As real as it gets

[O-Rex]

I've seen some recent threads in which there is a military/civilian "culture gap" that seems frustrating for both prior and non-prior military CAP members. 

Being a military-style organization, for those in CAP with no military experience, understanding some of the nuances of the Profession of Arms might be helpful to achieve some common frame of reference with those who've BTDT.

Obviously there is no substitute for training, experience, and just "being there,"  but for some of our members, the military was either not possible, not completed or not on their "radar" way back when, and that opportunity has come and gone.  Nonetheless they continue to make contributions through CAP for which I'm sure we are all appreciative.

In an effort to provide some kind of insight into the Military, and it's culture, ethos, and idiosyncrasies, we might compile a list of movies and literature that actually portray the essence military life, particularly the challenge of command, rather than  comic book-like caricatures, stereotypes and cliches. 

For example, "12 O'clock high" was on the ACSC list of must-see movies, as well as "Glory."   James Caan starred in "A glimpse of Hell" which was about the turret explosion on the USS Iowa in 1989.  "Band of Brothers" stands out too.

Books would include Philip Caputo's "A Rumor of War,"  James MacDonough's "Platoon Leader," Nathaniel Fick's "One Bullet Away,"  "Seal!" by Michael Walsh (who very much counters Dick Marchinko's semi-fiction books) Let's not forget "It does't take a hero" by Schwartzkopf. Tom Clancy has some good non-fiction books; one for each of the services, like "Armored Cav" and "Carrier."  Also include the ones with the not-so-happy endings, like "The Right Thing" by Scott Waddle, and "Soldier!" by Anthony Herbert.

Even fiction like Layne Heath's "CW2" or Ward Carroll's "Punk's War/Punk's Wing/Punk's Fight" trilogy.

Anyway, you get the idea: suggestions that focus on getting inside the military mind and lifestyle, instead of prettyboys/girls, martial-artists, hip background music and inane quips like "I feel the need for speed. . "

Any others?

[Short Field]

Harold G. Moore & Thomas Galloway's "We were Soldiers Once and Young"

WEB Griffin's "The Brotherhood of War" and "The Corps" series

[Slim]

I have to second Griffin's "Brotherhood of War" and "The Corps" series'.  Read both of them many times.  For fiction, both really take you inside the mind of the characters and help understand the culture (and subcultures) of the military.

Another good read (if you can find it) is "The Wild Blue" which I think was written by Walter Thompson and Walter Boyne.  Haven't read it in a while, and it's on my list to hit again.  Similar to "Brotherhood of War", but one book covering a span of time from the 50s-70s.  Very handy for getting into the mind of the Air Force from many different angles.

I was privileged to watch "We Were Soldiers" with a good friend of mine who served in the 7th Cav (think he was 3rd Bn, and got there well after the Ia Drang battle).  Not only the leadership lessons, but the realism (as verified) was top notch.

More good ones are "Blackhawk Down", "Gardens of Stone", "Windtalkers" and "The Great Raid."  All entertaining movies, but with a lot of leadership lessons and getting the viewer into the culture of the military.

[Eclipse]

Ender's Game - Orson Scott Card
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ender's_Game
(I am not a big fan of the rest of the series, Ender's Shadow being an exception)
This book surprised me, as it spends a lot of time involved in leadership theory and group dynamics, it is especially useful in helping to understand the "cadet mentality" - children thrust into positions of leadership and authority before they are capable of emotionally coping with the situation.

Starship Troopers - Robert A. Heinlein
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starship_Troopers
Considering it was written in 1959, its remarkably current in regards to governmental situations and technology.  Anyone with a general knowledge of politics would certainly consider his "history" of the world's governments as plausible. Don't dismiss it because of the movie.  This book is on the reading list of the 4 academies, and of the Army, Marines and Navy (at the least).  A large portion involves the "why" people join the military and similar "bigger then the sum of its parts" organizations.

[mikeylikey]

Books:

In the Company of Heroes / Michael J. Durant
Black Hawk pilot Mike Durant was shot down and taken prisoner during military operations in the failed country of Somalia in 1993. Published in the tenth anniversary year of that conflict, this riveting personal account at last tells the world about Durant's harrowing captivity and the heroic deeds of his comrades.

Company Commander / Charles B. MacDonald
This is an autobiographical account of a young officer's experiences as an American rifle company commander in France during the Second World War. Fresh from the States, MacDonald led Normandy veterans through the Battle of the Bulge and the invasion of Germany. This absorbing story about the development of leadership in combat is worthwhile reading for all company-grade officers and NCOs who are entrusted with the lives of American Soldiers.

The Soldier and the State: The Theory and Politics of Civil-Military Relations / Samuel Huntington
Blending the disciplines of history, sociology, and political science, Huntington's study is required reading for the Army officer. The author develops a theoretical framework with which to analyze civil- military relations. Particularly noteworthy in this study is the preliminary discussion, "Officership as a Profession." The arguments that Huntington has set forth in this section have colored the American military's self-perception for an entire generation.

Of course the best you can do is pick up a new (or at least no older than 3 years) copy of the Air Force Officers Guide.  There are also "Army Officers Guide, Naval Officers Guide" etc.  IT should be the BASIC reading for all new CAP Officers.  We play on the AF team, perhaps we should get an insight into what being an AF Officer means.  These books have been around more than 50+ years and are full of good info.  I would love to see a chapter placed in the book on "Civil Air Patrol, AF Auxiliary Officership". 

As far as movies go, HBO's band of brothers is excellent.  I always did like every Jimmy Stewart movie made (especially his war movies).  SAC is a good one, very dated though. 

I am in the process of getting a primer created for the PAWG distance ed site.  It will be basic military education material related to being a junior Officer, adjusting to military organizations, and CAP specific Officer needs, abilities, traits and duties.  I have many DVDs from the DOD sitting at work/home, and Colgan has many I sent him.  I hope to have the whole thing done by Mid November. 

You see, AFIADL courses are great, but interactive on line courses, are even better. 

DAVIS (DOD depository of everything media related) is open for CAP members to pull videos on DVD, training material and other things.  If you want, I will send anyone the link if they PM me. 

Sorry about getting "off-course"!

[O-Rex]

"Gardens of Stone"

I read the book: having spent time at Ft. Huachuca during various phases of my Army Career (never came out in the movie) it REALLY took me back...

I just finished "Rolling Thunder" by Mark Berent-fantastic: Although fiction, it takes you through the first year of Operation Rolling Thunder 65-66, from a thud squadron at Bien Hoa, to the Pentagon-gives a full spectrum across the chain of command.

[mikeylikey]

Anyway, you get the idea: suggestions that focus on getting inside the military mind and lifestyle, instead of prettyboys/girls, martial-artists, hip background music and inane quips like "I feel the need for speed. . "

So are you saying the TV show "Army Wives" does not give a glimpse into the military world?  I will answere that......No it doesn't!

[Becks]

Ender's Game - Orson Scott Card


Starship Troopers - Robert A. Heinlein

Funny, both are sitting no more than 2 feet from me. 

[O-Rex]

So are you saying the TV show "Army Wives" does not give a glimpse into the military world?  I will answere that......No it doesn't!

I didn't even know there was a TV show called "Army Wives..."

I doubt I'm missing much: If I'm curious, I'll bet I can fish the boxed set of season 1 in the '5.99-bin' at Wal-Mart in a few months.

[Short Field]

Ender's Game - Orson Scott Card
Starship Troopers - Robert A. Heinlein

Funny, both are sitting no more than 2 feet from me. 

Same here but a few more feet away.  Starship Trooper falls under Heinlein's "juvenile" fiction but does a great job of defining "service before self" and the responsibility that comes with command.  I try to re-read it every couple of years.  FYI:  Heinlein graduated 20th in a class of 243 at the Naval Academy, Class of 1929.  He actually stood fifth in academics but discipline considerations lowered his class standing to 20th.

If you are looking at Sci Fic, then David Weber's two series, March Upcountry (four books waiting for a fifth) and the Honor Harrington books (10+ books and counting) deserve reading.  He does a really great job of defining what a good officer is expected to do - regardless of personal consequences.  He even does a good job discussioning Officer/Enllisted relationships - something another topic here was addressing.  His books do need to be read in order.

[Slim]

"Gardens of Stone"

I read the book: having spent time at Ft. Huachuca during various phases of my Army Career (never came out in the movie) it REALLY took me back...

Mmm...Fort Huachuca, yet another place that I absolutely loved, that I'm not very likely to see again.  My ex in-laws live out that way, and my ex father-in-law retired from Huachuca.  I understand most consider it the armpit of the Army; I was impressed with the updating that was going on around the post, but seeing Grierson Field in all it's 1800's glory was pretty interesting too.  If you miss it that much, check out The Scout at http://www.huachuca.army.mil/USAG/PAO/pao_scout.cfm.  It's one of my regular stops.

Never read the book, methinks it's time to check out amazon.

[Cecil DP]

Gardens of Stone was a movie in 1987w/ James Caan, James Earl Jones. 

[ZigZag911]

Star Trek (Original Series): an episode called "The Galileo Seven", Spock commands a shuttlecraft mission that goes all wrong, his 1st independent command; also anotherOriginal Series episode, I think it's called "The Tholian Web", Spock takes command on Kirk's disappearance, with McCoy objecting strenuously....lot's of lessons in them resolving their roles.

There are a number of similar episodes in ST The Next Generation.

I think one of the finest ST views into leadership & officership, and the sacrifices it may demand, is found throughout the second feature film, "The Wrath of Khan".

[mikeylikey]

There are a number of similar episodes in ST The Next Generation.

One of my favorite TV shows of all time.  Lots of leadership lessons there.  In fact mid 1990's there were some colleges actually creating leadership courses based off ST.  Weird right?

[star1151]

One of my favorite TV shows of all time.  Lots of leadership lessons there.  In fact mid 1990's there were some colleges actually creating leadership courses based off ST.  Weird right?

Weird?  Makes me sorry I didn't get to take one!

[PhotogPilot]

As long as we're tossing Sci-Fi into the mix, Star-Trek, DS 9 fits here, lots of command issues for Sisko, Worf's development as an Officer and leader, and the Dominion War.

As far as traditional military fiction, 12 O'Clock High is IMHO one of the the best studies of command ever filmed. "We Were Soldiers" is a great adaption of a true story. 

Honorable mention goes to "Das Boot", "The Bridges of Toko-Ri" and "A Wing and a Prayer" (mainly for Don Ameche's willingness to let one of his pilots run out of fuel and die rather than risk the ship by breaking radio silence.)

[Steve Silverwood]

I don't see them listed, but there are several biographies that I feel are excellent reading:

Ike by Michael Korda -- just published this year, I believe.  Great bio of Eisenhower from his early years all the way through his presidency, with exceptional detail given to his military service.

Norman Schwartzkopf's bio, don't remember the title offhand, but it also makes for excellent reading.

I'm working on Soldier -- General Matthew Ridgway's memoirs, published in 1956.  Just started it, but it looks to be a good read.

Guys, if you want to get a handle on some excellent books, check out the History Book Club at www.historybookclub.com.  I've been a member for several years, and have amassed quite a collection.  I've read many of them, and will probably still be ordering and reading well past retirement age.  Anyone who wants to join, let me know.  Yes, I get a couple of freebies for referring new members, but I'd recommend their books to anyone regardless of the freebies.  (There is also a Military Book Club, which I also joined several years back, but they don't seem to offer nearly the breadth of material that the HBC offers.)

//Steve//

[star1151]

Norman Schwartzkopf's bio, don't remember the title offhand, but it also makes for excellent reading.

It Doesn't Take a Hero: The Autobiography of General H. Norman Schwarzkopf
Excellent book.

[ZigZag911]

One of my favorite TV shows of all time.  Lots of leadership lessons there.  In fact mid 1990's there were some colleges actually creating leadership courses based off ST.  Weird right?

Makes perfect sense to me!

Over many years in CAP I have frequently seen ST used with great success as the basis for both "regular" leadership and moral leadership discussions.

[O-Rex]

"Gardens of Stone"

I read the book: having spent time at Ft. Huachuca during various phases of my Army Career (never came out in the movie) it REALLY took me back...

Mmm...Fort Huachuca, yet another place that I absolutely loved, that I'm not very likely to see again.  My ex in-laws live out that way, and my ex father-in-law retired from Huachuca.  I understand most consider it the armpit of the Army; I was impressed with the updating that was going on around the post, but seeing Grierson Field in all it's 1800's glory was pretty interesting too.  If you miss it that much, check out The Scout at http://www.huachuca.army.mil/USAG/PAO/pao_scout.cfm.  It's one of my regular stops.

Never read the book, methinks it's time to check out amazon.

There is a section of the book that describes the "Apache Flats" housing area as well as "Colonel's Row" in the 1960's.  By the early 1980's, Apache Flats was so run down that prior to it being demolished in 1985, it was offered to E-3's and junior E-4's who didn't actually qualify for post housing (kind of "handyman specials" if you will)  A buddy of mine lived there with his new bride: the place was a dive, but to the newlyweds it was paradise, not to mention a good place for young M.I. trainees to barbecue and hang-out on a weekend pass.

The first section of the book had special meaning for me: like the protagonist Jack Willow, I went out with an Officer's Daughter who lived in one of the historic quarters "up the hill," and spent an untold number of evenings trying to get back to the barracks by 'lights out' without getting stopped by inquistive M.P's.   

Huachuca was great, then again, nearly anywhere is great when you're 18 years old.....

Get the book, DON'T see the movie.