2010 Winter National Board

[JCJ]

Here are the thoughts on the ID card thing:

- As a professional organization, we should have a photo ID of some kind

- Also as a professional organization, we should be able to get a digital photograph of every active member in e-services.  Especially since digital photography is a core competency of our organization.  This is also very helpful in confirming the identity & status of members who are not based locally at major incidents & events.

- If we cut out the duplicates, etc we can issue the current photo ID instead of the "library card" to all members as a basic membership benefit for about the same budget (if you lose your card, you have to buy a replacement, no card re-issue for unit transfers, etc.)  Of course, this depends on requiring a photo in e-services (where the ID card photo comes from).  Currently we issue about 90,000 cards per year for 59,000 members.  We can fund the photo ID's at about the same budget if we get rid of the extra card issues, which are usually due to unit transfers or lost cards - which we currently replace free).

- Everyone understands that the current photo ID is not a government ID.  For this action, we are only trying to get the membership a reasonably professional appearing photo ID (the current one).

- Base access is a separate issue.  Our access to military facilities is always at the discretion of the installation commander regardless of what kind of ID we have.  With that said, my CAP photo ID gets me on board all of the several miliary bases I go to on a regular basis.  This is becasue of the need for access, good relationship wih the base and continued good conduct of the local CAP units on the base and in the community, and not becasue of the type of ID I carry.

- There is also (as a separate issue) still a great deal of effort in progress to secure us a government issued ID which meets the latest standards.  However this is a much more complicated issue for many reasons and won't be solved quickly.

-

STAN EVAL changes... policy review via conferences.  Premit USAF funds to be used by Wing to provide training to privates.  Training for Wing Commanders on how to best use STANEVAL.  More criteria for O-FLIGHTS STAN EVAL Courses at intervals instead of just once.

New Agenda Item is inserted as be Motion.

Aerospace Education Officer of the year is discussed.  Accept nominations for the naming of this award.  General Gene M Holm(sp) is suggested.  Discussion...none...motion carried.  Will be run by the family for approval.

Revision of CAP R 35-7...moved to governance commitee.  Agenda 8 bravo to be removed, but will instead go to committee.

Cadet Advisiory term limits...

Info on Mishaps to Pilots...tabled.

Conduct of members using Social Media (hint: myspace, facebook and captalk)  A committee will be appointed with a chair.  Major Pabon will lead the committee.  This is a complex issue being worked though it,  there are a number of legal issues and the like.   This will be given at the Summer National Board.

Ribbon for referred to Committee.  Motion to Reconsidered. Is an Award a uniform issue?  The ribbon goes to the Uniform committee.

Membership Applications...an issue existe en re how fingerprint card will be doen with law enforcement involvment.

ID cards for CAP Members.  Col Jensen wanted all members to have a photo id card.  It is in two parts 1) Can we have a photo id, 2) how about govenrment ID cards.

The proposal is, after looking at costs, that each senior member gets a photo id card every year if that member wants another one they can buy it.  The membership dues will entitle them to one card.  Cadets will not get an ID Card.  At 18 cadets can upgrade.

There is a possible phase in date of the end of 2011.  The agenda item will be written an posted and acted on the the NEC meeting.

Questions...two issues, 1) Will everyone get a digital photo and will it be 2)verified by the Wing Commander.   There will be a booth at Pacific Region, for example, to photo everyone.

The Intent is to ask the USAF for a staff member to get a photo ID Card.  Is there an estimate on cost.  it will be a little more expensive, however, per year national prints 85 to 90 thousand cards.  With everone getting only one card, will lessen the load.  It should, then, Break even.

Col Jensen...will require that all members have a photo in e-services.  It is a good practice to have this alread. It should work with a long phase in time.

Why do this if the US government does not accept it.  The focus should be to get a govenrment ID card that would allow entry.

Money shoudl be save in that the card will not include the unit.  We might be able to go to HLS and have it to where they can help us at TSA check points.  The CAP Photo ID can be used at GA airport check points.

Wing Commanders do not approve Photo ids, it is the Unit Commander.  Unit Commander may need more training.

What happens when a person gets promoted?  The can get another one or keep the old one until the year ends. Photos are to be updated every 5 years.

The ID can be addressed at the individual Military Installations commander's will.

[capmaj]

Thanks for the updates, Maj Carrelas.

[Cecil DP]

Why name the Aerospace Officer of the Year Award after MajGen Jeannie Holm? She was never a member of CAP and as far as I know never had any contact with the organization. I'm tired of CAP naming awards after people who never had a connection to CAP, as it stands now only Curry, Spaatz, Wilson, and Feik had any affiliation with the organization. 

[SarDragon]

This reminds me of a session of congress.

They are doing a lot "my learned colleague" and "the dignguished gentlemen".  I don't recall that much of this sort of thing at prior meetings.  Guess they've been watching a lot of C-SPAN lately.

Its also the whole thing about getting a vote to pass then a second, then all in favor of. amendmants. I guess I am used to command desicions. But I have never seen thislevel of CAP before so its new to me. I thought we had commanders that just made command desicions. Didnt realize yyou had call for a vote, get a second then vote. Very interesting.

This is a basic corporate business meeting, complete with "Robert's Rules of Order."

[Major Carrales]

This reminds me of a session of congress.

They are doing a lot "my learned colleague" and "the dignguished gentlemen".  I don't recall that much of this sort of thing at prior meetings.  Guess they've been watching a lot of C-SPAN lately.

Its also the whole thing about getting a vote to pass then a second, then all in favor of. amendmants. I guess I am used to command desicions. But I have never seen thislevel of CAP before so its new to me. I thought we had commanders that just made command desicions. Didnt realize yyou had call for a vote, get a second then vote. Very interesting.

This is a basic corporate business meeting, complete with "Robert's Rules of Order."

Now, those that start pointing fingers at the National Commanders for alledged "dogmatism" and "dictatorship," how can that claim be made in "good faith" knowing that not much can be done without the National Board and NEC and BOG?

I will be quick to point that out when the next "conspiracy" theory comes around about how the National Commander is pushing a personal agenda.  No one person is ever to blame for policy desicions.

[JCJ]

Why name the Aerospace Officer of the Year Award after MajGen Jeannie Holm? She was never a member of CAP and as far as I know never had any contact with the organization. I'm tired of CAP naming awards after people who never had a connection to CAP, as it stands now only Curry, Spaatz, Wilson, and Feik had any affiliation with the organization.

The question was sent to a committee appointed by the National AE Advisor Co. Mike Murrell (now the national senior advisor for operations).  This was the recommendation brought forward.  Maj. Gen. Holm, who incidentally passed away recently, was a pioneer in aerospace education and professional officer development in the USAF.  The National Board received a very impressive presentation regarding Maj. Gen. Holm's life and accomplishments during the board meeting.

[Cecil DP]

Why name the Aerospace Officer of the Year Award after MajGen Jeannie Holm? She was never a member of CAP and as far as I know never had any contact with the organization. I'm tired of CAP naming awards after people who never had a connection to CAP, as it stands now only Curry, Spaatz, Wilson, and Feik had any affiliation with the organization.

The question was sent to a committee appointed by the National AE Advisor Co. Mike Murrell (now the national senior advisor for operations).  This was the recommendation brought forward.  Maj. Gen. Holm, who incidentally passed away recently, was a pioneer in aerospace education and professional officer development in the USAF.  The National Board received a very impressive presentation regarding Maj. Gen. Holm's life and accomplishments during the board meeting.

I do know she was the first woman to make General Officer, but again that's what she did in the AF. What did she do for CAP? She was not a member. Let's name CAP awards after outstanding CAP members.   

[FARRIER]

Why name the Aerospace Officer of the Year Award after MajGen Jeannie Holm? She was never a member of CAP and as far as I know never had any contact with the organization. I'm tired of CAP naming awards after people who never had a connection to CAP, as it stands now only Curry, Spaatz, Wilson, and Feik had any affiliation with the organization.

The question was sent to a committee appointed by the National AE Advisor Co. Mike Murrell (now the national senior advisor for operations).  This was the recommendation brought forward.  Maj. Gen. Holm, who incidentally passed away recently, was a pioneer in aerospace education and professional officer development in the USAF.  The National Board received a very impressive presentation regarding Maj. Gen. Holm's life and accomplishments during the board meeting.

I do know she was the first woman to make General Officer, but again that's what she did in the AF. What did she do for CAP? She was not a member. Let's name CAP awards after outstanding CAP members.

LTC Zumwalt, according the the recommendation, was also a pioneer in aerospace education. I think a good job for our historians would to start looking into the contributions of past individual members like LTC Zumwalt.

[RADIOMAN015]

It seems that NHQ will now be providing a report to the NB at each meeting about any regulations that need updating due to changes made by ICL or other regulations and especially with anything wrong with the 6 oldest regs.

Frankly what they need to do is tell CAP's Executive Director what they expect of the paid organization as far as "processing time" goals for any regulation changes.  I would think that most of this could be done in 30 days, maybe the max 45 days after a policy decision is made by the various boards.  Am I missing something here?
RM

[RADIOMAN015]

A motion to consolidate CAP service Dress Unifrom is being discussed.  I will take this one and post its chatter here.  A consolidated professional uniform is needed (as opposed to suit to avoid "MALL SECURITY" effect.)   

Frankly the civilian suit with CAP badge/name tag, tie, etc is fine and offers resonable identification.  Even while in the AF while at OHara airport changing planes, we were mistaken for airport employees (we were wearing the AF class B (short sleeve blue shirt, blue pants and jacket with rank).   

I think most members aren't intersted in spending more money on uniforms at this point in the economy.  Way too much time is spent in this organization on uniforms
RM 

[RiverAux]

They weren't explictly talking about turning ICLs into regs.  The situation they were talking about checking every now and again to make sure that an ICL or revision of one regulation didn't require changes to other regulations as well. 

[FW]

Does this include appointments to the National Staff?  That there be guidelines for, for example, the new uniform committee.  For transparency.

Some time ago a proposed pamphlet was brought forward...it created resistance.  It is hoped it will be available...It is hoped that the National Commander would have the same rigths to pick their staffs as a local commander would.

The National Commander always has the right to pick their staff, as any other commander at the subordinate levels (except for the vice commander).   

However, since National Level "governance" is corporate, there are some differences; the National Board must elect the vice commander and, "confirm" the CS, NFO, NLO, NC, IG and Chap.  I don't think that will ever change.

The new uniform board, as I understand it, will be selected by the region commanders and national commander.  Uniform recommendations will be approved by the commander.  This, believe it or not, is a delegation of authority from the National Board to the National Commander.  It was also a great compromise between the two major factions on the board.  I congratulate the National Board on coming together and making a very tough decision.

[RADIOMAN015]

E-mail notifications on one line safety forms (78 and 79s) is not reaching out to all commands.  They recommend a culture of passing information be created in the various Wings to insure that these matters are properly communicated despite the procedures not being present in the regulations.

CAP Safety culture is reactive, despite all attempts to the contrary.  Constant safety concentrations may cause some "tone deafness" to the constant call for safety (like a lifeguard's wistle being ignored for its constant blair)

Can safety be stressed without saying the word safety?  A culture of safety is more important a thing to develop.  Safety is improved with aholistic view point.  A safety management system (SMS) is to be deployed
An SMS for CAP is not mandatory, but makes sense.

Safety programs have to advance in a two pronged effort 1) analysis of past mishaps, and 2) mitigation of possible mishaps.    Safety is not about safety, but about good training and a culture of safe practices.

I must be missing something on this also.  For many years CAP has gotten accident reports filed and upchanneled.  In the past haven't they (CAP National hq officials) read them and performed an analysis of the types of accidents and possible ways to mitigate

My fear is that this entire safety program is really going to take CAP from an operational mission orientated unit to the term "Swivel Chair Patrol".  Members are going to be unwilling to take any operational risks because of the ramifications associated with even the slightest chance of an accident while performing the ORM.   It basically has the potential of becoming a paper tiger jungle of CYA by everyone    

Of course now we have a full time paid employee at National, and I'm sure that there will be a lot of "innovations" to keep us busy down at the local volunteer level.  :angel:

Also as far as reporting goes, members will comply with what the regulation says.   Why would anyone expect more reporting if it isn't required    
RM 

[flyguy06]

Why name the Aerospace Officer of the Year Award after MajGen Jeannie Holm? She was never a member of CAP and as far as I know never had any contact with the organization. I'm tired of CAP naming awards after people who never had a connection to CAP, as it stands now only Curry, Spaatz, Wilson, and Feik had any affiliation with the organization.

I kinda agree but not for the same reason. why name an aerospace award after someone who was not a pilot or in the aerospace field?

[BillB]

One problem with the proposal requiring the CAP photo ID cards. The mothion was for annual renewal and the photo uploaded every five years. Since there are approximately 60,000 members and there are only about 250 business days this means that National will have to do 240 photo ID card per day The math doesn't work It would be impossible to produce much over 100 cards per day. Plus what extra paid staff would be required?
Seems like this is not a thoughtout photo ID card plan.
Several years ago CAP had a photo ID card, and annually a renewal sticker was put on the back of the card. This ends the annual renewal of the photo ID card replacing it with a semi-permrenant card with the annual renewal sticker

[Eclipse]

One problem with the proposal requiring the CAP photo ID cards. The mothion was for annual renewal and the photo uploaded every five years. Since there are approximately 60,000 members and there are only about 250 business days this means that National will have to do 240 photo ID card per day The math doesn't work It would be impossible to produce much over 100 cards per day. Plus what extra paid staff would be required?

If you're typing them on a Selectric, yes.  If you use real, business-class equipment or services, you could probably do them all in a week or less.  How many do you think the DoD makes in a single day?  Most off the shelf ID card systems can make one or more a minute - that's about 500 in a business day.

Also, most members are renewing a year at a time, anyway, so its just this machine instead of that.

[RADIOMAN015]

It is hoped that the National Commander would have the same rigths to pick their staffs as a local commander would.

The National Commander always has the right to pick their staff, as any other commander at the subordinate levels (except for the vice commander).   

However, since National Level "governance" is corporate, there are some differences; the National Board must elect the vice commander and, "confirm" the CS, NFO, NLO, NC, IG and Chap.  I don't think that will ever change.

I've noted in the agenda working minutes that there's  comments made by the the Commander CAP-USAF, regarding commander's being able to pick their staffs as opposed to (what I would assume) is election of the staff and than discusses the military role of command.
To a certain extent I think that the Commander CAP-USAF may need a bit of a reality check in the management/leadership of a truely "volunteer" organization .  CIVIL Air Patrol is not the military.  IF you have any Commander (and staff members appointed by the commander) that don't seem to be in tune with what the general membership thinks/wants (supports the membership), basically the general membership will just stop participating ("passive resistence")that is the major challenge of working with unpaid volunteers.  Unlike the military there's no UCMJ, threats to promotion, or demotion that can change that. 
   
BTW Having met both our new region & wing commanders, I personally think they have the right attitude towards supporting the unpaid "volunteer" membership.  Hopefully this is a positive sign of the future thoughout CAP.  At least in the Northeast it is!!! :clap:
RM

[BlackKnight]

One problem with the proposal requiring the CAP photo ID cards. The mothion was for annual renewal and the photo uploaded every five years. Since there are approximately 60,000 members and there are only about 250 business days this means that National will have to do 240 photo ID card per day The math doesn't work It would be impossible to produce much over 100 cards per day.

Hmmm, methinks this might be a great "backdoor" way to get a handle on how many of our ~57,000 members are active vs. inactive. If a senior officer isn't willing to take the time to upload their photo to e-services during the photo ID phase-in period, we can pretty much assume they've gone inactive.  Another question: Once the program is established, will NHQ continue to accept membership renewal payments from members who have not provided photos?  I suspect they will...

[JCJ]

The photo ID would replace the current "library card" of which close to 90,000 are sent out per year.  I don't know all the details but the NHQ staff who handle our ID cards now is working closely with the volunteer working group who is handling this.  As you point out, it will be critical to ensure the feasability of the plan but it looks like it is do-able.

One problem with the proposal requiring the CAP photo ID cards. The mothion was for annual renewal and the photo uploaded every five years. Since there are approximately 60,000 members and there are only about 250 business days this means that National will have to do 240 photo ID card per day The math doesn't work It would be impossible to produce much over 100 cards per day. Plus what extra paid staff would be required?
Seems like this is not a thoughtout photo ID card plan.
Several years ago CAP had a photo ID card, and annually a renewal sticker was put on the back of the card. This ends the annual renewal of the photo ID card replacing it with a semi-permrenant card with the annual renewal sticker

[JCJ]

Does this include appointments to the National Staff?  That there be guidelines for, for example, the new uniform committee.  For transparency.

Some time ago a proposed pamphlet was brought forward...it created resistance.  It is hoped it will be available...It is hoped that the National Commander would have the same rigths to pick their staffs as a local commander would.

The National Commander always has the right to pick their staff, as any other commander at the subordinate levels (except for the vice commander).   

However, since National Level "governance" is corporate, there are some differences; the National Board must elect the vice commander and, "confirm" the CS, NFO, NLO, NC, IG and Chap.  I don't think that will ever change.

The new uniform board, as I understand it, will be selected by the region commanders and national commander.  Uniform recommendations will be approved by the commander.  This, believe it or not, is a delegation of authority from the National Board to the National Commander.  It was also a great compromise between the two major factions on the board.  I congratulate the National Board on coming together and making a very tough decision.

The uniform board will have eight wing commanders on it (one from each region selected by the region commander) - there will also be some other members (I can't remember exactly who & I haven't unpacked yet to check my notes).  There is also a provision to ensure that there is at least one female member on the board to provide feedback on women's uniform issues.