Change Cadet chevrons to sleve patches?

[zonaman]

 Does any one think the cadets should have there rank chevrons on there sleeve, like they  used to?

If we are the Air Force Auxiliary, the uniforms should be similar  to the AF ( like the other military branch auxiliaries). The air Force does not have NCO ranks on their lapels, only on the arm sleeves. Maby I'm old school but if it 'ant broke don't fix it or change it. Why did we change to cadet ranks on the lapel anyway? I hope some of you Will know. I'm not trying to start an argument or a drive by post. Just wanting to know. Thanks.

[Bayareaflyer 44]

If you were a fast-track cadet that was getting promoted every 2 months, would you want to remove and re-sew your chevrons that often?  No, you wouldn't...

[lordmonar]

Having said that....the idea of developing stripes that pinned on AND looked good would not be too out of line.

Granted those two requirments my be mutually exclusive. 

[A.Member]

Don't know why it was changed (didn't know that they were ever worn on sleeves) but I suspect it has to do with the following:

1.  Cost - cadet doesn't need to visit the tailor with each promotion.  Pins also make for easier corrections if done incorrectly.

2.  Doesn't destroy clothing - repeatedly sewing and unsewing patches is hard on clothing, especially service coats and can look real bad if done poorly.   Given that many uniform items are recycled, this can be problematic.


I see no issue with rank being worn on lapels.   Like you said, if ain't broke, don't fix it.

[Bayareaflyer 44]

Having said that....the idea of developing stripes that pinned on AND looked good would not be too out of line.

Granted those two requirments my be mutually exclusive. 

Perhaps not stripes that pin on the sleeves (that would hurt if you pop a clutch-back!), but rather used Velcro.  That would be more in keeping with the Air Force uniform guidelines, as well as facilitate the often seen rapid grade succession in the cadet program.
But I'm still thinking that embroidered patches are going to be a heck of a lot more $ than the metal stripes, and getting uniform shirts that already have the soft side of the Velcro attached in just the right spot may be a long time in coming.

[SarDragon]

I wore sew-on stripes WIWAC. While the promotion cycles were a bit longer than currently, it was still a major PITA to change them. You don't want to go there, for all the reasons stated above.

[Eclipse]

Does any one think the cadets should have there rank chevrons on there sleeve, like they  used to?

No.

[SarDragon]

Having said that....the idea of developing stripes that pinned on AND looked good would not be too out of line.

Granted those two requirments my be mutually exclusive. 

Perhaps not stripes that pin on the sleeves (that would hurt if you pop a clutch-back!), but rather used Velcro.  That would be more in keeping with the Air Force uniform guidelines, as well as facilitate the often seen rapid grade succession in the cadet program.
But I'm still thinking that embroidered patches are going to be a heck of a lot more $ than the metal stripes, and getting uniform shirts that already have the soft side of the Velcro attached in just the right spot may be a long time in coming.

Velcro on dress uniforms? YGBSM!

Velcro rank attachment on BDUs? Why? It makes the basic uniform more expensive, and introduces another error point when preparing a uniform for wear.

Another consideration against cloth rank is the fact that it wears out, making it less able to pass them on to newer cadets.

[vento]

Circa 1975. Lots of sewing, specially difficult with the long sleeve shirts. The current pin is a much better option IMHO.

[Mustang]

Does any one think the cadets should have there rank chevrons on there sleeve, like they  used to?

Ask anyone who was a cadet back then if this is a good idea.  They'll tell you NO.

[SarDragon]

Circa 1975. Lots of sewing, specially difficult with the long sleeve shirts. The current pin is a much better option IMHO.

FWIW, the guy on this end has his sewn on too low. Should be centered. Pretty hard to fix at the event. Pin-on stuff can be repositioned very quickly, and is easier to place properly initially.

[MIKE]

IMO, the old style white on blue cloth insignia above would be kinda cool if it were Velcro backed and worn on an ACU-style uniform at center mass.  Cue Stonewall to post a pic of his OD TRU with CAP insignia. 

The RCAC and ATC wear their cadet insignia on a sleeve similar to as worn on the Gore-Tex parka, on their combat uniforms.  IIRC they also tend toward epaulet sleeves on the light blue shirts as well, at least for cadet NCOs.

[DakRadz]

Sewing anything on a dress uniform (without a paycheck and a clothing allowance to offset the cost, which AD has) is a no go. I speak as a current, active cadet (who just returned from a meeting )- things get expensive, but I could absolutely not deal with having to replace my service coat.

Yeah, cadet officers pretty much put their coats out of commission, but by the time replacing the coat is a problem, they should have a job (i.e. turning Senior).

Not a good idea. Oh, and AFJROTC, which is run by the USAF and retired AF, uses pin on collar stripes. They don't want to keep in line with the service, they want to keep uniform costs down.

[zonaman]

Ok! it seems that every one agrees with no cadet rank on the sleeves. You all made VERY valid points, and like I said "if it ant broke don't fix it". Looks like pinons are the best way to go. Thanks everybody. !! 

[JC004]

As has been said, it ain't broke 'cuz cadets get promoted quickly.  We don't need people putting out more money and we don't need more room for patches to be sewn on all jacked up.  Metal insignia jacked up?  Remove, re-pin - fixed.  There are many more ways that we can become closer with the Air Force - primarily through operations and not more uniform changes.

[AlphaSigOU]

Cloth cadet grade insignia? Not no way, not no how! (I got in as a cadink when they introduced pin-on grade on the collar.) In the olden days the AFJROTC/AFROTC had pin-on cloth grade insignia but it's been retired.

[ZigZag911]

Been there, done that...let's not!

[PhoenixRisen]

I used to think that'd be a cool idea, but after becoming a cadet officer, I've since done a 180 on that.  Keep in mind, that I've only had to put three different ranks on my uniform (just got my Earhart), and have had to do so every 4-6 months...  Imagine what it would be like (as already mentioned) for a fast-track cadet airman / NCO doin' that every two months.

(Not to mention, I think the old cadet cheverons look hideous...  YMMV on that one.)

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

The RCAC and ATC wear their cadet insignia on a sleeve similar to as worn on the Gore-Tex parka, on their combat uniforms.  IIRC they also tend toward epaulet sleeves on the light blue shirts as well, at least for cadet NCOs.

http://www.cadets.ca/WorkArea/linkit.aspx?LinkIdentifier=id&ItemID=57075

I've seen the RCAirC on several occasions, and they're almost always very squared-away.

They wear large-size chevrons (identical to the RCAF) on their blue service dress (looks kind of like an Ike jacket but a little longer) and blue shoulder rank slides.

[RVT]

I used to think that'd be a cool idea, but after becoming a cadet officer, I've since done a 180 on that.  Keep in mind, that I've only had to put three different ranks on my uniform (just got my Earhart), and have had to do so every 4-6 months...  Imagine what it would be like (as already mentioned) for a fast-track cadet airman / NCO doin' that every two months.(Not to mention, I think the old cadet chevrons look hideous...  YMMV on that one.)

I was a cadet from 1974-1976.  By the time I made officer my uniforms looked like crap.  For a professional active duty NCO who is swapping out chevrons for larger ones, and a lot less often, its ok.  But when I started wearing the "Golden Pip" my sleeves didn't look so hot.  Despite all that though, I'm glad I wore sleeve rank, it looked better.  But probably not a good thing to inflict on cadets.

[HGjunkie]

Then there's the cadets who can't afford a tailor and cant sew either... i've seen some jacked-up hot glue jobs.

[Al Sayre]

As a former cadet in the 70's I can tell you that the pin on rank was a godsend.  I remember sewing and resewing my rank for encampment only to have some C/2d Lt with a ruler tell me how much I resembled a soup sandwich.  I would recommend doing away with grade for Cadets below C/2d Lt before I recommended sew on rank for them, it actually made some people avoid promotion just so they wouldn't have to re-sew all of their uniforms (most cadets in my squadrons had at least 2 sets of fatigues and many had 4, 2 short sleeve and 2 long sleeve, plus a short sleeve and long sleeve blue shirt).