Aircrew Wings Available

[Storm Chaser]

Regardless of size and preference, all CAP aeronautical wings need to be standardized.

So where do you place the blame... Scamguard or National HQ?

First of all, you're a Major with the U.S. Army Reserve and a CAP National Patron, so please keep your posts professional.

CAPM 39-1 clearly depicts an image of these Aircrew Wings and offers overall length for regular and miniature size badges. Vanguard could have used that as a guideline, however the image itself doesn't constitute a standard or specification.

The responsibility to issue specifications for CAP insignias and to provide adequate oversight resides in NHQ. As the sole contractor/vendor for these insignias, Vanguard also has a responsibility to seek clarification when needed and to have quality control measures in place to ensure specifications are met. But that doesn't relief NHQ from its overall quality assurance responsibility. It's a shared responsibility.

[THRAWN]

So how do they count "Hours" for AP?

Keep a logbook.

[GrimReaper]

Here are the links from CAP HQ about the AC Wings

http://capnhq.custhelp.com/ci/fattach/get/1036/0/filename/CAP+Air+Crew+Badge.pdf
http://capnhq.custhelp.com/ci/fattach/get/1035/0/filename/Badges+39-1+%28Attachment+7%29.pdf

[JeffDG]

Here are the links from CAP HQ about the AC Wings

http://capnhq.custhelp.com/ci/fattach/get/1036/0/filename/CAP+Air+Crew+Badge.pdf
http://capnhq.custhelp.com/ci/fattach/get/1035/0/filename/Badges+39-1+%28Attachment+7%29.pdf

OK, those are neither regulatory, nor is there any reference to a CAPF2A for award.

[GrimReaper]

This is where I got the info originally.  Yes, I know this is not regulatory.

http://capnhq.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2649/kw/aircrew%20wings

[Devil Doc]

So how do they count "Hours" for AP?

Keep a logbook.

So, keep a logbook of how many hours you are on a Sortie, AP or not? Keep a log of when you are on a AP Sortie? Do all of the hours combined, Eg.  Spotter, Scanner, AP, High Bird etc

[Eclipse]

OK, those are neither regulatory, nor is there any reference to a CAPF2A for award.

Nor are they included in with the other awards such as MO or GTM in OPS Quals.

Frankly, a Unit or Wing CC would be well within their authority not to award them or allow their wear
until this is fixed, and if it's to make a point to NHQ about simple things being made too difficult
because "A doesn't talk to B before changing things" then so be it.

[THRAWN]

So how do they count "Hours" for AP?

Keep a logbook.

So, keep a logbook of how many hours you are on a Sortie, AP or not? Keep a log of when you are on a AP Sortie? Do all of the hours combined, Eg.  Spotter, Scanner, AP, High Bird etc

Looks to me like you'd make a notation in your logbook anytime you perform as any of the specialties listed in the AC definition (i.e. Scanner, AP, etc.). If you look at the criteria for the senior and master, it looks like you can combine the hours of any of the specialties.

This is beating the horse a bit more, but there really needs to be a reg written on this. The uni manual has been out for almost a year....

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Regardless of size and preference, all CAP aeronautical wings need to be standardized.

So where do you place the blame... Scamguard or National HQ?

National HQ for not presenting Scamguard with a template: "these is what they shall look like and do not deviate from it, not even one feather."  Unless, of course, they did, and Scamguard just chose to ignore it.

Scamguard for producing cheap crap that just looks bad and unprofessional and getting by with it because they know they're the only game in town.

So, I would say 50/50.

[Shuman 14]

Regardless of size and preference, all CAP aeronautical wings need to be standardized.

So where do you place the blame... Scamguard or National HQ?

First of all, you're a Major with the U.S. Army Reserve and a CAP National Patron, so please keep your posts professional.

CAPM 39-1 clearly depicts an image of these Aircrew Wings and offers overall length for regular and miniature size badges. Vanguard could have used that as a guideline, however the image itself doesn't constitute a standard or specification.

The responsibility to issue specifications for CAP insignias and to provide adequate oversight resides in NHQ. As the sole contractor/vendor for these insignias, Vanguard also has a responsibility to seek clarification when needed and to have quality control measures in place to ensure specifications are met. But that doesn't relief NHQ from its overall quality assurance responsibility. It's a shared responsibility.

So you blame both, got it.

[Shuman 14]

Regardless of size and preference, all CAP aeronautical wings need to be standardized.

So where do you place the blame... Scamguard or National HQ?

National HQ for not presenting Scamguard with a template: "these is what they shall look like and do not deviate from it, not even one feather."  Unless, of course, they did, and Scamguard just chose to ignore it.

Scamguard for producing cheap crap that just looks bad and unprofessional and getting by with it because they know they're the only game in town.

So, I would say 50/50.

Cyborg, don't say Scamguard anymore... it's unprofessional and someone may get a offended by your honesty. 

[Storm Chaser]

Regardless of size and preference, all CAP aeronautical wings need to be standardized.

So where do you place the blame... Scamguard or National HQ?

First of all, you're a Major with the U.S. Army Reserve and a CAP National Patron, so please keep your posts professional.

CAPM 39-1 clearly depicts an image of these Aircrew Wings and offers overall length for regular and miniature size badges. Vanguard could have used that as a guideline, however the image itself doesn't constitute a standard or specification.

The responsibility to issue specifications for CAP insignias and to provide adequate oversight resides in NHQ. As the sole contractor/vendor for these insignias, Vanguard also has a responsibility to seek clarification when needed and to have quality control measures in place to ensure specifications are met. But that doesn't relief NHQ from its overall quality assurance responsibility. It's a shared responsibility.

So you blame both, got it.

I'm not blaming anyone, but merely stating that they're both responsible for getting this done right. That said, NHQ is ultimately responsible for ensuring standards and specifications are met. 

[Storm Chaser]

Regardless of size and preference, all CAP aeronautical wings need to be standardized.

So where do you place the blame... Scamguard or National HQ?

National HQ for not presenting Scamguard with a template: "these is what they shall look like and do not deviate from it, not even one feather."  Unless, of course, they did, and Scamguard just chose to ignore it.

Scamguard for producing cheap crap that just looks bad and unprofessional and getting by with it because they know they're the only game in town.

So, I would say 50/50.

Cyborg, don't say Scamguard anymore... it's unprofessional and someone may get a offended by your honesty. 

I'm not offended; just calling out. You're a military officer and, as such, are held at higher standard.

[Devil Doc]

So how do they count "Hours" for AP?

Keep a logbook.

So, keep a logbook of how many hours you are on a Sortie, AP or not? Keep a log of when you are on a AP Sortie? Do all of the hours combined, Eg.  Spotter, Scanner, AP, High Bird etc

Looks to me like you'd make a notation in your logbook anytime you perform as any of the specialties listed in the AC definition (i.e. Scanner, AP, etc.). If you look at the criteria for the senior and master, it looks like you can combine the hours of any of the specialties.

This is beating the horse a bit more, but there really needs to be a reg written on this. The uni manual has been out for almost a year....

Thank you Thrawn, I dont have nearly enough hours for the Senior Rating or Master, it was just to clear things up. I actually dont have any Do Hickies on my Uniform. I am about to sew on my FMF Pin and that will be it for awhile.

[PHall]

So how do they count "Hours" for AP?

Keep a logbook.

So, keep a logbook of how many hours you are on a Sortie, AP or not? Keep a log of when you are on a AP Sortie? Do all of the hours combined, Eg.  Spotter, Scanner, AP, High Bird etc

Keep a logbook of ALL flying you do in CAP. Trust me, at some point in the future you will be very glad you did.

[lordmonar]

Vanguard sells a nice scanner observer log book with places to log you observer hours and scanner hours

[Private Investigator]

Vanguard sells a nice scanner observer log book with places to log you observer hours and scanner hours

+1

I got one and it is better than a diary. Plus it helps me recall the various missions including the "dam" mission I was on.   

[THRAWN]

Yep...what they said....

[JeffDG]

Vanguard sells a nice scanner observer log book with places to log you observer hours and scanner hours

http://myflightbook.com is an incredibly flexible online logbook that would handle MO/MS stuff.

[Eclipse]

A just a spreadsheet in GDocs.

I've started them a bunch of times, I even have one that is supposed to track all of my CAP
activity from meetings to missions "just because", but in the end they are never current
because:

I don't care enough to keep them updated.

No one else does either.

It's one thing to want the basic badge, beyond that ((*yawn*)).  I'll take a SAR ribbon
over the hours star all day.