I saw someone whose posts include a picture of the CAP propeller logo with a red cross-out circle over it, and the wording "Kill The Triangle Thingy." Is there some sort of movement within the CAP to abolish the very symbol of the organization? The Civil Air Patrol has used small planes -- Pipers, Cessnas, Beechcrafts -- since it was founded in 1941. They are still the standard mode of transportation, and the "triangle thingy," representing a three-blade air propeller, symbolizes a proud tradition and heritage. I think it would be a terrible idea to get rid of it. What do they propose as a replacement?
Before you get upset, you should understand the context.
Quote from: MIKE on June 22, 2014, 10:40:53 PM
Before you get upset, you should understand the context.
And that context is...?
The three-sided CAP "tri-prop" is a 70+ year old symbol of the organization.
Tri-prop = Good
However, the "triangle thingy" is not the tri-prop. Its a triangle with more crap hung around it.
Which seems (thankfully) to have gone by the wayside in the last 2 years.
Quote from: NIN on June 22, 2014, 11:10:13 PM
The three-sided CAP "tri-prop" is a 70+ year old symbol of the organization.
Tri-prop = Good
However, the "triangle thingy" is not the tri-prop. Its a triangle with more crap hung around it.
Which seems (thankfully) to have gone by the wayside in the last 2 years.
Thank you, sir. I was concerned, since the only thing that was visible in the graphic in question was the tri-prop. That would be like removing the anchors from USN insignia.
Quote from: SemperVig on June 22, 2014, 11:37:59 PM
since the only thing that was visible in the graphic in question was the tri-prop.
Here is the TT without the red line:
(http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/Above_beyond_89AA085B894BE.jpg)
SemperVig, search is your friend. There was a multi-page thread about this about 2 years ago.
Which reminds me, now that the triangle thingy is dead, I should probably go ahead and take that off my sig.
The original CAP insignia, top row, right:
(http://www.fortmissoulamuseum.org/WWII/images/posters/1986.004.020.jpg)
It later became known as the "CAP Emblem":
(http://www.angelfire.com/crazy/cruzmikey/_borders/capemblem.jpg)
And was specified in regulation for a good many decades.
The triangle thingy v1.0 was dropped, and triangle thingy v2.0 was adopted:
(http://members.gocivilairpatrol.com/media/cms/CAP_Triangle_Logo_w_text__rgb_337F9E0D99EAB.jpg)
And, the aforementioned "CAP Emblem", cherished and displayed proudly by the membership for many, many years, was deprecated/dropped which was a terrible decision. Oh, and TPTB 'adopted' the 'Command Emblem' whatever that's supposed to be so we have three 'official images'.
It's interesting the "Summary of Changes" to 900-2 fully sanitizes the deletion of the 'CAP Emblem'.:
QuoteSUMMARY OF CHANGES.
The revised CAPR 900-2 includes the use of the Civil Air Patrol logo and Civil Air Patrol command emblem (Section A). Removes general information on the Air Force "Hap Arnold" symbol and rescinds the use of the Air Force "Hap Arnold" symbol cradled with CAP organizational emblems. Note: Shaded areas identify new or revised material.
http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/R900_002_8A8354F4FD7C3.pdf (http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/R900_002_8A8354F4FD7C3.pdf)
..and it still borderline sucks. No where ever before did we have a prop with just a triangle. It had the circle around it, giving it a roundel feel.
TTT was a product of someone being creative at NHQ, and then they 'liked' it. The worse was when they changed it on the cover of the magazine, so it gave the appearance of reading "Valunteer" as the title.
The latest version reflects the minimalist aesthetic that is currently in vogue - it follows the flattening
of user interfaces coupled with the (feigned) disdain for skeuomorphism started by Apple and followed by Google and Microsoft, then basically the
rest of the design world.
It's better then the TTT, though wholly unnecessary. Successful programs which enrich people's
lives and make them feel better about themselves don't need to have their indices "refreashed"
because those involved are too busy and fulfilled to care about it enough to want to change it,
not to mention they want to maintain the continuity of timeless designs.
Struggling programs and products that need to constantly compete for eyeshare and attention so.
The little "R" hacks me off because of the loud indication of the commercial nature of the insignia (you'll note you don't see that on military or older CAP insignia),
but it is what it is - so many beautiful logos out there ruined by that "R".
Not being critical of your post.
However I think that the little R is an attempt to get companies like Old Navy to use CAP symbols on their clothing just like they use insignias of the Second World War.
How would you protect our symbols, then, from commercial exploitation?
^ I would protect them via public law, as the military's are today, instead of trademark or copyright.
Those never expire.
Much of CAP's IP is protected exactly that way.
Quote from: Eclipse on June 24, 2014, 03:06:30 PM
^ I would protect them via public law, as the military's are today, instead of trademark or copyright.
Those never expire.
Unless some petty bureaucrat decides that it "offends" somebody somewhere.
Quote from: a2capt on June 23, 2014, 10:41:21 PM
..and it still borderline sucks. No where ever before did we have a prop with just a triangle.
Well, that's true on a national level, but I came up with a prop and triangle design nearly identical to the new logo for use on encampment t-shirts back in 1990.
Quote from: SemperVig on June 22, 2014, 10:32:08 PM
I saw someone whose posts include a picture of the CAP propeller logo with a red cross-out circle over it, and the wording "Kill The Triangle Thingy." Is there some sort of movement within the CAP to abolish the very symbol of the organization? The Civil Air Patrol has used small planes -- Pipers, Cessnas, Beechcrafts -- since it was founded in 1941. They are still the standard mode of transportation, and the "triangle thingy," representing a three-blade air propeller, symbolizes a proud tradition and heritage. I think it would be a terrible idea to get rid of it. What do they propose as a replacement?
Well maybe
take it as a joke. some people have ridiculously weird senses of humor.
Quote from: Eclipse on June 24, 2014, 03:06:30 PM
^ I would protect them via public law, as the military's are today, instead of trademark or copyright.
Those never expire.
Neither do trademarks.
Copyrights expire, but not for a long time.
Trademarks may be considered abandoned through non-use, though.
And finally......even with federal law it would take someone who cares to prosecute.
I bet a lot of people out there using USAF insignia on coffee mugs and other things with out permission.
Quote from: lordmonar on June 30, 2014, 04:25:54 AM
And finally......even with federal law it would take someone who cares to prosecute.
I bet a lot of people out there using USAF insignia on coffee mugs and other things with out permission.
You mean like this?
http://www.cafepress.com/+u.s.-air-force+gifts (http://www.cafepress.com/+u.s.-air-force+gifts)
Quote from: SarDragon on June 30, 2014, 04:20:23 AM
Trademarks may be considered abandoned through non-use, though.
Which is fine...if you're not using it, no need to protect it.
I just don't see a need for a special public law to protect CAP's marks, when the Lanham Act does exactly the same thing already.
Now, for the USAF, that's a different matter. As a government entity, they generally don't receive intellectual property rights in their marks and such. CAP's not a government entity however.