Unknown CAP patch, any help appreciated

kd8gua · October 23, 2009, 12:51:35 AM

Hello board, I am a former cadet and hopefully soon-to-be senior member that is a fan of uniform history and all those good things.

I was at a local surplus store which had two gigantic trunks filled with random patches, anything from USAF Brig Gen epaulets in long and short sizes to the most random assortment of ancient USAAC and USMC items. Digging through I found 15 different CAP wing patches (not counting the doubles, triples, etc. through the masses), one incomplete HIWG patch, a large number of 1950s CAPC Encampment patches (unused), and a *new* patch I haven't seen on any CAP history website.

I will be hyperlinking to my public Facebook gallery for this photo, but also a text description:

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=51975482&l=dc15073e18&id=12428081

Rectangular blue patch about 4" tall x 3.25" - 3.5" wide. White embroidered edge. Red bars at top and bottom, top side has white lettering that reads "USAF AUXILIARY." Bottom side reads "CIVIL AIR PATROL." In the blue field (non-embroidered cloth) is a large version of the Civil Defense prop logo, non-circular.

In the photo I have placed this mysterious patch next to a CAPC Encampment patch for those of you familiar with the size of that patch, to give a comparison.

Thanks for all of your help!

IceNine · October 23, 2009, 01:24:16 AM

Try here http://www.incountry.us/cappatches/

Ace has one of the larger collections around and certainly the largest online.

kd8gua · October 23, 2009, 01:55:38 AM

I actually already was there. I went through every single patch gallery, and could not find anything on this mysterious patch.

IceNine · October 23, 2009, 02:52:17 AM

I looked to and didn't see them.

We have a couple top notch historians and patch collectors here that I'm certain will weigh in.

Good luck!

Hawk200 · October 23, 2009, 04:16:24 AM

I've seen loads of all kinds of patches, but this one is new.

Judging from the merrowing, I'd say it was produced in the last twenty years. The coloring says "'80's" to me for some reason.

It almost seems like an attempt to mirror the Army star patch, but the style doesn't really fit either. Considering what they've been playing with on the Volunteer magazine, it seems like they might have something to do with it.

I'd be curious as to who produced it.

kd8gua · October 23, 2009, 06:22:43 AM

I uploaded the photo to TinyPic so I could embed it on the board here too. I really hope someone knows what this patch is, because right now it seems as if I've unearthed a never-before-seen item.

alamrcn · October 23, 2009, 04:41:42 PM

Quote from: IceNine on October 23, 2009, 01:24:16 AMTry here http://www.incountry.us/cappatches/
Ace has one of the larger collections around and certainly the largest online.

Thanks!

I actaully varified last year with other collectors out there that somehow I've assembled the LARGEST private preservation of CAP insignia in the world! Comparatively, the CAP National HQ Archives collection is just short of twice the size of mine, heh.

Anyway, I might have seen that patch in one of the books I have. It certainly looks familiar, so I'll try to remember and check tonight for us.

Майор Хаткевич · October 23, 2009, 04:59:48 PM

Quote from: alamrcn on October 23, 2009, 04:41:42 PM
Quote from: IceNine on October 23, 2009, 01:24:16 AMTry here http://www.incountry.us/cappatches/
Ace has one of the larger collections around and certainly the largest online.

Thanks!

I actaully varified last year with other collectors out there that somehow I've assembled the LARGEST private preservation of CAP insignia in the world! Comparatively, the CAP National HQ Archives collection is just short of twice the size of mine, heh.

Anyway, I might have seen that patch in one of the books I have. It certainly looks familiar, so I'll try to remember and check tonight for us.

I see that you are short IL-049 patch (the new version). I may have an extra one somewhere.

IceNine · October 23, 2009, 05:34:42 PM

New Palwaukee patch?

You mean the one at the bottom that Bob made? or a newer one than that?

Майор Хаткевич · October 23, 2009, 05:37:17 PM

The bottom one that he has under the "do not have" section.

alamrcn · October 24, 2009, 12:55:33 AM

I was right, it was in two of the books I have. There is also a copy of it in the National Archives collection, but it's listed as "unidentified"

Sorry that I can't help more with this one.

Yes, I most certainly have NOT yet been able to preserve one of the new Palwaukee patches. I tried hooking up with Major Williams a few times on it, but with out success. He did help me to get one of the Group 22 HQ awhile ago. So you're able to hook a brother up, that would be awesome! I certainly will reimburse you the cost of the patch and postage.

kd8gua · October 24, 2009, 01:16:29 AM

Quote from: alamrcn on October 24, 2009, 12:55:33 AM
I was right, it was in two of the books I have. There is also a copy of it in the National Archives collection, but it's listed as "unidentified"

Would you like a higher quality scan of this patch to add to your gallery of patches? Maybe someone, somewhere, can help us and the National Archives figure out what it is.

Gunner C · October 24, 2009, 09:00:28 PM

Just a guess here: this is probably from or after the era when the CAP seal was changed so "United States Air Force Auxiliary" was changed from the bottom to the top. Before that, I never saw any CAP stuff that didn't feature "Civil Air Patrol" at the top. That might be a starting point for the search.

alamrcn · October 24, 2009, 09:29:47 PM

Quote from: kd8gua on October 24, 2009, 01:16:29 AM
Would you like a higher quality scan of this patch to add to your gallery of patches? Maybe someone, somewhere, can help us and the National Archives figure out what it is.

Yes please!

pthorburn42@gmail.com · February 15, 2010, 05:38:39 AM

The one on the left that says CAPC is civil air patrol cadet patch that goes back in histroy about 50 years when they had brown uniforms. then the one on the right is a shoulder patch for civil air patrol and they havent been worn for over 30 years!any other questions, let me know!

SarDragon · February 16, 2010, 07:26:18 AM

Quote from: pthorburn42@gmail.com on February 15, 2010, 05:38:39 AM
The one on the left that says CAPC is civil air patrol cadet patch that goes back in histroy about 50 years when they had brown uniforms. then the one on the right is a shoulder patch for civil air patrol and they havent been worn for over 30 years!any other questions, let me know!

Got some more info on the one on the right? Source? Which uniform was it worn on? Time frame?

flyboy53 · February 16, 2010, 04:03:25 PM

The big one is a commercial patch and has no official basis...big at surplus stores and discount stores with sewing sections. The other little encampment patch is what used to be awarded to cadets about four or five decades ago for completion of an encampment.

flyboy53 · February 16, 2010, 04:06:59 PM

Quote from: SarDragon on February 16, 2010, 07:26:18 AM
Quote from: pthorburn42@gmail.com on February 15, 2010, 05:38:39 AM

Got some more info on the one on the right? Source? Which uniform was it worn on? Time frame?

Check e-bay or Amazon.Com and look for the three CAP Manuals from 1949. One had color plates of uniform insignia, patches, ribbons, etc. There also are a number of old historical monographs and a recent book that details our uniforms.

James Shaw · February 17, 2010, 01:35:37 PM

Quote from: kd8gua on October 23, 2009, 06:22:43 AM
I uploaded the photo to TinyPic so I could embed it on the board here too. I really hope someone knows what this patch is, because right now it seems as if I've unearthed a never-before-seen item.

I have seen this patch in a photo from a school unit that was done in the late 1970's. It was used for the school uniform until they went to a more standard approach. This was considered a "transition" patch. That is the reason it has the USAF Auxiliary on the top and not CAP. Several years later they changed to a more standard look with CAP on the top and USAF Aux on the bottom. It sort of matched the Army JROTC style.