testing problems

[c/LTCOLorbust]

Hello all,
I am the Cadet Commander at my Squadron and I have been having a hard time with our testing officer telling a Cadet if the past or not in front of a lot of other cadets and senior members.  I feel that because the tests are under lock and key that so should the past or fail, I feel that this should be between the testing officer and the cadet and no one else.
Am I wrong in thinking this and am I just looking at it to sericely? Or is this real problem. Is there a reg on it or is it untraveled space? Please let me know.

[SarDragon]

I think scores, for the most part, should remain private. Pass or fail status is more negotiable, since if it's announced that Joe and Jane passed the test, but Pete and Patty took the test and didn't get announced, then it's pretty obvious that they failed.

[Pylon]

In the last unit I was in, on testing nights a list of those who took exams was posted on the bulletein board by the end of the meeting.  It would have the "pass" or "fail" column checked after their name and that was it.  No scores.

Granted, yes, it's a bit embarassing to see your name up there with the fail checkmark next to it.  However, in larger units, it's much less of a burden on the staff to have to find each testing cadet and inform them of their results each time.

As for posting the scores, I would say it's not necessary.  The cadet only needs to know if they passed or failed, and if they failed they should see someone about mentoring and finding out what to work on. 

Knowing their score up-front won't help them -- either way, if they've failed, they need to see someone about the test (ideally).  If they've passed, they don't really need to know their score either -- they're done with it.

There is nothing in the regulations about posting of test scores.

[Chris Jacobs]

The only really announcement that our squadron gives is who did really good on their tests.  we call it the "high 90" category.   

our testing officer will most the time comment on how many cadets tested that night and on average how the group did.  so if every one failed that night he may say that we need to study more before coming up.  if it was a mix of pass and fails he just says that we had a good night testing.  although if there are cadets that get a high 90% or better then they will announce that cadet as doing an exceptional job.

[Greg]

Granted, yes, it's a bit embarassing to see your name up there with the fail checkmark next to it.  However, in larger units, it's much less of a burden on the staff to have to find each testing cadet and inform them of their results each time.

That, and it does provide a little more motivation to pass next time.  Not that I advocate public humiliation to get results out of your cadets, but I sure remember what it felt like to see the "F" next to my name on the testing sheet.

[capchiro]

In the past, we posted the passing/failing list using CAP ID numbers instead of names.  We now just tell each cadet how they did when we grade them.  It is done privately, but they turn right around and announce it to the whole group whether they failed or passed.  With this generation, it appears that not much embarrasses them.

[flyguy06]

This is a prime examle of what I am talking about. Procedures such as that are best left up to the SENIOR MEMBER leadership. Cadets should not concern themselves withthat. If they do have a issue with it, they should take it to the Dep for cadets. Its up to him how he runs his cadet program.

[John Bryan]

C/2d Lt. Bergland,

First, I think you should change your name to "C/COL or bust".

CAPR 52-10 says:
Hazing is defined as any conduct whereby someone causes another to suffer or to be exposed to any activity that is cruel, abusive, humiliating, oppressive, demeaning, or harmful.

I think the key here is "humiliating"....if you or the other cadets feel humiliated by the way the results are being annouced the regulations give you ways to address these concerns. I would start by going to your chain of command, but if they are part of the problem CAP does have an independent Inspector General system for that reason.

With all the kindness and respect in the world, I do not agree with the last poster......"Its up to him how he runs his cadet program." NO commander or deputy commander can run a program in violation of the regulations.

Also we are not owners of CAP , but rather stewards......never forget this as you grow as a leader.

[A1Steaksauce]

Well, I don't know about y'all, but at my squadron, on testing nights at the end of the meeting the commander gives his debrief and then reads the names of the cadets who passed and asks them to stand. If there are any especially high scores or special achievements (i.e. Mitchell Award) he makes sure that they are noted. This way there is no telling of low scores and anyone who didn't pass knows along with everybody else. I believe that you shouldn't be ashamed of any score you get but if it is lower than you like, STUDY........ that's all I've got to say.......

[mikeylikey]

I agree with the motivation part of letting everyone know who passed or failed.  Honestly, are these tests really that difficult?  In my experience and watching others, some cadets skim the material, or read it the day of testing and expect to pass.  I believe this happens in at least every squadron.  Is it that big of a surprise when a cadet fails a test, usually no surprise for the cadet.  Anyway, getting back to the real discussion, won't everyone know which cadets passed their tests, either PT, Aerospace or Leadership when promotion night roles around??

[BlackKnight]

I use SIMS (Squadron Information Mgmt System) in my squadron to help manage our cadet program.  After an academic or PT test night I enter all the scores in SIMS and print out fresh reports and post them in color on the cadet bulletin board for all to see.  The SIMS reports show numerical test scores: the good  :clap:, the bad  , and the really ugly  !   At the next meeting the cadets rush to the bulletin board to see where they stand promotability-wise in relation to their peers.  The cadet officers and NCOs make note of low scores and target those cadets for extra mentoring help. We've been doing it this way for the last two years without a single complaint from cadets or parents.   

The cadets seem to like seeing everything laid out in black and white.  Because all the scores are published and we test twice a month it's clear that no particular individual is being targeted for ridicule. C.A.P. is one of the few places teens can count on adults to give them the real deal and not sugarcoat everything.

[flyguy06]

C/2d Lt. Bergland,

First, I think you should change your name to "C/COL or bust".

CAPR 52-10 says:
Hazing is defined as any conduct whereby someone causes another to suffer or to be exposed to any activity that is cruel, abusive, humiliating, oppressive, demeaning, or harmful.

I think the key here is "humiliating"....if you or the other cadets feel humiliated by the way the results are being annouced the regulations give you ways to address these concerns. I would start by going to your chain of command, but if they are part of the problem CAP does have an independent Inspector General system for that reason.

With all the kindness and respect in the world, I do not agree with the last poster......"Its up to him how he runs his cadet program." NO commander or deputy commander can run a program in violation of the regulations.

Also we are not owners of CAP , but rather stewards......never forget this as you grow as a leader.

I never suggested a Commander run his or her program in violation of CAP regulations and policies. Imerely meant that The senior members should run their programs. And they do in differantly while in compliance with CAP regs. What works for a Squadron of 40 cadets may not work for a Squadron of 6 cadets.

We as leaders are stewrats of CAP, but we must also be leaders. Leaders make sound and timely decisions. Leaders lead by example. we must do this at all times and never waiver.

[Al Sayre]

We as leaders are stewrats of CAP, but we must also be leaders. Leaders make sound and timely decisions. Leaders lead by example. we must do this at all times and never waiver.

While it may be a typo, it somehow seems apropos; The Stewrats of CAP