Leather A2 Flight Jacket

[Hotel 179]

Good Morning, All.

Based upon a recommendation I ordered the black A2 from Pop's Leather (www.popsleather.com).  The order hit the web site on 15 December and the jacket was on my doorstep in the afternoon of 20 December.

The ordering was simple, but you'll need someone to assist you with the measuring process.  I chose the goatskin leather from a traditional standpoint.  Several options are available on the jacket, i.e. inside pockets, velcro for patches, original style neck closure hook, etc..

A nice leather patch inside the jacket reads, "Custom made for _________".  The quality and fit is very high.  I'm a leather jacket junkie and this one is very nice.  Base price was $180, options add a few dollars and shipping from Turkey via DHL was $32.

Fly safe,

Stephen

[Psicorp]

Congrats, Sir!

From everything I've heard, Pops Leather does great work.

[mikeylikey]

It realy is not that bad of a jacket, and the fit is great!

[Joe Baker]

Cool!  [My budget only allowed my to get a used A2 on Ebay, but its still awesome]

[bosshawk]

Somewhere: either on this blog or on the Portal, we beat this subject to death.  But, here goes my $.02 worth.  I have one of the black leather A-2s from Airborne Leathers, which I got for $109 plus shipping.  I see them advertised now for $118 plus shipping.  I wear mine every week and it is a great jacket.  Several of the guys from my previous Sq have them and like them equally well.

[Psicorp]

Cool!  [My budget only allowed my to get a used A2 on Ebay, but its still awesome]

Don't diss the Ebay.  I picked up a black leather A-2 for $40 (including shipping) on Ebay last year and then picked up a practically new Mess Dress for about the same amount.  When you start to tally up all the expenses incurred for CAP membership, being frugal where you can only makes sense.

[O-Rex]

There's a gal who is former USAF who works with me in my "day job" who was stationed Incirlik.  She had a leather trenchcoat from Pop's Leather, and the quality was impressive.

It's funny that over there, Goat is cheaper than Cow: it's just the opposite here.

I've asked the whole family to chip in for one single gift for next b-day/christmas: as usual, I expect the after-shave and socks, and I'll go buy it myself with stashed "mad-money."  (Doesn't everyone have a secret CAP-fund?? )

Hotel 179: I went to Pop's website, and the details of ordering the jacket with velcro for the MACOM patch was unclear: please specify size (?)

Please be so kind as to walk us through the 'options' part of the ordering process so that we can slap on patches the day it arrives....

Thanks!

[Major_Chuck]

I picked up a brown A2 Leather jacket on clearance at Target a couple of years ago for about $50.00, marked down from $120.00.

For the record I don't wear it with the TPU or AF style uniforms.  I do however wear it with the White/Grey aviator combo.

[Major_Chuck]

Somewhere: either on this blog or on the Portal, we beat this subject to death.  But, here goes my $.02 worth.  I have one of the black leather A-2s from Airborne Leathers, which I got for $109 plus shipping.  I see them advertised now for $118 plus shipping.  I wear mine every week and it is a great jacket.  Several of the guys from my previous Sq have them and like them equally well.

What are you talking about Colonel...we beat every subject to death around here.   

[bosshawk]

Roger that, Chuck.  I usually stay out of the uniform discussions, but slip once in awhile.  34 years of Army uniforms of one sort or another has made me slightly jaded about the subject.

[ColonelJack]

So, Colonel, what's your opinion of the Army's decision to do away with the service green uniform entirely and go back to blues?

Jack

[AlphaSigOU]

Hotel 179: I went to Pop's website, and the details of ordering the jacket with velcro for the MACOM patch was unclear: please specify size (?)

The CAP MAJCOM-style patch is 3" top to tip. However, the patches for the leather jacket also include a leather border. Which is not available - yet. (You gotta be current or former Army... only they use the 'MACOM' acronym.  )

[bosshawk]

Colonel Jack: can't say that I really care for it.  I had blues, wore them when I had to and quickly put them away for another special occasion.  To wear them every day would not be my cup of tea: too much like John Wayne in the Cavalry movies.  I always liked the greens: in fact, was commissioned the year that the greens replaced the pinks and greens.  Old phyart, right?

[ColonelJack]

Oh, I don't know.  Old is a state of mind.

As for the blues/greens, I see your point ... but I understand the blue blouse is going to be somewhat retailored to have officer rank on epaulets rather than shoulder straps.  (I may be wrong about that.)

It also calls for doing away with the beret and going back to (what we call) the service cap.  Right?

Jack

[bosshawk]

I hadn't heard about the beret going away.  I am so removed from anything Army that I wouldn't likely hear it.  In July, I will have been retired 20 years: but, I do enjoy the retirement checks.

[Major_Chuck]

Oh, I don't know.  Old is a state of mind.

As for the blues/greens, I see your point ... but I understand the blue blouse is going to be somewhat retailored to have officer rank on epaulets rather than shoulder straps.  (I may be wrong about that.)

It also calls for doing away with the beret and going back to (what we call) the service cap.  Right?

Jack

I haven't heard that about the beret.  Phase in for everyone of us to wear the blues is not for a few more years.  Things can change though.  Just what I need to have in my closet, another version of a uniform....

[O-Rex]

Getting back to the subject at-hand: AlphaSigOU, you got me! Acronyms give it away, don't they?

Bosshawk- I just can't believe you can get a quality A-2 fora hundred bucks!
The pix on Airborne Leather's website wasn't very detailed.  How's the feel of the Leather, what's the lining like?

For those of you who bought A-2's without velcro, who do you get to sew it on?  Will your avg. neighborhood Dry Cleaner/Alteration shop do it??

As for Army uniforms, "business casual" has also hit the military: Pentagon personnel and recruiters are sporting ACU's as daily wear.  The need for Army "office-wear" is going away.  The only real changes in store for the Dress Blues are beefing-up material weight and quality so they'll stand up to being worn more than once or twice a year.

Also, If you're looking for a "blue bag" that won't leave your wallet too light, I found a company that sells NOMEX navy-blue fightsuits for about $190 (as opposed to $260 at Vanguard, or $240 at Flightsuits/Gibson & Barnes)  Its 'Aureus International.'  You have to specify "no epaulets" when ordering.  The quality is mil-spec.

[AlphaSigOU]

Getting back to the subject at-hand: AlphaSigOU, you got me! Acronyms give it away, don't they?

Bosshawk- I just can't believe you can get a quality A-2 fora hundred bucks!
The pix on Airborne Leather's website wasn't very detailed.  How's the feel of the Leather, what's the lining like?

For those of you who bought A-2's without velcro, who do you get to sew it on?  Will your avg. neighborhood Dry Cleaner/Alteration shop do it??

Any good tailor with experience in leather alterations and cleaning should be able to do it. Ask first before committing your pride and joy A-2 to the butcher shop - ahem, tailor! If there are tailors near military installations, they're probably experienced in working with uniforms. If they're not familiar with placing patches, you may need to place the patches in the location you want (they'll pin it on before sewing). This is how I did with my local tailor/drycleaner when I had velcro put on my flight suits. I gotta get 'em to place the silver sleeve braid on my new TPU service dress coat... when it arrives! (It's being held up at Vanguard because the CAP-style buttons are ordered separately and they were outta stock.)

[O-Rex]

The nearest AFB is about an hour's drive, and five bucks in tolls.  When the time comes, I'll just find me a good tailor.

You mean you have to purchase the buttons separately? 

What about the screw-on button for the service cap?  They were supposed to come out with those too.

I've seen a few folks sporting the Corporate Uniform with service cap w/silver braid.  It really isn't a bad-looking uniform.  Folks either really like it, or really hate it.  I think that once you get over the 'I-really-want-to-look-like-an-Air-Force-Officer' syndrome, what you do in CAP becomes more important than what you wear.

Most of the ardent of the TPU are probably afraid the one day USAF is going to say "Okay, you made up your own uniform, you can wear that instead of the Air Force blues." -I don't think that will happen.

[Hotel 179]

Hotel 179: I went to Pop's website, and the details of ordering the jacket with velcro for the MACOM patch was unclear: please specify size (?)

Please be so kind as to walk us through the 'options' part of the ordering process so that we can slap on patches the day it arrives....

Thanks!

Hello All,

I measured the patch and added a bit for good measure...The name tag is a standard 2"x4" BUT, the brown name tag with the black border is LARGER...it is 2.5" x 4.5" so in the remarks section you can specify the larger numbers.

I opted for all of the pockets...left sleeve, all inside pockets. 

Base price for the goat was 180, pockets and stuff brought the total to 230, shipping was an addition 34 dollars...the fit and finish is really good.  All of the measurements really make a difference in how the jacket wears.  I didn't realize just how much until I put on my other A2 style off the rack jacket.

There are some great websites that talk about the history and heritage of the A2. I didn't realize that there are some real A2 Nazis out there....just show up with an A2 that doesn't have a single piece back, 2 piece arms, and the correct collar hook.  They'll look at you with "that look"....you know the one

Semper vi,

[arajca]

You mean you have to purchase the buttons separately? 

No. Vanguard is waiting for the manufacturer to ship the buttons to Vanguard so they can install them. My coat came with the antique finish CAP crest buttons initially and Vanguard sent me the new shiney CAP crest buttons for no cost - not even shipping.

What about the screw-on button for the service cap?  They were supposed to come out with those too.

Haven't seen those yet.

[O-Rex]

I saw the same websites: there are folks who have this A-2 Jacket-thing down to a science (kinda like the folks who can spot a fake Rolex from 2 miles away.)  Even among the WWII jackets, there are lots & models that differentiate them (pre-war, M-41's M-43's, etc. etc.)  I guess its like anything else: if you're really into something, you study the minute details that might seem meaningless to others.

I'm utilitarian by nature: collecting things reminds me of a George Carlin routine "You got all this stuff, then you gotta buy bigger house to put your stuff. . ."   If I buy something, I use it.   

Funny, bit if you read the original jacket specs from last spring, It calls for a bi-swing back.  A-2's don't come that way (gee, I'm starting to sound like a jacket-nazi-no velcro for you! )  but you can get an "F-82" jacket from Flightsuits Inc/Gibson & Barnes, which is a hybrid A-2 with a Navy G-1 back.  They're really sharp, but pricey.

Sooner or later, Vanguard will carry them, albeit at a premium.

I'll hold off, shop around, and see what shakes out: I don't live in a climate where I would put much mileage on a leather jacket anyway.

They're cool to have, though. . . . .

[Monty]

I know how folks hate revived threads, but I figured it'd be a good story worth carrying this particular thread forward...

So...my bride opts to get me one of these black leather jackets for Christmas; problem was, the Vanguard one was too big so we ended up sending it back.  During the course of which, we decided to take it as a sign and shop around.

Ultimately, we went with the Pop's Leather thing.  We placed the order with Pop's on the 17th of Feb and the thing arrived from Turkey - perfect and completely satisfactory to my tastes - this morning, the 23rd of Feb.

Wow; I can't even get that sort of action when writing from San Jose, CA to Maxwell AFB, AL!   

In my opinion, having felt both the Vanguard and the Pop's version, the latter is a bit more labor intensive (having your measurements taken) but is a much better jacket.

I didn't opt for a bunch of the silly options (silly, at least in my opinion - blood chit?  In CAP?  Egads!) so this is about as standard to the brown one I have from my USAF days as is possible (which I never got "tweaked" out either.)



So as it stands now, I guess I'm "corporately" good to go.   

I have a wonderful wife......awwwwwwwwww.............thanks Baba Sue for the Christmas Present; just in time for St. Paddy's Day!   

[CAPOfficer]

Just in case anyone is interested, Airborne-Leathers has a sale going on right now for the leather jacket for $98 (regularly $249), until the 1st of March.  Please see; http://www.airborne-leathers.com/jackets.html for additional details.

[lordmonar]

I just ordered two.  One in black and one in brown!

[O-Rex]

thanks Baba Sue for the Christmas Present; just in time for St. Paddy's Day!   

Your wife actually BUYS you CAP stuff? You lucky S.O.B!!!

Hey, I'll take the belated jacket over Old Spice and socks any day 

Fantasy conversation:

"Honey, what do you want for your birthday?"

"New Headset."

"Bose, or David Clark X-11??"

[AlphaSigOU]

That the regular CAP patch? Haven't seen a leather-backed one for the A-2 style jacket - yet.

[Monty]

That the regular CAP patch? Haven't seen a leather-backed one for the A-2 style jacket - yet.

Nope.......that's black "fuzzy" velcro on the jacket behind the patch.  Vanguard's is much bigger than Pop's (I even asked them to sew a small piece on - they must have used an odd-shaped patch with which to judge.

[Robert Hartigan]

I have not been paying attention to this corporate uniform thing after I saw a memo introduce it then change it within week...

When and with what uniform can you wear this leather jacket?

Can you wear a AF style white shirt or does it have to be the crappy NJROTC/airline style aviator shirt?

The only strikes I have against the corporate uniform are the shirt and the silly silver braid on the service coat and that I can not wear mil badge or ribbons. Change those three things and I think you could make a convincing argument to leave the AF uniform. Even the blue bdus make sense then...

[DNall]

Change those three things and I think you could make a convincing argument to leave the AF uniform. Even the blue bdus make sense then...

And you don't think that's a bad thing? We're still dependent completely on AF requested funds to survive & function, dependent on them for missions, etc... During this down budget period where they're cutting their own people hard & fast, they've given us HUGE amounts of month for a massive amount of comms & a massive number of new planes per year. I think it's pretty important that our uniforms lean to the AF-style as much as possible to keep people reminded of that central fact & not thinking they can go off on their own & act like a seperate service not accountable to anyone.

Look, they're doing a fine job here lately making the alternative uniforms seem just as good as the aF-style, and that's horrible. The whole point was to have professional business attire that could be readily converted with a nametag & only for those that couldn'r wear the AF-style. Now they're making decent lookin stuff that tempts people out of the AF-style for varrious reasons, not least among them that they think they can be lazy in how they wear the corporate versions. That's all bad stuff. It's good intentions, not thought thru, and in execution it is ciunter to the interests of CAP & the AF.

[Robert Hartigan]

I said you could make a convincing argument. I did not say it was a correct thing to do.

[lordmonar]

Change those three things and I think you could make a convincing argument to leave the AF uniform. Even the blue bdus make sense then...

And you don't think that's a bad thing? We're still dependent completely on AF requested funds to survive & function, dependent on them for missions, etc... During this down budget period where they're cutting their own people hard & fast, they've given us HUGE amounts of month for a massive amount of comms & a massive number of new planes per year. I think it's pretty important that our uniforms lean to the AF-style as much as possible to keep people reminded of that central fact & not thinking they can go off on their own & act like a separate service not accountable to anyone.

Look, they're doing a fine job here lately making the alternative uniforms seem just as good as the AF-style, and that's horrible. The whole point was to have professional business attire that could be readily converted with a nametag & only for those that couldn'r wear the AF-style. Now they're making decent lookin stuff that tempts people out of the AF-style for varrious reasons, not least among them that they think they can be lazy in how they wear the corporate versions. That's all bad stuff. It's good intentions, not thought thru, and in execution it is ciunter to the interests of CAP & the AF.

Knowing the USAF's history on uniforms....I think they would like for us to go away from the USAF style uniforms.  Remember it is the USAF that is forcing us to have corporates in the first place.  So you really can't say the USAF would upset if everyone in CAP suddenly switched to corporates.

Again this is a case of you projecting your anger.  The uniform mismatch is the USAF's fault not CAP's.  NHQ is trying to resolve the issue by making the corporate uniform more like the USAF.  They want to be more like the USAF.  It is NOT part of some plan to lure people away from the USAF.

[JohnKachenmeister]

I think I'll need one with a "Blood Chit" on the back.  Here in Florida, the Blood Chit should be in English and Spanish, and Vietnamese if you fly near Orlando.

[LtCol White]

Change those three things and I think you could make a convincing argument to leave the AF uniform. Even the blue bdus make sense then...

And you don't think that's a bad thing? We're still dependent completely on AF requested funds to survive & function, dependent on them for missions, etc... During this down budget period where they're cutting their own people hard & fast, they've given us HUGE amounts of month for a massive amount of comms & a massive number of new planes per year. I think it's pretty important that our uniforms lean to the AF-style as much as possible to keep people reminded of that central fact & not thinking they can go off on their own & act like a separate service not accountable to anyone.

Look, they're doing a fine job here lately making the alternative uniforms seem just as good as the AF-style, and that's horrible. The whole point was to have professional business attire that could be readily converted with a nametag & only for those that couldn'r wear the AF-style. Now they're making decent lookin stuff that tempts people out of the AF-style for varrious reasons, not least among them that they think they can be lazy in how they wear the corporate versions. That's all bad stuff. It's good intentions, not thought thru, and in execution it is ciunter to the interests of CAP & the AF.

Knowing the USAF's history on uniforms....I think they would like for us to go away from the USAF style uniforms.  Remember it is the USAF that is forcing us to have corporates in the first place.  So you really can't say the USAF would upset if everyone in CAP suddenly switched to corporates.

Again this is a case of you projecting your anger.  The uniform mismatch is the USAF's fault not CAP's.  NHQ is trying to resolve the issue by making the corporate uniform more like the USAF.  They want to be more like the USAF.  It is NOT part of some plan to lure people away from the USAF.

USAF isnt forcing us to have corporates. CAP is. USAF simply stated that anyone who wears the USAF uniform must meet standards plus 10%. For many years, the blazer combo met the need for those not in USAF uniform as did the blue jumpsuits.  It is a CAP issues NOT a USAF issue.

[DNall]

Knowing the USAF's history on uniforms....I think they would like for us to go away from the USAF style uniforms.  Remember it is the USAF that is forcing us to have corporates in the first place.  So you really can't say the USAF would upset if everyone in CAP suddenly switched to corporates.

Again this is a case of you projecting your anger.  The uniform mismatch is the USAF's fault not CAP's.  NHQ is trying to resolve the issue by making the corporate uniform more like the USAF.  They want to be more like the USAF.  It is NOT part of some plan to lure people away from the USAF.

With respect, that's not how it happened. AF NEVER said we should have corporate-style uniforms. They came along way back when & said we had to meet a relaxed version of the ht/wt standards, or we couldn't wear the AF uniform. That was directed at the whole organization & expressing a desire that we require ht/wt/grooming from membership or they'd take away the uniforms all together. CAP decided to side-step the AF's moral high ground by creating modified business attire for members to wear if they couldn't meet the ht/wt. That wasn't & isn't AF's desire, and so it isn't their fault. It's a duality created by us so we can do our own thing by loop-hole w/o accountability. That's about 30 year old history though, so it's not going to change now.

I do not, however, believe anything is part of some grand conspiracy to lure anyone to or away from the AF. I don't believe any such agenda exists, at least I would hope the hell not. My point is merely that the uniform is a constant reminder of who papa is, and if you make the alternatives attractive enough people may well choose to wear those instead, and thereby be less frequenly reminded of who's paying for this date. I don't think that's so much a good thing. I think if you'll look at a lot of things that have happened in the past & are happening now, they tend to be reactionary actions by good hearted & intentioned people trying to do what they think is best for their current members. The problem with that is it reduces standards to the floor so no one is excluded & doesn't take into accoutn what's best for the organization, AF, or country in the longer term. Fact is with our retention rates over the history of CAP, if you lose members for doing the right thing they'll replace themselves several times over before the next policy decision comes around.

[Robert Hartigan]

So DNall what you are saying is CAP is the fat chick third cousin the AF was forced to take to the Jr Prom way back when and now after all these years AF just asked CAP to loose some weight and possibly wax its upper lip if CAP is going to be seen in public with AF from time to time. CAP decide it was better to bleach the the upper lip rather than wax and wear a gray house coat.

[Hawk200]

So DNall what you are saying is CAP is the fat chick third cousin the AF was forced to take to the Jr Prom way back when and now after all these years AF just asked CAP to loose some weight and possibly wax its upper lip if CAP is going to be seen in public with AF from time to time. CAP decide it was better to bleach the the upper lip rather than wax and wear a gray house coat.

Seems to about cover it....

[DNall]

  Well maybe asked CAP to lose some weight & get in shape, CAP went out & bought new dress instead & they never talked about it again to each other, but both sides to this day raise all hell about it to their buddies... yeah something like that.

[MIKE]

It's funny, even if a bit off topic.

[Hammer]

Good Morning, All.

Based upon a recommendation I ordered the black A2 from Pop's Leather (www.popsleather.com).  The order hit the web site on 15 December and the jacket was on my doorstep in the afternoon of 20 December.

The ordering was simple, but you'll need someone to assist you with the measuring process.  I chose the goatskin leather from a traditional standpoint.  Several options are available on the jacket, i.e. inside pockets, velcro for patches, original style neck closure hook, etc..

A nice leather patch inside the jacket reads, "Custom made for _________".  The quality and fit is very high.  I'm a leather jacket junkie and this one is very nice.  Base price was $180, options add a few dollars and shipping from Turkey via DHL was $32.

Fly safe,

Stephen

Pop's Leather does do a good job.  But there prices are alot cheaper if you actually go to their store in Turkey.  At least that's what I was told.

[Al Sayre]

Just that little surcharge for the airfare...

[Fifinella]

Just that little surcharge for the airfare...

Can't we take a -172? 

[ddelaney103]

Just that little surcharge for the airfare...

Can't we take a -172? 

You'll have to check it - it won't fit in the overhead storage like a 152 or "paper cup."

[ddelaney103]

Getting back to jackets....

I just got my black jacket from Airborne and it's very nice, though it's not as heavy as the standard brown one I got from the BX.

Their service was very prompt, and they sent me back a message the same day saying they were out of Large and would a Large Tall be all right?  I said fine and it doesn't even look like they added the extra $10 they charge for a large.

Now I just need to find a local "Mama-san" with a machine that can handle sewing the hook and loop to the front for the nametag and patch.

[DrDave]

Yes, the Airborne-Leather company's jackets are a little thinner on the leather but they're still great and you can't beat the price -- I've got three!

Plus, I have no hesitation sewing stuff to the front of a $98 jacket, but probably would to a $298 one!

Dr. Dave

[Hammer]

I just ordered two.  One in black and one in brown!

Sir, I'm just curious here but did you get your jackets?  A price that good looks too good to be true.  Also, how's the quality of the jacket?  I'm looking at getting one, and don't know if it'd be better to spent the extra $100.00 or so and get one from Pop's Leather.  I know they do a good job, my father's jacket from there is beautiful.

[Al Sayre]

I own 2 of the Airborne Leathers, the quality is good, and the service/shipping has been outstanding, can't beat the price either.

[LtCol White]

I ordered from Airborne Sat 2/24. They advised I should have the jacket by this friday 3/2. Will post my feedback on it once rec'd.

Also, the $98 price was only good until March 1

[LtCol White]

Rec'd my jacket today. Pretty fast.  Very nice quality. I'm impressed. Good quality, supple leather. Nice lining. A little thicker than the Cooper jackets so it can be worn on colder days. Very impressed and pleased for $98.00.  Mine is brown since I dont plan to wear it in uniform but I assume the black is the same quality.

[JC004]

For those interested in buying from Pop's Leather, I saw this on the NRA member discount page.  Dunno if it's current.:

POP'S LEATHER
This is an internet based business. During the check out process, a drop down menu will ask if you are an NRA members and put in the proper discount.
Discount Percentage: 20%