Cadet Grooming Standards

[DBlair]

If his hairstyle ultimately remains a deciding issue, perhaps he should consider joining the Boy Scouts. While different from the CAP Cadet Program, it is still a great program.


...and I don't mean that in any sarcastic CAP vs BSA rivalry sort of way as I'm an Eagle Scout and currently serve as a Commissioner for the BSA.

[tsrup]

Well CAP growth on cadet membership will always be hampered due to the fixation on military uniforms and hair styles  -- that's the way it is and that isn't going to change. :angel:

Contrasting this to the Boy Scouts, with various Explorer type programs that don't have these type of restrictions, one sees signficiant participation and much more community support.  The programs can also more narrowly concentrate on what the youth want.

Frankly I would think that CAP should look at having some sort of Cadet Aerospace member status that would allow teenagers to just participate in the aerospace aspects of the program with a much simpler uniform (current senior AE type uniform, golf shirt) to include orientation flights in CAP aircraft, robotics, computers, radio comms etc.  as well as allow visits to aerospace museums etc.....

One doesn't mention in the post what the potential cadet's primary interest is in joining the program.   If it's military related, than quite frankly get a haircut and wear the AF military style uniform with pride.  HOWEVER, if it is primarily the aerospace side, why not have a non military option available for cadets/teenagers that we have available for adults

RM

It's called Young Eagles, and we get it, you don't like the military side of CAP.

[RADIOMAN015]

Well CAP growth on cadet membership will always be hampered due to the fixation on military uniforms and hair styles  -- that's the way it is and that isn't going to change. :angel:

Frankly I would think that CAP should look at having some sort of Cadet Aerospace member status that would allow teenagers to just participate in the aerospace aspects of the program with a much simpler uniform (current senior AE type uniform, golf shirt) to include orientation flights in CAP aircraft, robotics, computers, radio comms etc.  as well as allow visits to aerospace museums etc.....

One doesn't mention in the post what the potential cadet's primary interest is in joining the program.   If it's military related, than quite frankly get a haircut and wear the AF military style uniform with pride.  HOWEVER, if it is primarily the aerospace side, why not have a non military option available for cadets/teenagers that we have available for adults

RM

It's called Young Eagles, and we get it, you don't like the military side of CAP.

I not against the Cadet Program, nor am I against teenagers wearing AF style CAP uniforms.  :angel:

The Young Eagles program does look pretty interesting, since it deals with a concentrated aerospace type training.  Looking at the EAA "Air Academy" age specific course outline,  http://www.youngeagles.org/programs/airacademy/classoverview.asp it looks to me like this could very easily be done by Civil Air Patrol, at much less cost than an inhouse stay at that facility.  Perhaps the newly formed Aerospace Education flights could meet on a different evening and or weekend day than the typical CAP squadron type meetings.   Of course CAP senior members involved in these flight activities would be required to wear a golf type shirt , no military blues or battle dress uniforms :angel:

Again, I think we need to look at our overall program objectives, external Aerospace education is one of those objectives.  If some kid doesn't want to cut his hair or wear a military type uniform but has a strong interest in aerospace, perhaps it may be worth CAP's efforts to offer an after school or off site (normal CAP squadron facilities)  intensive activities that caters to this specific interest.  There's always the possibility that the aerospace cadet may want to transition into the regular CAP cadet program.
RM

[Eclipse]

Again, I think we need to look at our overall program objectives, external Aerospace education is one of those objectives.  If some kid doesn't want to cut his hair or wear a military type uniform but has a strong interest in aerospace, perhaps it may be worth CAP's efforts to offer an after school or off site (normal CAP squadron facilities)  intensive activities that caters to this specific interest.  There's always the possibility that the aerospace cadet may want to transition into the regular CAP cadet program.

Or perhaps we could stay the course that has served us well for 65+ years and stop trying to be all things to all people.

1 kids shows up with some excuse about being a model and the next thing you know we're changing the entire program because he can't get a haircut.

[tsrup]

Again, I think we need to look at our overall program objectives, external Aerospace education is one of those objectives. 

One of 3 remember.

If we create a unit that operates under Civil Air Patrol, they would be bound by the THREE Missions of CADET PROGRAMS, EMERGENCY SERVICES, and AEROSPACE EDUCATION.

Wearing a Uniform is part of Cadet Programs.

If a cadet does not want to participate in all three missions there are other organizations that he/she can join.  Young Eagles included.

They want just a Cadet Program style atmosphere?  JROTC,
They want emergency Services?  Volunteer at the local fire department or SAR, usually there is an explorer program for High School kids.
They want just Aerospace?  Go for EAA Young Eagles.
There's also the BSA, Venture Crew, and other programs each with their own benefits and goals.

CAP is it's own organization with AF style uniforms as part of it. 
If you don't like it, then take your ball elsewhere, there are plenty of places to take it.

[RADIOMAN015]

[CAP is it's own organization with AF style uniforms as part of it. 
If you don't like it, then take your ball elsewhere, there are plenty of places to take it.

Again another member showing his maturity level with personal attacks.  I ain't quiting, I like CAP, I like the CAP cadet program, I support the CAP cadet program.   I'm a former cadet Billy Mitchell Award guy from many years ago!!!   There's many fine cadets in the program that have gone on to do very good things.  It's fine for CAP CADETS to wear the AF style CAP uniform :clap: :clap: :clap:

I'm just throwing out a possible alternative to booster one portion of our program that is somewhat lagging and might work, BUT it also might not work .     
RM   

 

[tsrup]

[CAP is it's own organization with AF style uniforms as part of it. 
If you don't like it, then take your ball elsewhere, there are plenty of places to take it.

Again another member showing his maturity level with personal attacks.  I ain't quiting, I like CAP, I like the CAP cadet program, I support the CAP cadet program.   I'm a former cadet Billy Mitchell Award guy from many years ago!!!   There's many fine cadets in the program that have gone on to do very good things.  It's fine for CAP CADETS to wear the AF style CAP uniform :clap: :clap: :clap:

I'm just throwing out a possible alternative to booster one portion of our program that is somewhat lagging and might work, BUT it also might not work .     
RM   

I 'spose thats why English professors don't like it when someone writes in the 2nd person. 

the "you" wasn't directed at you or anyone else on the board.

[a2capt]

I didn't even see the proposed personal attack in there at all, I guess I read that 2nd person in the context intended. Had me confused there..

[vmstan]

I fail to see the logic behind cadets in AF uniforms, and senior members not, even if you're looking at it strictly from the cadet programs perspective (of which there are still two other missions) -- if you look at other cadet progams, like Navy Sea Cadets, their adult members wear Naval uniforms -- I'm sure if you ran down other similar Cadet programs you'd find the adult members in the same uniforms. By having senior members there, in proper USAF styled uniforms, it should help set an example for the cadets.

Add on top of that Congressionally mandated missions of ES and AE, both for senior members and cadets, along with a long history and tradition of wearing military styled uniforms -- and the fact that we are legally (sometimes) the auxiliary of the Air Force -- and again, I fail to see the logic behind senior members not being in AF uniforms.

I get so tired of coming in here and seeing some members rail against everything our uniforms stand for. How some members fail to see the history and pride that other members take in their uniforms be they AF, BDU, BBDU, flight suit, or even polo/gray. When I put mine on, I am proud of what other Civil Air Patrol members have done in it for almost 70 years and what the Air Force does in it. (A generic other people not directed at anyone)

When the USAF asks us to get out of them, we should get out of them. Until then, if youdon't want to wear it, don't. (A generic you not directed at anyone.)

[xXDrag_DollXx]

I'm new here. Hi. But I saw this forum but it just really leaves me confused. For the grooming standards, I have about shoulder length hair and I'm a girl. Why is it so strict for the hair to be one certain way? For what I think, especially in encampment, you don't really worry if your hair is getting split ends and what not. For guys also. Who really cares if they have a goatee? If a guy doesn't shave, what is he going to do about it? If someone can kinda explain that to me. That would be great.

[DakRadz]

The Air Force feels that being shaved and having certain haircuts lends to a professional image, as do the other services.
As cadets, we agree to comply with USAF grooming standards because we are wearing a USAF-style uniform with distinctive CAP markings. SM in USAF style uniforms comply with this as well. Also, it's required per the CAP regs.

I'm sure the others here would LOVE to fill you in, so I'll leave my explanation simple. Too frustrating to explain this...

[Майор Хаткевич]

I'm new here. Hi. But I saw this forum but it just really leaves me confused. For the grooming standards, I have about shoulder length hair and I'm a girl. Why is it so strict for the hair to be one certain way? For what I think, especially in encampment, you don't really worry if your hair is getting split ends and what not. For guys also. Who really cares if they have a goatee? If a guy doesn't shave, what is he going to do about it? If someone can kinda explain that to me. That would be great.

As mentioned, it's about presenting a professional image.

For girls, hair can be long, but needs to be manageable in uniform. For boys, short hair cuts are the way to go, and at 12-20 most people won't have decent facial hair anyway. I'm in the 20 year old group, and while I'm not active, I still shave, because otherwise I look like a bum.

[HGjunkie]

I'm new here. Hi. But I saw this forum but it just really leaves me confused. For the grooming standards, I have about shoulder length hair and I'm a girl. Why is it so strict for the hair to be one certain way? For what I think, especially in encampment, you don't really worry if your hair is getting split ends and what not. For guys also. Who really cares if they have a goatee? If a guy doesn't shave, what is he going to do about it? If someone can kinda explain that to me. That would be great.

What's he gonna do about it? He's gonna shave. If he has so much facial hair that he grows a goatee during encampment, he needs to bring a razor and scrape his face off twice a day. And who will care if he has a Goatee? Pretty much his entire flight staff. It looks bad.

[Spaceman3750]

I have seen A LOT of goatees that are well-managed and look highly professional outside of CAP. But you still have to shave to keep them kempt. And they're still against CAP regs.

[Eclipse]

She's not even here anymore guys, that was a drive-by...

[Spaceman3750]

EDIT: Nevermind

[HGjunkie]

She's not even here anymore guys, that was a drive-by...

DANGIT!

[vmstan]

Don't feed the trolls boys.

[HGjunkie]

Don't feed the trolls boys.