EAA & CAP

[Peeka]

I received an email from the EAA saying that I could join their ranks for free as a Young Eagle. But then I notice that I qualify because of my O-flight (presumably they are talking about my recent first and only O-flight that I have taken). Also, in the beginning of the email they address me by my first name.

Since I did not give them any of my information, how do they have access to that information?

Is it because of the EAA's mutual association with CAP?

My curiosity is piqued.

[bflynn]

EAA is focused on building, repairing, restoring and flying aircraft and supporting pilots who do the same.  Young Eagles is their program to get teens to take a flight and discover how great aviation is.  To my knowledge, there is no association between EAA and CAP other than airplanes and a lot of mutual members, but that doesn't mean there isn't one. 

The student membership to EAA is activated by using a code given after the Young Eagles flight.  The student membership is active until you turn 19.  Unless CAP is handing out the same codes during o-flights, then only way to get one is through the EAA program.  Put on your civilian clothes and sign up and take a flight.  There are lots of avenues in aviation beyond what CAP does and represents.  EAA is a great way to discover some of them.

[Peeka]

Here is the document that I found on capmembers stating the mutual association between EAA Aviation Foundation and CAP --> http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/YOUNG_EAGLES_6B4EB4946F5F3.pdf

The student membership to EAA is activated by using a code given after the Young Eagles flight.  The student membership is active until you turn 19. Unless CAP is handing out the same codes during o-flights, then only way to get one is through the EAA program.  Put on your civilian clothes and sign up and take a flight. 

That is what I am wondering about. I have never taken a Young Eagles flight, yet the EAA somehow knew about my first O-flight and my first name. Does CAP hand out some sort of code to the EAA once a cadet finishes his first O-flight?

[Eclipse]

That is what I am wondering about. I have never taken a Young Eagles flight, yet the EAA somehow knew about my first O-flight and my first name. Does CAP hand out some sort of code to the EAA once a cadet finishes his first O-flight?

They don't know about your CAP flight, which doesn't count towards this, anyway, they are inviting you to come and get a free flight, which in turn
makes you eligible to join the Young Eagles program.

As to your name, age, etc., that's in about eleventy-twelveeen databases.  EAA is most likely just buy that info from an info vendor. 

[Peeka]

^^But they did know about my O-flight. Exact quote from the email: "Did you know your O-Flight qualifies you as a Young Eagle?"

[ARandomCadet]

I'm pretty sure that you received it because of CAP selling your info to the EAA. That is because unless you check a little box under General Info/Preferences which is under My Account in eServices, they can sell your info as they want.

[Storm Chaser]

As far as I know, no one in CAP should be passing that information to EAA. That being said, there's a possibility that someone in CAP did. You can ask the orientation pilot who gave you your O-Flight, your deputy commander for cadets or your squadron commander to see if either one of them gave EAA your information.

Regardless of how EAA got your information, I would explore this opportunity further. If it's a good opportunity and something that you're interested in, then go for it.

[bflynn]

You're looking at something from almost 20 years ago that may or may not still be in effect.  I agree there is a lot of overlap and room for mutual cooperation between the two organizations.  It references an attached memo, which is not attached to the PDF.

If you're interested in joining EAA, you should look for the reply method for the email and follow it.  As I said before, the method of your getting a free membership is a code given out during Young Eagles flights.  If you don't have a code, ask for one and mention that you've done an orientation flight with Civil Air Patrol.

Or you can just go take a Young Eagles flight and get a little more air time   Free time in an airplane, even as a passenger is rarely a bad idea.

[Storm Chaser]

I'm pretty sure that you received it because of CAP selling your info to the EAA. That is because unless you check a little box under General Info/Preferences which is under My Account in eServices, they can sell your info as they want.

And you know this how, Cadet Rainey? CAP does NOT sell your personal information to anyone. They may release some information to its partners with your authorization (hence the checkbox in eServices). You may want to read CAPR 1-2 before providing your opinions on the matter.

[Jaison009]

Back WIWAC at Ft. Campbell, KY I received one of those in the mail from EAA following my first O-Flight. I do believe it is a mutual partnership between CAP and EAA as all of your O-Flights are recorded (especially now with eServices).

I received an email from the EAA saying that I could join their ranks for free as a Young Eagle. But then I notice that I qualify because of my O-flight (presumably they are talking about my recent first and only O-flight that I have taken). Also, in the beginning of the email they address me by my first name.

Since I did not give them any of my information, how do they have access to that information?

Is it because of the EAA's mutual association with CAP?

My curiosity is piqued.

[NC Hokie]

Back WIWAC at Ft. Campbell, KY I received one of those in the mail from EAA following my first O-Flight. I do believe it is a mutual partnership between CAP and EAA as all of your O-Flights are recorded (especially now with eServices).

You know, I've been wondering why my daughter gets one card addressed to FirstName LastName and another addressed to LastName FirstName, but my son only gets one addressed to FirstName LastName.  Both do all of the Young Eagles flights that I can get them to, but she's the only CAP cadet getting o-flights in the house, so that might explain the second card that she gets.

[ARandomCadet]

I'm pretty sure that you received it because of CAP selling your info to the EAA. That is because unless you check a little box under General Info/Preferences which is under My Account in eServices, they can sell your info as they want.

And you know this how, Cadet Rainey? CAP does NOT sell your personal information to anyone. They may release some information to its partners with your authorization (hence the checkbox in eServices). You may want to read CAPR 1-2 before providing your opinions on the matter.

Well the way I always hear it as from places is that they sell it. I was just going off of what I remembered seeing in eSevices and hearing from other places. But you are correct they give it away, I just checked in eServices to see. Also from what you wrote it sounded like you were saying that if you check the box they can give it away, but if you don't check it they can give it away, that is just to make a clarification in your post. But thank you for correcting me on my error, as you are correct about that because these are the exact words:

Third Parties
If you do NOT wish to have your personal contact information released to CAP authorized third parties, please check the box below.
{}Make My Information Private

[Offutteer]

It sounds like you won't get the actual answer to your question here on CAP Talk, but a well worded question on Knowledgebase might provide the answer.

I checked, and there is nothing on there currently.  And since inquiring minds want to know...

[smithwr2]

Hi CAPTalk folks,

Interesting discussion - maybe I can add something to the communal knowledge on the EAA/CAP relationship. 

I'm the Washington Wing coordinator for cadet orientation flights, also an ORide pilot.  I inquired into the mutual cooperation agreement with NHQ, and indeed the agreement is expired. 

I contacted EAA in Nov 2012 as a prospective member to find out if EAA policies would permit me to fly CAP cadets on ORides and then also to sign off their EAA Young Eagle logbooks.  (Doing so provides for a free intro flight instruction to Young Eagle/Cadets courtesy of EAA.)  The idea seemed reasonable since I would be an EAA pilot member, and the (non-Experimental class)  CAP plane would be fully inspected and carry insurance from  the federal government well in excess of EAA insurance requirements, and the youth being flown would be the same youth who could take off their BDUs and wander over to EAA for a flight as a Young Eagle.  Too logical.

I communicated with a Liesl Wrolstad of EAA Risk Management Office.  The reception was cold.  The feeling I got was that CAP and EAA are in competition for youth.  Specifically, Liesl said that it would not be permitted for an EAA member to fly a cadet in a CAP aircraft and also sign off on the flight as a Young Eagle flight.   "First I must mention that a Chapter co-mingling with another organization to sponsor a youth program is not permissible under the Chapter Insurance Program. "  "The Chapter at all times must retain organization control of the flights during the program, to include pilot recruiting.  The Chapter would then communicate directly with the children and their parents who take the flight, as well as use the EAA flight release forms."  (Dec 11 2012)

You can well imagine that level of control over CAP ORide operations going over like a lead baloon.

In the real world, there is nothing to prevent EAA pilots and CAP pilots from doing flights that happen to coincide on the same day and at the same airport, and Cadet Sparky from removing his uniform and  wandering over to the EAA side of the fence for a flight. 

Randy

Here is the document that I found on capmembers stating the mutual association between EAA Aviation Foundation and CAP --> http://www.capmembers.com/media/cms/YOUNG_EAGLES_6B4EB4946F5F3.pdf

[Eclipse]

Hi wingtalk folks,

Wingtalk?

As a point of fact, CAP and the EAA work together all the time - it is not uncommon in my area for CAP folks to act as ground helpers
while manning a recruiting table, etc.  At the end of the day, it is not unusual for those cadets to then be
given rides from the budget for people who did not show up.

Considering the small community that is your average GA airport, you would be hard-pressed to find chapters and units that
did not share members.

Since both organizations have different procedures and programs, it is not unexpected that they would want to respectively
control the experience for the youth they are flying, but to say that the organizations "compete" for youth would seem to indicate
a somewhat less then detailed understanding of either organization by whomever would make that assertion. 

Other then involving similar aircraft, the organizations have little in common.

[NCRblues]

I love conjecture and "over the phone feelings".

I can tell you firsthand, the EAA and CAP get along as well as 2 corporations can. It's getting better everyday, and I know this because I spoke ( and speake often with) the EAA Vice President of operations and IT. The higher up EAA folks really like CAP and what we do, not only for flying but with our youth and AE.

[Eclipse]

I contacted EAA in Nov 2012 as a prospective member to find out if EAA policies would permit me to fly CAP cadets on ORides and then also to sign off their EAA Young Eagle logbooks.  (Doing so provides for a free intro flight instruction to Young Eagle/Cadets courtesy of EAA.)  The idea seemed reasonable since I would be an EAA pilot member, and the (non-Experimental class)  CAP plane would be fully inspected and carry insurance from  the federal government well in excess of EAA insurance requirements, and the youth being flown would be the same youth who could take off their BDUs and wander over to EAA for a flight as a Young Eagle.  Too logical.

OK, I re-read this, and I don't even understand what the goal here was.

When you fly a CAP O-ride, you fly the syllabus as indicated, not some other organization's ride (which in the case of Young Eagles is generally just once around the pattern), and vice-versa.  Further, why would you limit the cadets free rides by signing off their O-ride as an EAA ride?  1-CAP ride = about 45 minutes, 1 EAA ride is 15-20. 

Also, and this should not be lost, those EAA rides are certainly used, appropriately, as marketing tools for FBOs and flight schools, no problem there,
but why would the EAA want to miss out on that?

[SarDragon]

^^But they did know about my O-flight. Exact quote from the email: "Did you know your O-Flight qualifies you as a Young Eagle?"

OK, I've read through this thread twice, and Think I've figured out this small part.

The quoted portion above is a solicitation from the EAA to take one of their O-Flights, and then become a Young Eagle. Nothing more, nothing less. They probably got your name from CAP, and sent you the invitation.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I had a flight in 2006 or so...my cert had nothing on it about any membership. :/

[Ned]

Just an update:

CAP & EAA have had a cooperative agreement since about 1995, most recently reviewed and updated just last September.  The purpose is to help get young people excited about aviation and allows CAP cadets access to some great benefits.

Basically, every month CAP generates a report of all the cadets who have had an o-ride recorded in eServices and passes the information - along with some contact information - along to EAA.

EAA has agreed in writing to safeguard the information and to use it only to promote their Young Eagles program.  They are specifically prohibited  from selling or futher distributing the information.

The EAA may then contact the cadet as described in the OP, and typically offer a free EAA membership through age 19, the EAA magazine, a free ground school through Sporty's, and some educational grant opportunities.

No money changes hands between CAP and EAA, nor does EAA charge the cadets anything for the membership.  The whole point is to increase the contact hours between CAP cadets and aviation.

Definately a win-win.

And, as others have noted, any cadet can opt out very easily via eServices.

[RiverAux]

And, as others have noted, any cadet can opt out very easily via eServices.

Shouldn't this be something that the parents should be deciding on when they sign their child's membership application?   Are parents informed that their child's information may be given to other organizations in such a way that they can choose to opt out? 

[Ned]

Shouldn't this be something that the parents should be deciding on when they sign their child's membership application?   

Good question.  What do you think?

Are you aware of any complaints or difficulties since the program started 18 years ago?

What do other youth serving organizations do in this regard?  Do the Scouts, Boys Clubs, or the Royal Rangers ever share inforamation with trusted partners?  How about schools?  JROTC?

What are the "best practices" in this regard?

Does the CG Auxiliary ever partner with other organizations to increase member benefits?

Both of my daughters received a lot of mail while they were in high school from businesses that appear to have gotten their information from the school district (colleges, armed forces recruiters, photographers, class ring jewlers, and of course about 10,000 expensive prom-related items like limos, restaurants, florists, etc.).  As a parent, should I have been worried?

Would it make a difference if CAP sent the information on behalf of EAA?

[RiverAux]

As with just about anything, its probably something that some parents would care about being released and others wouldn't mind -- thats why it should be at the option of the parent. 

I strongly suspect that most CAP parents had no idea that their child's personal information was being sent out by CAP to others so I doubt there haven't been many complaints. 

Don't really care what other organizations do.  This is CAP. 

[Майор Хаткевич]

I never got the offer. I feel jipped.

[a2capt]

If I'm ever in Illinois with a plane, I'll give you a ride

[Jaison009]

Thank you Ned. I knew we had the agreement and safeguards to promote aerospace education, I just could not find the info.

Just an update:

CAP & EAA have had a cooperative agreement since about 1995, most recently reviewed and updated just last September.  The purpose is to help get young people excited about aviation and allows CAP cadets access to some great benefits.

Basically, every month CAP generates a report of all the cadets who have had an o-ride recorded in eServices and passes the information - along with some contact information - along to EAA.

EAA has agreed in writing to safeguard the information and to use it only to promote their Young Eagles program.  They are specifically prohibited  from selling or futher distributing the information.

The EAA may then contact the cadet as described in the OP, and typically offer a free EAA membership through age 19, the EAA magazine, a free ground school through Sporty's, and some educational grant opportunities.

No money changes hands between CAP and EAA, nor does EAA charge the cadets anything for the membership.  The whole point is to increase the contact hours between CAP cadets and aviation.

Definately a win-win.

And, as others have noted, any cadet can opt out very easily via eServices.

[Майор Хаткевич]

If I'm ever in Illinois with a plane, I'll give you a ride

I'm a bit past 19 though...

[Critical AOA]

Sounds like a win-win and a good way to open a young person's eyes to more aspects of aviation than they will be exposed to in CAP alone. 

[a2capt]

I'm a bit past 19 though...

Yup.. so.