Civil Air Patrol Homeland Security Support Act

[Larry Mangum]

My source is a Fox News report that was picked up nationally after the story surfaced on local stations in the Southwest.

But what do I know?  I've been declared a "Threat to National Security" by Napolitano.

You do realize that she apologized and that the VFW accepted the apology, right?

VFW wasn't speaking for me...

Ditto

[JayT]

Right, because Keith Obermann and Matt Lower are top notch reporters on the other side of the house.

Did I say they were?

Glenn Beck makes Bill O'Reilly and Shawn Hannity appear downright stable by comparison. And it's also well known that Fox has a bias against the curren administration and government.

This is the same network, of course, that photoshops pictures of their enemies to make them look worst.

[notaNCO forever]

Right, because Keith Obermann and Matt Lower are top notch reporters on the other side of the house.

Did I say they were?

Glenn Beck makes Bill O'Reilly and Shawn Hannity appear downright stable by comparison. And it's also well known that Fox has a bias against the curren administration and government.

This is the same network, of course, that photoshops pictures of their enemies to make them look worst.

Compared to Glenn Beck anyone looks sane. I personally don't watch any major news network because it's mostly bashing either democrats our republicans.

[JayT]

But back to topic........

What additional training would be required for homeland security support? Do you think it'll be mostly air crew/comms stuff?

[RiverAux]

That is probably what will be part of the study should the bill be approved. 

[JohnKachenmeister]

My source is a Fox News report that was picked up nationally after the story surfaced on local stations in the Southwest.

But what do I know?  I've been declared a "Threat to National Security" by Napolitano.

You do realize that she apologized and that the VFW accepted the apology, right?

You realize she has never withdrawn the memo, right?

[JohnKachenmeister]

Right, because Keith Obermann and Matt Lower are top notch reporters on the other side of the house.

Did I say they were?

Glenn Beck makes Bill O'Reilly and Shawn Hannity appear downright stable by comparison. And it's also well known that Fox has a bias against the curren administration and government.

This is the same network, of course, that photoshops pictures of their enemies to make them look worst.

"Well-known" by whom?

O'Reilly rated the first hundred days of Obama and gave him a "B" on domestic policy and a "C" on foreign policy.  Now that may not be the fawning, slobbering adoration of MSNBC, but it is a long way from "Bias against."

[JohnKachenmeister]

Can you point me in the direction of the Fox news report. Was it a written report that I can find on thier website?

I heard it on TV.  I have not checked the website.

[Gunner C]

Right, because Keith Obermann and Matt Lower are top notch reporters on the other side of the house.

Did I say they were?

Glenn Beck makes Bill O'Reilly and Shawn Hannity appear downright stable by comparison. And it's also well known that Fox has a bias against the curren administration and government.

This is the same network, of course, that photoshops pictures of their enemies to make them look worst.

"Well-known" by whom?

O'Reilly rated the first hundred days of Obama and gave him a "B" on domestic policy and a "C" on foreign policy.  Now that may not be the fawning, slobbering adoration of MSNBC, but it is a long way from "Bias against."

I'd say something about JT drinking kool-aide, but it was flavor-aide.  If one listens to the opinions of others rather than listening personally, then one will have their information filtered.  [/drift]

The CAP HSSA will never become law IMO.  It doesn't have a large enough constituency.  Even with the HUGE savings it would generate for the nation, no one will care - it only affects 10 or 20 thousand votes. 

[JohnKachenmeister]

Right, because Keith Obermann and Matt Lower are top notch reporters on the other side of the house.

Did I say they were?

Glenn Beck makes Bill O'Reilly and Shawn Hannity appear downright stable by comparison. And it's also well known that Fox has a bias against the curren administration and government.

This is the same network, of course, that photoshops pictures of their enemies to make them look worst.

"Well-known" by whom?

O'Reilly rated the first hundred days of Obama and gave him a "B" on domestic policy and a "C" on foreign policy.  Now that may not be the fawning, slobbering adoration of MSNBC, but it is a long way from "Bias against."

I'd say something about JT drinking kool-aide, but it was flavor-aide.  If one listens to the opinions of others rather than listening personally, then one will have their information filtered.  [/drift]

The CAP HSSA will never become law IMO.  It doesn't have a large enough constituency.  Even with the HUGE savings it would generate for the nation, no one will care - it only affects 10 or 20 thousand votes.

Gunner:

I agree with you that the chance of this bill actually becoming a law are somewhere between "Slim" and "None," but for a somewhat different reason.  We can ALREADY do that which the new bill would allow us to do.  We just have to do it as an element of the Air Force.

Anytime the CAP is supporting any agency of the Federal Govt., we do so as the auxiliary of the Air Force.  This bill is a remnant of the reign of HWSRN, and his goal was to actually place CAP under the DHS in a co-equal position with the Coast Guard.  (The US Civil Air Patrol, you might recall.)

Now there MIGHT be some fine-tuning of the laws related to Posse Comitatus, which might allow the CAP to engage more directly in support of Federal law enforcement, but to allow the DHS to directly task CAP without the CAP falling under the USAF won't happen.  And, in my Threat to National Security opinion, shouldn't happen.

[Spike]

This bill is a remnant of the reign of HWSRN, and his goal was to actually place CAP under the DHS in a co-equal position with the Coast Guard. 

You are mistaken Sir.  It is not a remnant of Pineda.  This never came from Pineda, was never suggested by Pineda and never originated in any Office associated with Pineda. 

The only things that are remnants of Pineda are our Senior Leadership. 

[JohnKachenmeister]

This bill is a remnant of the reign of HWSRN, and his goal was to actually place CAP under the DHS in a co-equal position with the Coast Guard. 

You are mistaken Sir.  It is not a remnant of Pineda.  This never came from Pineda, was never suggested by Pineda and never originated in any Office associated with Pineda. 

The only things that are remnants of Pineda are our Senior Leadership.

You will, of course, forgive my skepticism, since I recall HWSRN testifying in support of the proposal. 

I recall it since he was wearing his then-brand-new TPU while other military folk wore ACU/BDU, and that sartorial difference was the origin of numerous comments on-line.

[C/MSgt Lunsford]

"This bill will authorize the Department of Homeland Security to enlist Civil Air Patrol (CAP) assets to help in the fight to keep our borders secure," Congressman Dent said. "This bill emerged in part from what I learned on a Congressional delegation trip to the U.S.-Mexico border at Laredo, Texas."

Sounds Interesting. 

[Gunner C]

Gunner:

I agree with you that the chance of this bill actually becoming a law are somewhere between "Slim" and "None," but for a somewhat different reason.  We can ALREADY do that which the new bill would allow us to do.  We just have to do it as an element of the Air Force.

Anytime the CAP is supporting any agency of the Federal Govt., we do so as the auxiliary of the Air Force.  This bill is a remnant of the reign of HWSRN, and his goal was to actually place CAP under the DHS in a co-equal position with the Coast Guard.  (The US Civil Air Patrol, you might recall.)

Now there MIGHT be some fine-tuning of the laws related to Posse Comitatus, which might allow the CAP to engage more directly in support of Federal law enforcement, but to allow the DHS to directly task CAP without the CAP falling under the USAF won't happen.  And, in my Threat to National Security opinion, shouldn't happen.

This is yet another dimension of the issue.  IMHO, we'll never get our share of DHS missions as long as Ma Blue is the sole arbitor of who flies them. 

(History to make the point)
For years, congress allotted BIG bucks for Special Operations Forces but the three services siphoned off the money.  We literally had to buy some of our own equipment while the money earmarked for us was diverted into barracks upgrades for non-SOF unites.  Congress finally got so tired of what the services were doing, they pulled all SOF funding, including salaries, and put it in a separate program fund (if memory serves) Program 11.  Army, Navy, and USAF aren't able to touch it - it is soley managed by USSOCOM, making it nearly a separate service.  The moral of the story:  the services (USAF in our case) are going to look out for themselves, not for side shows like SOF or CAP.

Until congress passes a law giving us training money to get us up to speed and keep us trained, makes CAP the "go-to" component, and generally gets the Posse Com stuff ironed out, we'll be in the same rut.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Gunner:

I agree with you that the chance of this bill actually becoming a law are somewhere between "Slim" and "None," but for a somewhat different reason.  We can ALREADY do that which the new bill would allow us to do.  We just have to do it as an element of the Air Force.

Anytime the CAP is supporting any agency of the Federal Govt., we do so as the auxiliary of the Air Force.  This bill is a remnant of the reign of HWSRN, and his goal was to actually place CAP under the DHS in a co-equal position with the Coast Guard.  (The US Civil Air Patrol, you might recall.)

Now there MIGHT be some fine-tuning of the laws related to Posse Comitatus, which might allow the CAP to engage more directly in support of Federal law enforcement, but to allow the DHS to directly task CAP without the CAP falling under the USAF won't happen.  And, in my Threat to National Security opinion, shouldn't happen.

This is yet another dimension of the issue.  IMHO, we'll never get our share of DHS missions as long as Ma Blue is the sole arbitor of who flies them. 

(History to make the point)
For years, congress allotted BIG bucks for Special Operations Forces but the three services siphoned off the money.  We literally had to buy some of our own equipment while the money earmarked for us was diverted into barracks upgrades for non-SOF unites.  Congress finally got so tired of what the services were doing, they pulled all SOF funding, including salaries, and put it in a separate program fund (if memory serves) Program 11.  Army, Navy, and USAF aren't able to touch it - it is soley managed by USSOCOM, making it nearly a separate service.  The moral of the story:  the services (USAF in our case) are going to look out for themselves, not for side shows like SOF or CAP.

Until congress passes a law giving us training money to get us up to speed and keep us trained, makes CAP the "go-to" component, and generally gets the Posse Com stuff ironed out, we'll be in the same rut.

Well, we still can contract with state agencies and get THEIR DHS $$.  There are certain advantages to being a corporation.  In Florida, we expect that as much as 50 percent of our missions will be state funded.  More if we get hit with a lot of hurricanes.

[PaulR]

But what do I know?  I've been declared a "Threat to National Security" by Napolitano.

That makes two of us...  I am shocked and dismayed to hear my own "boss" say that about her own Iraq war vets...

[PaulR]

You do realize that she apologized and that the VFW accepted the apology, right?

Merely a PR formality... Unfortunately, we all know where her faith and beliefs lay.

I thought that the Air Force set aside a pot of money for the sole use of the CAP?  How much is this, annually?  Also, where do the Dues go?  I am about to pay my first senior membership check in CA...  Not cheap by any means!

[Auxpilot]

Right, because Keith Obermann and Matt Lower are top notch reporters on the other side of the house.

And it's also well known that Fox has a bias against the current administration and government.

OK I have to ask - can anyone give me one piece of data that supports the "bias" claim here? Maybe as opposed to the other networks getting all soft in the knees when ever our current president walks into the room.

Remember why the founders gave the press the protections that they have - the ones that heros have died protecting - so they could be the ones that watched every move that our government makes to be sure that they are serving us, not the other way around.

Personally I have no problem that MSNBC had bad things to say about President Bush (when they were real, not fabricated) because he made some mistakes along the way and without good reporting (like watergate) we would never have known about it.

That being said, notwithstanding Fox news, the press in general is doing a terrible job at reporting and a great job at cheerleading. What Fox is doing is not bias, it's just calling them like they see them.

BTW - Sean Hannity is not Fox News any more than Alan Colmes is. They are commentators not reporters so don't use them as part of your bias evidence. Give me one example where Fox is more bias than any other news network - I bet you can't.

[Smithsonia]

OK this just strayed into my field. Nancy Grace, Kieth Obermann, Shawn Hannity, Matt Lauer, Rush Limbaugh, etc. are entertainers. They are opinion - policy commentators.
They are NOT news journalist, news people, reporters, or news readers. They are the same as anyone at a cocktail party who spouts off about everything... although in this case it's a big cocktail party and their voice carries.

In an effort to make news more plentiful (24 hours on CNN etc) Folks at the networks needed people to push the stories to be important - to matter to the viewing audience - to be provocative - to make people care about things they don't normally care about - to boil the various sides of an issue down to a few phrases, cliches, sayings, etc.

This commentator thing has blurred the lines. Even straight news folks, because they have time to fill, now routinely give a personal comment... and are therefore commentators.

You (Mr. and Mrs. America) need to develop the skills to see the sell and differentiate that sell from actual fact. YOU are now the editor. YOU have to look at things with an editorial eye. This eye is NOT cynical but critical. Analysis of the commentators - not to what they say - but how they support their issue - which facts they rely upon. This is an important thing to learn in this media rich environment.

My answer is to pick authoritative sources, read more, view less, be responsible for your own brain and what is in it.

[Spike]

^ I would add that we need to stop acting on opinion and feelings, but on Fact itself.  If every person in the world would stop letting their emotional and opinion driven subconscious mind drive their actions, everything would be positive in the world. 

The universe is not Positive and Negative.  It is only Positive.  Humans create the negativity, and have little faith in themselves. 

I am so tired of politics.  Our society is driven and too dependent on our political faces. 

Anyway, off my philosophical wagon.  Back to the CAP Homeland Security Support Act.....

Anyone heard anything new??