Are the "Wing Mafias" dying?

[JC004]

I think NJ only has a north and south.  Like Philadelphia...South, North, Northeast, Center City, etc.  no "east" (which is Center City anyway, geographically).  On this side of the River, we just consider it a toxic waste dump.

[mikeylikey]

^ There is an East past Philly?   

[SarDragon]

Yeah, it's called the Boston - DC corridor. There's a bunch of people there. Check it out sometime. 

[ZigZag911]

It is central. Dig out your Rand-McNally road atlas and open it to that fine double page map. Split it into thirds, and all three bases (Dix, McGuire, and Lakehurst) are distinctly in the middle third. Using the same methodology, San Francisco is smack in the center of the state, but everyone says it's in "northern" California.

Beg to differ -- it may be geographically central, but the attitude & mentality are pure "south Jersey" -- Philadelphia-influenced inferiority complex, resentment toward the northern counties of the state (too rich, too congested, too crowded, too urban, too rushed), and a definite proprietorial attitude toward NJ Wing based solely on the accident that their homes are located within reasonable driving distance of McGuire AFB (which, incidentally, is slowly crowding the wing out due to operational requirements).

[mikeylikey]

(which, incidentally, is slowly crowding the wing out due to operational requirements).

Then make the move over to DIX.  There are plenty of empty buildings just sitting around waiting for Tennant's.  In fact, the only thing McGuire has going for it is the Commissary and PX.  I just read that the old PX at DIX is going to be renovated and reopened anyway.  DIX has much more to support CAP than McGuire.  (Note, it doesn't matter cause in 2 years it will be a fully joint base with one Commander and streamlined services). 

[ZigZag911]

A good idea, but, in case you have not picked up on it, I'm from North Jersey, and would really like to see Wing HQ back up here for awhile....it's been in south NJ for over 45 years, that's enough for awhile!

[isuhawkeye]

I know this is going to be a little controversial, and it may deserve its own thread, but...

Why do wing headquarters need to move.  Isn't a centralized stable headquarters located within the vicinity of state legislature, state governmental agencies, and/or military presence more important than a feel good factor of having the wing HQ co located with "my" home town?

Flame on

[ZigZag911]

You misunderstand...word is that eventually NJW will need to relocate off McGuire AFB because the USAF needs the space back.

Given the relative lack of coordination with either our state legislature or Guard, I am pitching the northern end of the state as the new HQ location....I'm not proposing a move for the sake of moving.

[mikeylikey]

^ Move to DIX.  Isn't the Region at McGuire?  Wouldn't it make more sense to be close to region HQ, and billeting for staff calls, and facilities for training.  Unless there is a military post/ base in the north you want to move to, I would have to say moving away from DIX/McGuire is a bad idea for NJWG. 

Since I am not from NJ, my say has very little sway.  But logistically, it is better to stay where the support is. 

[ZigZag911]

Well, bottom line is it is not my call, but there are other considerations besides military support.

[SarDragon]

A good idea, but, in case you have not picked up on it, I'm from North Jersey, and would really like to see Wing HQ back up here for awhile....it's been in south NJ for over 45 years, that's enough for awhile!

Not quite. Wing HQ was in Newark in 1966, and, IIRC, didn't move until; Col Spears left as Wing Commander.

As for the "why move", it's politics. I certainly can't deny the attitude Zigzag noted, it's certainly there. But the folks up north have their own 'tudes, too.

My info about wing commanders and where they're from is spotty at best. I just looked up eight Colonels in NJWG and they are scattered all over, from Glassboro to Perth Amboy. The two most recent are from SoJer, with others farther back being from central and northern areas of the state.

Since others are answering faster than I am, I'll just keep tacking on. There is no base farther north in NJ that could provide that kind of support.

[ZigZag911]

You are correct that theere is no such military base in North Jersey that could offer CAP the support that McGuire AFB & Fort Dix do....there are, however,other aviation facilities where CAP is already well-established that would almost undoubtedly welcome the basing of wing HQ.

Also, we are not merely discussing the home locations of wing CCs, but also those of the wing staff officers.

Finally, we northern folks have our attitudes & flaws as well, it's true....one of which is weariness at being told we're "One Wing, One Team", and then being treated like out of town relations!

[Cecil DP]

Why not Lakehurst, now that they've lost the blimp squadrons?

[SarDragon]

You are correct that theere is no such military base in North Jersey that could offer CAP the support that McGuire AFB & Fort Dix do....there are, however,other aviation facilities where CAP is already well-established that would almost undoubtedly welcome the basing of wing HQ.

Also, we are not merely discussing the home locations of wing CCs, but also those of the wing staff officers.

Finally, we northern folks have our attitudes & flaws as well, it's true....one of which is weariness at being told we're "One Wing, One Team", and then being treated like out of town relations!

Not trying to to stir this up any farther, but that's the way we were treated in the 60s and 70s, so I guess what goes around comes around.

In all seriousness, I think most of the geographically spread out wings have the same problems from time to time, and they are not good for the wings or the units in them.

[SarDragon]

Why not Lakehurst, now that they've lost the blimp squadrons?

Well, the [mess]bags have been gone about 50 years, so I don't see where that's relevant.

The base working population is probably 75% civilian, and it operates primarily as an RTD&E facility. When I was stationed there in the late 70s, we tried to get support for a unit on base, and it was an exercise in futility. I imagine it wouldn't be any easier today.

I'm not even sure where the wing could put the headquarters there, since building space has always been at a premium.

[CASH172]

Why not Lakehurst, now that they've lost the blimp squadrons?

When I was stationed there in the late 70s, we tried to get support for a unit on base, and it was an exercise in futility. I imagine it wouldn't be any easier today.

I'm not even sure where the wing could put the headquarters there, since building space has always been at a premium.

The Sea Cadets do have a unit located in the old Hanger 1, so I guess it is possible now to try and get support for a local unit.  In terms of a Wing HQ, I don't know of a place on base that can spare enough room for all the administrative requirements of a Wing HQ. 

[RiverAux]

I think we're wandering a little astray from the main topic....

[flyerthom]

And why no Squadron in Scranton?

Just waiting for you to start one up!!   

And move back to the snow? It's more fun to live here and hassle Lord Monar in person!