Would you correct them?

[RiverAux]

We've all seen senior members (and even occassional cadets) who for one reason or another are wearing a uniform that violates one or more CAP uniform regulations. 

Personally, I get uncomfortable correcting others about uniform issues unless I'm in their chain of command.  Even if you approach the situation as delicately as possible, you're still telling another adult that they're doing something wrong and should fix it and you come out either as a know-it-all or someone who thinks they have the right to order someone around when in fact they don't. 

For me this is an issue regardless of the grade of the other person.  Now, if CAP were the actual military I don't think I would have any problem at all telling someone I outranked to fix something on their uniform, but in CAP we are basically all co-equal adults unless the chain of command is involved. 

Tricky situation.  Thoughts?

[MIKE]

It depends... Lately, in my current non-CAP situation I concern myself with my own uniform... Passive example... but if somebody has a question about the uniform, I'll speak up then.  CAP would be a bit different though...

[Pylon]

At training functions like SLS's and CLC's, I've gone around and helped other senior members with their uniforms and correcting minor infractions.  Since the most common infractions I saw were clearly unintentional (up-side-down membership or leadership ribbons, too many badges on the corporate shirt, etc.) people were generally grateful when I pointed it out to them.  I always brought it up in a friendly, "Hey, did you know..." kind of tone whenever I could find the person during a break or down-time when we weren't around many other people.  It was always received with appreciation by the other s'members, even though I was the youngest guy in the room.

Fellow SM's in my unit?  Sure; we're all on friendly terms.  I point something out and people are generally appreciative and respond with something along the lines of "Oh really?  Huh... didn't know that!"

Would I correct the random Lt Col I didn't know at a Wing Conference?  Probably not a chance.  It all depends on the situation.  Since in the first scenario, we were all already in a "learning" environment, we were all company-grade CAP officers and I was able to catch them privately it worked.

Situation, tone, familiarity with the person in question, and the type of infraction have a lot to do with it, for me.

[CadetProgramGuy]

I voted for the correct everyone, regardless.

Back in the day, I was SM, and Gen Glasgow had a uniform violation.....One of his frogs fell off and his NEC or NB badge on his Mess was dangling. (BTW he was in a receiving line as well......)

Kinda important.

Others in the past,  I tend to pull aside and try to help out.  Some take the help, some don't.

[MIKE]

Thought I'd add:  If you are a squadron command it is your responsibility/duty to insure that those under your command wear the uniform correctly.

[RickFranz]

I have tried very hard to ensure members of the unit that I am in are really squared away.  However I did have one member that I never told his ribbons where wrong.  He was a WWII vet that lost his arm in combat.  He wore two purple hearts.  I asked him about it once, and he told me he actually had 3 of them.  He said, I wear two of them and I guess you can figure out where the third one is, as he motioned to the side where his arm had been.  I know the rules but if he wore his ribbons that way I figured he had earned the right!  I sure was not going to tell him he was wrong and no one else did either.  I had to much respect for the man.  I did make sure all his CAP ribbons where in order.

[CadetProgramGuy]

I have tried very hard to ensure members of the unit that I am in are really squared away.  However I did have one member that I never told his ribbons where wrong.  He was a WWII vet that lost his arm in combat.  He wore two purple hearts.  I asked him about it once, and he told me he actually had 3 of them.  He said, I wear two of them and I guess you can figure out where the third one is, as he motioned to the side where his arm had been.  I know the rules but if he wore his ribbons that way I figured he had earned the right!  I sure was not going to tell him he was wrong and no one else did either.  I had to much respect for the man.  I did make sure all his CAP ribbons where in order.

Thank you sir!!  (salute, about face, walk away)

[sarflyer]

It's important that we all take care of each other and how we represent the organization.  So correcting them is very important.  But just as important is how you correct them. 

Observing a violation and then "telling" them it's wrong wouldn't be too tactful.  Maybe saying something like, "Sir, isn't your name badge supposed to be on the right side?"  It gives them a chance to answer.  I have seen uniform violations pointed out both ways.  Demeaning someone is no way to gain cooperation.

We have to work together! 

[jimmydeanno]

I have absolutely no problem telling people that their uniform is jacked up.

A few years ago at encampment there was a 2d Lt who was the grandmother of one of the cadets.  Every morning she'd come out and have things wrong like wearing her flight cap backwards, buttons off by one, tennis shoes, etc.  All week I was correcting her violations - and as the week went on she got increasingly impatient with my corrections.  I was tactful and never chewed her out for it.

At the "banquet" she showed up wearing her service coat and had her ribbon rack on upside down (there was a single ribbon on the bottom row and the complete rows above it).  So, I corrected her but got the reply, "well...I just can't seem to do anything right in your eyes, huh?"  Still not really sure how I could have handled those situations without gaining an enemy, but not really sure the onus is really on me.

But recently my focus on uniform violations have gone from "hey, your cutouts are crooked." to getting people to stop impersonating AF officers.

The TPU has brought out a whole new animal.  When it first rolled out (same encampment as above) the encampment deputy commander was wearing the AF style unifrom with the AF epaulets and the blue TPU nametag.  I pulled him aside and told him he couldn't wear it like that, and he tried to correct my correction.  He said, "I'll show you the change letter that says I can."  So he brings the letter and of course it says, "white aviator shirt."  But, alas he makes up some weird mis-interpretation and refuses to change it.  So...at that point, he just looks like an a$$ (yes, I subverted the language filter.), but what do I know.

More recently I've had to correct a few members for wearing AF stuff on their uniforms and it's driving me crazy.  Here's an example.  I am at an airshow working a recruiting booth for CAP.  A guy from "wing" shows up to help and he's wearing BDUs with the gortex parka.  On the outside of the parka he's got an AF Capt gortex parka tab.  Since it is a flightline, he's not wearing a hat.  The only indentifiable insignia on his uniform says he is a "real" captain.  When called out on it he says, "Well, Vanguard doesn't have the CAP ones yet, what do you want me to do?" - "Take it off."  He responded with, "there isn't any reason to get bent out of shape about it, I always take pride in my uniform and wear it properly, so when they have the right insignia, I'll get it."

As the day wore on, he took his parka off and wouldn't you know it...ranger tab, etc.  Go figure.

It just seems that these types of violations are happening more frequently.  But, like I said, I have no problems correcting people and I do it in a courteous and professional manner.  However, I just get blown off, probably because I'm a 26 year old punk kid that doesn't know what I'm talking about... (sarcasm).

[sarflyer]

Stick to your guns!  The regulations support you!  And you are in the majority.  We have standards that must be followed.   When you get an attitude from someone then you can follow the chain.  You will succeed. 

Also remember, we don't stay that 26 year old kid, do we?

"Proudly serving since 1976!"

[JoeTomasone]

My most-oft "suggestion" is to stow the BDU cover in the BDU trouser cargo pocket. It's shocking how many either don't know the reg (when asked) or just outright ignore it.   Still some cadets who missed the 1 March 2008 deadline for having the chevrons on both collars and ditching the CAP cutouts.

One thing I always do is make sure my uniform is correct BEFORE correcting others.

[O-Rex]

One of these days, some idiot wearing 1550's with blue epaulets and other illicit acoutrements is going to get arrested for impersonating a USAF Officer, and God knows what they will make us wear as punishment: berry boards redux & tu-tus.

Unfortunately, we will have deserved our fate.

We are our own biggest enemy: alot of our members just don't get it.

[SDF_Specialist]

When I first came back as a SM, I corrected a Lt. Col. because of a patch that was way off on the shoulder. He looked at the patch, looked at me, and said "thanks. I never noticed have crappy it looked." I think it all depends on how you approach the situation.

[Fifinella]

I am currently a squadron CC, and am therefore responsible for the appearance of all of the squadron's SMs.  Also, I have no problem correcting folks who show up to an event I am running.  

Otherwise, if it is someone over whom I have no authority, I try to discreetly mention it to the member, or if they outrank me, I mention it to someone who is in their chain-of-command.

Exception: If we are on a military installation or at a cadet event, I will mention it to the individual, regardless of rank, but I try to be very, very tactful.  

[Duke Dillio]

When I went to SLS, we had the standard uniform class.  The instructor, an ex-Navy guy I think, was wearing his blue jacket all day until the class.  When he started the class, he whipped off the jacket to expose his short sleeve blue shirt with ribbons and badges on.  He had placed his wing patch on the wrong shoulder on purpose.  So, he gets through about 10 minutes of the class and then asks us what is wrong with his uniform.  We all raised our hands and he picked someone who said that the patch was on the wrong side.  He said good job and started to talk again when I raised my hand.  Befuddled, he said "Yes?"  I then told him that he had asked us what was wrong with his uniform and then told him that his ribbons were on upside down (all military on the bottom with the top left being his membership ribbon, correct order of precedence, just an upside down 12 ribbon holder.)  He thanked me and that's when the other hands started going up.....

-  Wrong belt for blues (BDU style instead of nickel)
-  Wearing unshined tennis shoes instead of shined dress shoes
-  Wearing an unauthorized badge (surface warfare I think)
-  Pants too long, draped over tennis shoes
-  Not meeting grooming standards (goatee)
-  and on and on.....

So I had to laugh at him when he saw me later and asked if I was sure that his ribbons were on upside down....

[0]

When I've done it I do it politely because we're both volunteers.  I've even offered to help teach them the right way.  Once I even gave up my name plate off my blues shirt (because I had the Service Coat on) when I saw another member without a nameplate.  His hadn't come in yet. 

[DNall]

So I can choose all six options in this poll? nice.

I got no issue with correcting anyone at any time regardless of rank, unit, or position. If I do so or not has more to do with it being appropriate in the situation, or good use of my time/energy. Generally I'll say something, but it's not my priority.

[Chappie]

When I first joined CAP, everytime I would an event I would wear the UOD to a squadron meeting and have the Cadets inspect my uniform.

On another note, it is a common practice at the Pacific Region Chaplain Service Staff College to have a daily uniform inspection.  A great practice since we are usually conducting the event on an active AF base.

[0]

When I first joined CAP, everytime I would an event I would wear the UOD to a squadron meeting and have the Cadets inspect my uniform.

On another note, it is a common practice at the Pacific Region Chaplain Service Staff College to have a daily uniform inspection.  A great practice since we are usually conducting the event on an active AF base.

I wish we did more Senior Uniform Inspections.  I mean if we expect our Cadets to wear the uniform correctly, shouldn't we? 

[jimmydeanno]

Chappie, not meant as an insult, but I think you just brought up something.

This year I heard that on the first day of NSC they spent time going over uniforms because one of the attendees had an apple in their blues shirt pocket.

We have uniform inspections at command and executive level events, RSC, RCSC, NSC, etc.  This year at RSC we had a "uniform class."  It just struck me as odd.

Does anyone else think it absurd that we STILL need to actively inspect/go over proper wear of the uniform for our most "experienced" and "qualified" officers?

We put in all this effort on something as simple as putting on your clothes.  I mean, by the time you're going to RSC, NSC, etc you (on average) have 5 years or more in CAP.  We must be doing something wrong, when I put on my uniform I don't even think about where stuff goes, it's just habit - ya know?

Where do we go wrong...(rhetorical)