Should Cadets Under 18 be Required to Meet Weight Standards?

[Eagle400]

Senior members and cadets age 18 and older must meet CAP weight standards to wear AF-style uniforms.  See Attachment 1.

Should cadets younger than age 18 be required to meet CAP weight standards?

[LtCol White]

No, this is a VERY bad idea. First, USAF doesn't require it of us. Second, if you do this, then you're telling a cadet "You're to fat to be part of the others". At the age of some of these "kids", you're sending a bad message and singling them out that they don't fit in. In many cases, this is one of the difficulties they experience at school and home. The cadet program is to be inclusive. It is designed to help build self esteem and confidence. Setting cadets apart because of their weight and making them wear a different uniform defeats this and is highly counterproductive. This is where having a PT program for the cadets comes in. These cadets can be coached and mentored to help them perform better in PT as needed. As part of this they can be counselled on proper eating and helped to develop an at home PT program to get them in shape and perhaps drop the excess weight. Setting the apart can destroy an otherwise good cadet and potential leader at a very early age that can carry over into adulthood since the cadet/adolescent years are the most critical to their develpment and performance later in life as adults.

[BillB]

Nationally the arguement rages about obese kids. But who is to define obese? Can you compare a 5'8" 25 year old that weighs 185 to a 5'8" thirteen year old that weighs 185? The answer is no due to bone differences and muscle development at the different age levels. The 13 year old may be obese even though he may meet the weight standard. The 13 year old may still be growing and at age 25 may be 6'3" and still weigh that 185 pounds. There is not a good way to determine obesity in the 12-17 year old cadet

[DNall]

I'm saying no, & let me tell you what I think, and I believe the AF may agree with me on this... They don't require it cause they don't want to preclude participation by kids at that level, but over 18 they are responsible adults of military age & represent the AF in a way that a 12yo obviously doesn't to the public. I've had several including one right now that come along over weight & really get into a program like CAP or JROTC, then when it comes time to push on to a mil career they are motivated to get in shape. If they'd been denied that chance as a cadet, they'd neither be getting in shape or into the military, nor would they have access to the resources & experience on how to work out & be healthy.

[Eagle400]

Does anyone know if AFJROTC requires their cadets to meet weight standards?

[DNall]

I said that already, no they don't. We're under mostly the same rules on this, they come from the same source.

[jimmydeanno]

I give this a firm...no.  I agree with everything posted above about singling out young cadets and telling them they are too fat.  This, IMO, is where the PT program comes in.

The goal of the cadet physical fitness program is to make you physically fit and to motivate you to develop a lifelong habit of exercising regularly.

So the assumption is that you will come into the program "un-fit" and through our PT program become fit and develop good habits regarding fitness.  It serves to build confidence in the cadets as they get stronger and healthier, etc.

So mandating that a cadet already be "fit" I think is unreasonable.  Now those over 18, are another exception.  Cadets over 18 can be viewed by the public as "members of the Air Force" and having them overweight in their uniform can project a bad image, whereas a 13 year old cadet is seen as a cadet merely by their age, and the assumption is that he is doing exercise and hopefully "thinning out."

[RogueLeader]

I gave my answer as a conditional yes.  they should be allowed to participate, so long as they are working towards the weight standrads.  In no way should be precluded, or barred from joining.  It is not only good for them, it makes the uniform look good too.

[dwb]

No.  Teenagers' bodies change a lot during puberty, it doesn't make sense to apply a standard until the body reaches its adult proportions.

Furthermore, you want to encourage fitness, not mark people with a big red "X".

[Sgt. Savage]

Thank you Jimmy Deano, I was going to reference that same source. The goal is to encourage fitness, not point out the lack there of. I spent month running with a "husky" kid. He ran farther each time until he reached the mile without stopping. He's more fit and finishes everytime now; I never talked down to him, always told him how great he was doing and when he was down on himself, I reflected on how far he had come since he started.

If he was singled out as a fat kid, I imagine he could have quit before realizing his potential.

[mikeylikey]

Has any one found themselves in the following situation........a "heavy" cadet who can't find BDU's that fit, or a pair of blue pants or a blue AF jacket?  The jackets DO stop at a certain size.  It is unfortunate, but it is a fact of life that there are fat kids running around.  Perhaps we should help these kids out and introduce them to healthy life habits. 

(I was a fatty, so don't jump on me for calling them fat!)

[Hawk200]

I've never been a "fatty" as some are calling them, I was on the other end at those ages.

I've been attending an Army school for almost two months, and even though I'm not really overweight, I'm wasn't really happy with some of the extra weight (for me) that I have/had around the middle.

I've had to do PT every weekday, and the first few weeks, I was running every day. I guess it could be a coincidence, but today was the first day I did a run, and actually felt good during it.

I've already lost weight, and the belly fat is beginning to melt away (like a snowman in the shade at 33 degrees, but's it's going away). It's a huge boost to my morale to see myself getting thinner, healthier, and more fit. I think the same realizations would be a major benefit to a young cadet beginning to realize his/her potential. I don't think singling them out would be of a benefit. And I also think that if some seniors could see the changes that I can in myself, that they might also be inclined to be a little more fit. It's a great feeling, and one I fully intend to maintain.

[JohnKachenmeister]

The CAP standard for weight control is not real good for adults, and potentially unhealthy for teenagers.

It is OK to have a screening weight, or a weight at or below which you are presumed to be healthy.  But that does NOT mean everyone over that screening weight is UN-healthy. 

Above the screening weight, there must be a body fat analysis.  Muscle weighs more than fat.  Football players, weight-lifters, and others with a lot of muscle-mass will NEVER get down to their screening weight, unless a disease process intervenes.

CAP regs do not permit using body fat analysis, even though it is easy to do.

[MIKE]

My only argument for weight standards for cadets under 18 would be similar to mikeylikey's question... Getting cadets into uniforms that fit.  Easily extend that to the really tiny cadets too.  Goes both ways.  I remember hearing about tiny cadets being put into the children's BDUs because extra-small short wasn't small enough.

[RiverAux]

Cadets already have to do PT tests, thats good enough for me.

[Eagle400]

The CAP standard for weight control is not real good for adults, and potentially unhealthy for teenagers.

True.  I believe CAP should abolish its own weight standards and just stick with the Air Force standards.  Besides, the Air Force uniforms are designed to accomidate the Air Force weight standards, not CAP's.     

Above the screening weight, there must be a body fat analysis.  Muscle weighs more than fat.  Football players, weight-lifters, and others with a lot of muscle-mass will NEVER get down to their screening weight, unless a disease process intervenes.

CAP regs do not permit using body fat analysis, even though it is easy to do.

Excellent idea, sir!  The Air Force does.  Why shouldn't CAP?  Like you said, body fat analysis is easy to do. 

[LtCol White]

The CAP standard for weight control is not real good for adults, and potentially unhealthy for teenagers.

True.  I believe CAP should abolish its own weight standards and just stick with the Air Force standards.  Besides, the Air Force uniforms are designed to accomidate the Air Force weight standards, not CAP's.     

Above the screening weight, there must be a body fat analysis.  Muscle weighs more than fat.  Football players, weight-lifters, and others with a lot of muscle-mass will NEVER get down to their screening weight, unless a disease process intervenes.

CAP regs do not permit using body fat analysis, even though it is easy to do.

Excellent idea, sir!  The Air Force does.  Why shouldn't CAP?  Like you said, body fat analysis is easy to do. 

Your thread is about cadets and weight standards, not senior members. Remember??

[Eagle400]

Your thread is about cadets and weight standards, not senior members. Remember??

Yes, sir.  However, cadets who are above age 18 are required to meet CAP weight standards in order to wear the AF-style uniforms. 

[LtCol White]

Your thread is about cadets and weight standards, not senior members. Remember??

Yes, sir.  However, cadets who are above age 18 are required to meet CAP weight standards in order to wear the AF-style uniforms. 

Correct. And no one on here has taken issue with that. But the question you asked when you opened the thread was in regards to cadets UNDER 18

[Eagle400]

Your thread is about cadets and weight standards, not senior members. Remember??

Yes, sir.  However, cadets who are above age 18 are required to meet CAP weight standards in order to wear the AF-style uniforms. 

Correct. And no one on here has taken issue with that. But the question you asked when you opened the thread was in regards to cadets UNDER 18

Sorry for the digression, sir.  Unlike what someone said over at CS recently, I'm not a "topic master." 

Perhaps I should start a new thread.