So, seeing as we have some new heraldry guidance; it might encourage more units to go through the effort of comming up with quality work if they had a uniform other than the ABU/BBDU to display it on.
My thoughts. Follow the USAF by wearing the wing patch in place of the American flag and place the unit patch where wing patches are currently on CAP uniforms. This would also increase consistency across field/utility uniforms as wing patches are already worn on the left sleeve with ABU/BBDU.
I've nothing against the American flag of course, but if we are going to put the effort into regulating unit patches now, may as well have a few options in wearing them.
Quote from: biomed441 on February 01, 2021, 10:31:15 PMSo, seeing as we have some new heraldry guidance; it might encourage more units to go through the effort of comming up with quality work if they had a uniform other than the ABU/BBDU to display it on.
My thoughts. Follow the USAF by wearing the wing patch in place of the American flag and place the unit patch where wing patches are currently on CAP uniforms. This would also increase consistency across field/utility uniforms as wing patches are already worn on the left sleeve with ABU/BBDU.
I've nothing against the American flag of course, but if we are going to put the effort into regulating unit patches now, may as well have a few options in wearing them.
But some Air Force MAJCOM's wear the flag on the flight suit (AMC, AFMC) and some don't (ACC, AFGSC).
So which one should we follow?
While at it, authorize the two-piece flight suit.
Quote from: TheSkyHornet on February 01, 2021, 10:41:07 PMWhile at it, authorize the two-piece flight suit.
I was actually discussing this with a female aircrew member earlier after we all hit a restroom break. 1pc flight suits don't have nearly as much utility for those types of things, and of course we don't have to worry about ejection so they could be feasible.
I feel that if we did allow unit patches on flight suits (of course approved heraldry and not some wild patch) then it could boost morale / esprit de corps. IMO we've taken a very lax approach to heraldry and history of our units and we should seriously consider using them as a piece of the puzzle to bring folks closer.
Quote from: Okayish Aviator on February 01, 2021, 11:20:14 PMQuote from: TheSkyHornet on February 01, 2021, 10:41:07 PMWhile at it, authorize the two-piece flight suit.
I was actually discussing this with a female aircrew member earlier after we all hit a restroom break. 1pc flight suits don't have nearly as much utility for those types of things, and of course we don't have to worry about ejection so they could be feasible.
I feel that if we did allow unit patches on flight suits (of course approved heraldry and not some wild patch) then it could boost morale / esprit de corps. IMO we've taken a very lax approach to heraldry and history of our units and we should seriously consider using them as a piece of the puzzle to bring folks closer.
The two piece flight suit used in the Air Force is the same one used by the Army, OCP camouflage pattern.
Anybody want to bet on the chances of getting that approved?
Losing the flight suit altogether would be a better choice.
Quote from: Okayish Aviator on February 01, 2021, 11:20:14 PMI feel that if we did allow unit patches on flight suits (of course approved heraldry and not some wild patch) then it could boost morale / esprit de corps. ..... to bring folks closer.
If a successful mission and job well done doesn't bring about those 'feelings', I'm not sure a little cloth patch will do the trick.
Quote from: Okayish Aviator on February 01, 2021, 11:20:14 PMQuote from: TheSkyHornet on February 01, 2021, 10:41:07 PMWhile at it, authorize the two-piece flight suit.
I feel that if we did allow unit patches on flight suits (of course approved heraldry and not some wild patch) then it could boost morale / esprit de corps. IMO we've taken a very lax approach to heraldry and history of our units and we should seriously consider using them as a piece of the puzzle to bring folks closer.
I seriously laughed out loud when I read this. Your optimism is refreshing.
Quote from: PHall on February 01, 2021, 10:39:27 PMBut some Air Force MAJCOM's wear the flag on the flight suit (AMC, AFMC) and some don't (ACC, AFGSC).
So which one should we follow?
I would say ACC considering the association CAP has with that MAJCOM now.
Quote from: etodd on February 02, 2021, 02:48:07 AMQuote from: Okayish Aviator on February 01, 2021, 11:20:14 PMI feel that if we did allow unit patches on flight suits (of course approved heraldry and not some wild patch) then it could boost morale / esprit de corps. ..... to bring folks closer.
If a successful mission and job well done doesn't bring about those 'feelings', I'm not sure a little cloth patch will do the trick.
Morale can come from more than 1 place and i would argue it should. Nothing wrong with having a bit of unit pride and a way to show it off. I mean, unless you hate your unit... but thats a different discussion. And on that same coin, I agree that a unit patch shouldn't be your only source of morale.
Quote from: Eclipse on February 02, 2021, 01:14:42 AMLosing the flight suit altogether would be a better choice.
I disagree. Blue or green, it is mission relevant. Mission esential? Probably not. Can everything we do be done in a polo? Just about. But thats a horse long been beaten on here.
The issue with you proposal, is not that it is a good or bad idea, but rather it takes getting USAF approval. Flight suits are one of the items, that are not allowed to be supplemented and the regulation have a very specific list of patches that can be worn.
I'm not suggesting we institute a uniform change without Air Force approval; just getting a general consensus on if it would be a welcomed change within the membership, and if so perhaps a proposal be drafted to be reviewed by the uniform committee.
Quote from: biomed441 on February 02, 2021, 05:03:40 PMI'm not suggesting we institute a uniform change without Air Force approval; just getting a general consensus on if it would be a welcomed change within the membership, and if so perhaps a proposal be drafted to be reviewed by the uniform committee.
If you really think your idea is a good idea then write up a uniform change proposal and send it up the chain.
Quote from: Eclipse on February 02, 2021, 01:14:42 AMLosing the flight suit altogether would be a better choice.
I prefer the 5-6 extra seconds of flash protection in the event of a fire, also they are comfy sooooo... no.
Quote from: PHall on February 02, 2021, 08:06:54 PMQuote from: biomed441 on February 02, 2021, 05:03:40 PMI'm not suggesting we institute a uniform change without Air Force approval; just getting a general consensus on if it would be a welcomed change within the membership, and if so perhaps a proposal be drafted to be reviewed by the uniform committee.
If you really think your idea is a good idea then write up a uniform change proposal and send it up the chain.
I mean...I like the idea but its definietly not the greatest thing since sliced bread. if I felt I got enough of a positive response to warrant submitting the idea sure... I typically like to discuss and gauge ideas before just impulsively submitting every random idea I have. After all, this is a discussion board, which is why I brought up the idea... to discuss. Assuming its not been discussed before...
I have noticed a trend on here though that discussing things on this discussion board seems to be frowned upon.
Quote from: biomed441 on February 03, 2021, 02:16:53 AMQuote from: PHall on February 02, 2021, 08:06:54 PMQuote from: biomed441 on February 02, 2021, 05:03:40 PMI'm not suggesting we institute a uniform change without Air Force approval; just getting a general consensus on if it would be a welcomed change within the membership, and if so perhaps a proposal be drafted to be reviewed by the uniform committee.
If you really think your idea is a good idea then write up a uniform change proposal and send it up the chain.
I mean...I like the idea but its definietly not the greatest thing since sliced bread. if I felt I got enough of a positive response to warrant submitting the idea sure... I typically like to discuss and gauge ideas before just impulsively submitting every random idea I have. After all, this is a discussion board, which is why I brought up the idea... to discuss. Assuming its not been discussed before...
I have noticed a trend on here though that discussing things on this discussion board seems to be frowned upon.
The very reason I suggested you to write up your proposal and submit it.
"I have noticed a trend on here though that discussing things on this discussion board seems to be frowned upon."
As always, there are a few that spoil it for everyone else
My data is a bit old, like me. But when I was in the USAF/ANG in the early 80s and in TAC, we wore our unit patch on the right sleeve. Either Squadron or Group or Wing, depending on where you were actually assigned. The left sleeve was optional, but was normally related to the aircraft you flew. We had a unit aircraft patch we wore, but a couple of guys who had attended Fighter Weapons School wore that patch on the left.
They did standardize on a round or shield shaped patch of a certain size for each, and that the velcro sewn to the flight suite was to be a square or rectangle. The stated reason was is you went down, you were to remove your unit patches. And then the enemy could not compare the shape of the non-sun bleached shape to an assortment of patches that they had found.
Personally, being new to CAP (for the 3rd time), what comes to mind would be a Wing patch on the right and a Squadron patch on the left. 1) Esprit de corps, 2) I can tell at a glance where you are from when I meet you. :D
You can wear unit patches on the Corporate Flight Uniform right shoulder, just not on the USAF Style.
For a quick answer to your specific situation - the American flag goes on the left sleeve, and no other. There is a variety of permitted patches on the right sleeve, but consult any supplements your wing may have issued regarding specific patches on the flight suit.
CAPR 39-1, CIVIL AIR PATROL UNIFORM REGULATION, has a handy-dandy chart defining what patches/insignia/bling you can wear on each uniform combination and where to wear it. It's attachment 4, starting on page 125.
Since you've been away, I strongly recommend that you thoroughly read the reg, and get familiar with the new material. There have been a lot of changes in the last few years - too many to go over here.
Quote from: SarDragon on October 06, 2021, 09:30:25 PMCAPR 39-1, CIVIL AIR PATROL UNIFORM REGULATION, has a handy-dandy chart defining what patches/insignia/bling you can wear on each uniform combination and where to wear it. It's attachment 4, starting on page 125.
Since you've been away, I strongly recommend that you thoroughly read the reg, and get familiar with the new material. There have been a lot of changes in the last few years - too many to go over here.
... and of course, stop number one in that reg would be to check the height/weight table and grooming section, before purchasing any USAF style uniforms (or wearing any old ones). You don't want to waste your time, right.
V/r
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There is a sage green two piece that we wear in the Navy (most helo bubbas). Concept of being able to remove the top is nice but would still have a pesky belt digging into you. At that point for the cost I'd rather wear the polo.
Rather then a 2-piece adult onesie, sundowning flight suits across the board
would be a better choice.
Quote from: Eclipse on October 07, 2021, 03:28:27 AMRather then a 2-piece adult onesie, sundowning flight suits across the board
would be a better choice.
Agree. About 6 years now and nearly 350 hours in CAP planes ... wearing nothing but the polo, gray slacks, and some nice comfy black shoes. Never owned a flight suit.
I agree that the flight suit in GA isn't ideal or that comfortable. I think it offers a more militarized appearance in certain instances. I'd agree in nearly all times I'm cap flying it's the polo.