Where's the Form 37?

[arajca]

Otherwise any PC will do, which is likely how most would get to ORMS.

The problem is one of the two people involved needs to have access to ORMS. I know that I would not hand off an EF Johnson that is assigned to me unless the other person "signed" for it. I can't afford to replace it and since I can't prove I didn't break it I'd be screwed.

Doesn't everyone with a membership ID has access to ORMS? Or is certainly supposed to, especially anyone who would be issued equipment, either temporarily or permanently?

Yes, but if you are issued equipment all you can do in ORMS is turn it in. You cannot transfer it to someone else. So you need a third person who is a designated property manager like a communications officer to accept the return and reissue it out. And that person has to be from the your unit or a superior unit to issue the equipment. Additionally, the property manager may want to inspect the unit prior to reissuing it so you have more time involved.

The CAPF 37 is for temporary and short term issues. The regs require doing the issue in ORMS if the equipment will out/transferred for more than 7 days. A member signing out an ISR for a FTX weekend - CAPF 37 is fine. Same member being issued that radio for their GT kit - issue the radio in ORMS. The member has 7 days to accept the issue of return the radio. CAP is aware that not every unit has internet access at their meeting or storage locations. The CAPF 37 provides documentation of where equipment is between the time the member takes physical custody of it and the time it is issued in ORMS.

[SARDOC]

Another guy who is "techno spoiled". 

Techno Spoiled maybe...  But it is good "Continuity Of Operations Planning"  Having worked Emergency Services for many years I just tend to believe in being prepared.

[DakRadz]

Eclipse:
Someone has to play devil's advocate. Now you've substantiated that position with a rather steadfast argument.

I just wanted to point out that having a PDF form that can be downloaded, saved, and printed as needed is not a bad back-up plan. We have so many redundancies in our program already, what will it hurt to have some that are actually very useful or have potential to be so?

[SARDOC]

If you do not have access to ORMS I don't see an issue with doing a hand receipt on a CAPF 37...heck...put it on the back of a napkin if that is all you have.  Just remember it needs to be entered in ORMS.

[SarDragon]

If you do not have access to ORMS I don't see an issue with doing a hand receipt on a CAPF 37...heck...put it on the back of a napkin if that is all you have.  Just remember it needs to be entered in ORMS.

Hence the OP's concern. The CAPF 37 is no longer readily available. I may have one available on my other computer. Gimme overnight to find it.

[Eclipse]

Hot off the ORMS.  Courtesy of the techno elite.

[SarDragon]

Kool. I didn't dig deep enough when I was in ORMS earlier. Thought they were there, but if not, I had them available locally.

[Extremepredjudice]

Eclipse, I am seriously concerned.

If you are a "techie", and you think the internet will always be up?
For SHAME!  It won't, you should know this!

We've seen it time and again. In fact, I may have seen something about the japanese having the same problem. They used digital stuff, but they had to internet, so they swotched back to paper.

Oh and, satellite internet goes out more often than cable.


If having paper copies makes us look old and disconnected, then we are.

[jimmydeanno]

The amount of time that the internet would be down in an operational area is minimal, as to only cause a slight blip in operations.  The worst that happens is that someone whips out their scratch pad and writes who they gave the radios to, even if they don't have a CAPF 37.  Not a big deal.

[Eclipse]

We've seen it time and again.

Seen what where?

Oh and, satellite internet goes out more often than cable.

Really? And you would know this from your extensive use and experience with it, where?

Don't confuse FEMA remote infrastructure systems with flaky rural internet access services.   

Further, those systems are not always satellite based, but can also be sight-to-sight microwave links that just point back to where things are working.  Which, BTW, is where the ICP is supposed to be located by ICS doctrine - in an area of safety and robust infrastructure, not next to the sink hole, on the eastern eyewall.

You mentioned before that cloud services fail.  Using a distributed cloud actually reduces your risk of failure vs. a locally hosted solution.  A server, or file cabinet full of paper, located at Maxwell, which is destroyed by a disaster of some sort, is simply gone, with no return until someone starts replacing equipment and restoring the backups (assuming those weren't in the desk next to the server).  Cloud services, by design, don't exist "anywhere", and therefore a single site being destroyed has minimal impact on availability.  There might be a delay while things resync themselves, or fail-overs kick in, but at least the wing ITO isn't running to Fry's to buy a new machine and re-install Frontpage in the middle of trying to launch sorties.

The amount of time that the internet would be down in an operational area is minimal, as to only cause a slight blip in operations.  The worst that happens is that someone whips out their scratch pad and writes who they gave the radios to, even if they don't have a CAPF 37.  Not a big deal.

Exactly.

[peter rabbit]

Otherwise any PC will do, which is likely how most would get to ORMS.

The problem is one of the two people involved needs to have access to ORMS. I know that I would not hand off an EF Johnson that is assigned to me unless the other person "signed" for it. I can't afford to replace it and since I can't prove I didn't break it I'd be screwed.

+1. That means while the equipment can be reassigned in ORMS before/as I leave to take it to the other person, I'll have a paper 37 available in case the person can't (or it isn't practical to) 'accept' it in ORMS when I hand it over.