Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
June 23, 2018, 11:33:58 PM
Home Help Login Register
News:

CAP Talk  |  Recent Posts
CAP Talk  |  Recent Posts
Pages: 1 ... 8 9 [10]

 91 
 on: June 19, 2018, 04:32:20 PM 
Started by Jester - Last post by Ned
Would an NCSA or even a region-level "encampment instructor course" or something like that help?  I see pluses and minuses to it but haven't given it severe thought.

I can only agree, but we could never make the numbers work.  Even on a regional basis.  And assuming that what we are really running is a "train the trainers" course to help communicate intensity look and feel, we would probably want to have at least 2-3 graduates of such a course at every one of the forty-ish encampments wings and regions run every year.  Even moving folks two states over for a weekend class would consume the lion's share of each wing's CP budget.

Sure, we could do some of it, at least, on line.  But that just returns to the difficult question of how we effectively communicate an intangible "look and feel" to our CP leaders nationwide through written or AV media.

Most of us know "how encampment works" because we have been to one.  Or more.  In our own wing.  I was surprised when I first became a Region DCP how breathtakingly few of us ever get to an encampment in another wing.  I made it a point to make to as many encampments in my region as I could (never did get to AK or HI, but had trusted agents and videos to help me understand their encampment cultures), and it amazed me how different they could be.  Astonishingly different encampments were held just a 100 miles apart.

Now I have responsibility (shared with my NHQ volunteer and corporate colleagues) to help ensure a relatively uniform encampment experience nationwide.  As you can see, we have not yet reached a consensus on some parts of it.

 92 
 on: June 19, 2018, 04:18:55 PM 
Started by Jester - Last post by Ned
But there are major differences between encampment and BMT. 
 
Of course. 

But my point is that there both major differences but also "major similarities," which are directly comparable.  As I wrote in the CAPP 60-15, MTIs go to months of schooling before working directly with trainees, while the typical CAP senior member or cadet cadre supervising cadets at encampment might have mere weeks of training, and sometimes little or none.  AF Trainees typically range in age from 17-24, while our cadets are typically 13-15 at encampment.  I can only agree that those two groups are very different in their ability to benefit from, let alone tolerate, higher levels of military intensity.

I'm pretty sure we agree completely on this point.

 
Quote
It is one thing for an MTI at Lackland to "yell" at a flt of 30-40 people and another for Cadet Snuffy at encampment.

To make the comparison fair, let's modify it to read "It is one thing for an MTI at Lackland [to raise his/her voice] at a flight of 30-40 people and another for a CAP cadet flight sergeant to [raise his/her voice] at a flight of 15-20 cadets at encampment."

(Trying to make sure we are comparing a group criticism with a group criticism.)

So, why do you think so?  I guess this may be the heart of our disagreement.  Clearly, any work with our cadets has to be positive and age appropriate, but at least in other youth training situations there appears to be fairly wide agreement that fair and age-appropriate constructive criticism directed to a group (as opposed to an individual) is both safe and effective.  It is hard to me to imagine any of my youth sports coaches not speaking loudly and plainly to the team as a whole when we performed poorly.  Especially when we were together in a group, but even when we were spread out on the field.  "I know you can do better than that" seems an appropriate team-building message, even when delivered in a loud voice tone to help create urgency and focus our attention on our collective performance.


Quote
My experience with the latter has been cadets especially cadet cadre yelling simply because they can.

Again, I think we agree on this part.  Nobody should raise their voice "simply because they can."  Indeed, we have a pretty good discussion of cadets "Going Hollywood" in the 60-15 at p. 15, with the advice that "CP leaders should be alert to this risk and intervene. . . "

Quote
I'm all for a structured encampment regime however yelling especially when there is no imminent dange just to yell or prove a point is counter productive. I can't even recall the last time I had to yell as a training tool in daily job or CAP.

Again, I think we agree on far more than we disagree here.  No one is suggesting that a raised voice should be used if it is counter-productive in a given situation or activity.  And I agree that in the great majority of cadet activities, (Squadron meetings, weekend activities, CAP conferences, most region and national activities, etc.) it would be extremely rare to hear a raised voice.

Ultimately, I think the answer is somewhere between the two extremes -  Raised voices all the time, and never ever use a raised voice unless safety requires it.

A raised voice is just one tool in the intensity toolbox described in pp. 16-18 of the 60-15.  A leader's voice tone and loudness is just one thing that can be used to raise or lower an intensity level to optimize a cadet's task focus and learning.

Thank you for your work with our cadets.  You are making a very real difference in the future on the nation.

Ned Lee

 93 
 on: June 19, 2018, 03:42:29 PM 
Started by Jester - Last post by abdsp51
Col Lee you have done great work in Cadets Programs and the results from what I have seen speak for themself.  But there are major differences between encampment and BMT.  Yes the AF wants certain things in the encampment curriculum.  It is one thing for an MTI at Lackland to "yell" at a flt of 30-40 people and another for Cadet Snuffy at encampment..  My experience with the later has been cadets especially cadet cadre yelling simply because they can.

Not everyone does MTI duty and actually as of a few years ago they upped the requirements for it after the BMT scandal.  I can say that having staffed and ina couple cases planned and led activities that when "yelling" was removed it was far more successful. 

I'm all for a structured encampment regime however yelling especially when there is no imminent dange just to yell or prove a point is counter productive. I can't even recall the last time I had to yell as a training tool in daily job or CAP.

 94 
 on: June 19, 2018, 03:33:00 PM 
Started by OldGuy - Last post by MHC5096
Sounds like another money wasting "Border Wall" fiasco to me. So much for fiscal conservatism.  ::)

Don't hold your breath on this one. I suspect that CAP will be wearing OCPs long before this comes to fruition.

 95 
 on: June 19, 2018, 02:50:54 PM 
Started by huey - Last post by Holding Pattern

I will still write up a SUI AoC if the member has not progressed to Technician or Senior in a reasonable amount of time (2 years or more). 


Nearly three years now and I'm not working on a track. I'm a Mission Pilot, Airborne Photographer, Mission Observer, Mission Scanner. I fly several hours a month on Army Missions, O'Rides, Transport, and more as needed. I've brought in new Cadets to the squadron and help in that area when I can. I stay so busy being active, that I don't have enough hours to work on tracks to get a certificate. I'm a worker bee. Maybe at our last SUI someone "wrote us up" because of me. I don't know. But ask any squadron members and they'll tell you they are very happy with my contributions. That means more to me that any ribbon, certificate, or rank.

You may want to consider being in the ES track.

I was assigned to it when I joined, but as I said, time is an issue. As well as so many things on the list of things to do, that don't exist in our squadron. I forget now, is been a couple years, but things like a library and certain file keeping, or some things like that that don't exist and can't be pulled together for some reason. I'll try and go back soon and look. We have ES officers in our squadron, so they must have skipped over the things I mention.  Kind of like when I started AP a couple years ago and so much of the Mission Task Guide was out of date and we just had to skip some items on the SQTR sheet. Some times you just have to "make do".  LOL

The training plan and library are the only 2 checkboxes that you probably haven't fulfilled. TBH, Neither of them take terribly long, especially if you work on it with another person.

And there really isn't a time limit.

 96 
 on: June 19, 2018, 02:17:00 PM 
Started by GroundHawg - Last post by GroundHawg
At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.....

 97 
 on: June 19, 2018, 02:09:29 PM 
Started by Jester - Last post by Jester
Would an NCSA or even a region-level "encampment instructor course" or something like that help?  I see pluses and minuses to it but haven't given it severe thought.

I think it would, however if it was not "required", like actually required, then the effect would probably be
like most other "required" training, mixed at best.

And if it was "required" like actually required, the pool of available people which is already far too low,
would shrink even further, and much like the rest of CAP, there is no way to guarantee continuity.

Even when CAP-USAF had oversight, things were still inconsistent wing-to-wing and even year to year, but
now that they are largely out of the picture, CAP has lost that check valve.

True.  The whole point should be to spread the "official" encampment methodology throughout the wings, but that's a several-year adventure, if it ever happens.

I've thought that if a wing has two encampments per year, then one encampment should serve as the staff training for those who will staff the next one, which will serve as the staff training for those who will serve on the one after that.  So winter encampment is staffed by those who went through the Cadre Course during the summer, and those in the cadre course over the winter would be integrated the next summer.

This basically means that both encampments within a wing would have to standardize as much as possible, which given the gang-turf mentality that pops into these kinds of things, will also probably never happen. 

 98 
 on: June 19, 2018, 02:09:16 PM 
Started by OldGuy - Last post by LGM30GMCC
Some folks here seem to be under the impression you need people in space in order to have a space force. Air Force Space Command might politely object.

Already the AF handles most (but not all) space lift, space surveillance, space warning (think ground-based radars that are primarily pointed into space and space-based IR), space control (deconfliction/control of satellites). Take the current busses (meaning frames that house the non-mission components...i.e. power, heaters/coolers, etc) that aren't controlled by the USAF and consolidate those under the new space force and you have a pretty good mission set.  You can also add on whatever Army space does (I really have little idea, Space 100 was over 10 years ago for me now). I would be curious what happens with ICBMs...AFGSC was supposed to be a nuclear command but that's already been diluted a bit with the introduction of the B-1s. Who knows if the USAF just cuts ICBMs loose. It wouldn't really shock me, and the new Space Force might want them so they have some 'shooters'. (Not that AFSPC took particularly good care of the ICBMs when they had that mission set.)

As for funding/establishment yeah that'd be up to Congress to officially set-up and finalize. The areas that will likely cause fights are the loss of some GOFO billets across the services. They may also choose to save money (go figure) by having the Space Force be to the USAF what the USMC is to the USN.

We'll see what happens. Who knows...maybe I won't finish my career in the USAF like I planned.   ::)

 99 
 on: June 19, 2018, 02:05:47 PM 
Started by huey - Last post by etodd

I will still write up a SUI AoC if the member has not progressed to Technician or Senior in a reasonable amount of time (2 years or more). 


Nearly three years now and I'm not working on a track. I'm a Mission Pilot, Airborne Photographer, Mission Observer, Mission Scanner. I fly several hours a month on Army Missions, O'Rides, Transport, and more as needed. I've brought in new Cadets to the squadron and help in that area when I can. I stay so busy being active, that I don't have enough hours to work on tracks to get a certificate. I'm a worker bee. Maybe at our last SUI someone "wrote us up" because of me. I don't know. But ask any squadron members and they'll tell you they are very happy with my contributions. That means more to me that any ribbon, certificate, or rank.

You may want to consider being in the ES track.

I was assigned to it when I joined, but as I said, time is an issue. As well as so many things on the list of things to do, that don't exist in our squadron. I forget now, is been a couple years, but things like a library and certain file keeping, or some things like that that don't exist and can't be pulled together for some reason. I'll try and go back soon and look. We have ES officers in our squadron, so they must have skipped over the things I mention.  Kind of like when I started AP a couple years ago and so much of the Mission Task Guide was out of date and we just had to skip some items on the SQTR sheet. Some times you just have to "make do".  LOL


 100 
 on: June 19, 2018, 02:05:16 PM 
Started by huey - Last post by Eclipse

I will still write up a SUI AoC if the member has not progressed to Technician or Senior in a reasonable amount of time (2 years or more). 


Nearly three years now and I'm not working on a track. I'm a Mission Pilot, Airborne Photographer, Mission Observer, Mission Scanner. I fly several hours a month on Army Missions, O'Rides, Transport, and more as needed. I've brought in new Cadets to the squadron and help in that area when I can. I stay so busy being active, that I don't have enough hours to work on tracks to get a certificate. I'm a worker bee. Maybe at our last SUI someone "wrote us up" because of me. I don't know. But ask any squadron members and they'll tell you they are very happy with my contributions. That means more to me that any ribbon, certificate, or rank.

Do you have an actual, appointed staff role within the unit?

Pages: 1 ... 8 9 [10]
CAP Talk  |  Recent Posts


Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP SMF 2.0.14 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.124 seconds with 13 queries.