventory as of the end of FY09 are B-1, B-2 and B-52. The report can't tell how old the 52s are since that would require research by tail number.

Link to the report: http://www.afa.org/Mitchell/Reports/MS_TAI_1110.pdf

As for tail numbers, here is a site that tracks military aircraft by tail number (and BuNo for those of that persuasion) back to 1908. Of course to do this, it also explains how to decipher tail numbers.
http://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_serials/usafserials.html

Mike

[flyboy53]

I know I may be taking this string away from it's original intent, but I'm also curious sometimes over what seems hidden at different bases. Years ago, when I was stationed at Elmendorf AFB, the munitions squadron had a Ford-built V-1 on a pedestal in front of their armory/bunkers on the back side of the base.

[4fhoward]

I found this page while poking around.  It's from "U.S. Air Force Live"
http://airforcelive.dodlive.mil/index.php/2008/11/oldest-operating-aircraft-in-the-air-force-inventory-retires-to-museum/

It is a really funny looking plane.

It's not the answer to the question.

[jeders]

I know I may be taking this string away from it's original intent, but I'm also curious sometimes over what seems hidden at different bases. Years ago, when I was stationed at Elmendorf AFB, the munitions squadron had a Ford-built V-1 on a pedestal in front of their armory/bunkers on the back side of the base.

Get on Google Earth and use the time lapse function while you're looking at Dyess AFB. A few years ago there was a plane sitting by the front gate, and now it's been replaced by a B-1. Then if you look a few hundreds yards to the NW in the woods, you will see that plane.

[AirDX]

The oldest one I persnally know of with the lowest serial for its year is a '57 KC-135.  It's been upgraded to a Block 40.2 R-model, hardly a stock '57!

[Defender]

*playing devil's advocate*

We could always create a new mix here:  The aircraft that certainly aren't the oldest in years, but have an enormous amount of flight hours per airframe, often exceeding the aircraft they were designed to replace.   hmmm, take the C-17 for example, and our current opstempo around our various ao's on the world. 

I know, serious hijacking of thread...but hey, it sounded cool to me!!