Should Senior Members wear uniforms?

[DNall]

I'd check your perspective there. We aren't & never have been a SaR agency. We are an AF Agency that happens to do SOME search & no rescue.

I don't know if you've ever actually saved anybody's life, I have & it isn't that big a deal. We do SaR ONLY because & to the extent Congress has tasked AF with backing up states that don't have the resources to do it for themselves. We ALSO do a whole lot of other ES work that has nothing to do with SaR. Plus besides SaR there's AE & CP, and CP is equally important to ES.

Regs state you need to be in a uniform at all CAP activities, and that includes meetings - it specificially says meetings in the reg. I'm understanding in some cases as long as it isn't habitual.

[sschwab]

I'd check your perspective there. We aren't & never have been a SaR agency. We are an AF Agency that happens to do SOME search & no rescue.

I don't know if you've ever actually saved anybody's life, I have & it isn't that big a deal. We do SaR ONLY because & to the extent Congress has tasked AF with backing up states that don't have the resources to do it for themselves. We ALSO do a whole lot of other ES work that has nothing to do with SaR. Plus besides SaR there's AE & CP, and CP is equally important to ES.

I stand corrected.  I guess in my squadron, I hear more about ES then the others, but you are correct, AE and CP blades are of equal size on the emblem.  I do not have a "save", so I have to take your word on how big a deal it is or is not.

Over lunch I was thinking about this, and I do have to say, a uniform does bring a sense of unity to the group, and does help people work with a more team attitude, and looks to  the public that we know what we are doing.

I guess I vented about the problem of people how are much more eager to wear the uniform then they are to do the work.  I have become jaded by people in general who are glad to tell me what they can/could do, but don't ever seem get around to doing it. 

For me, the uniform does not give value to member; its the member who gives value to the uniform, regardless of where and when they wear it.

I guess I am took discussion a bit off topic, sorry about that.

[DNall]

No, it's okay. The original point was pretty well done with...

a uniform does bring a sense of unity to the group, and does help people work with a more team attitude, and looks to  the public that we know what we are doing.

That's the main point of it. It also symbolicly promotes a sense or unity with the AF, so we don't forget who's boss & who's really paying for all this (greater than 10 times per every member what you pay per year).

I guess I vented about the problem of people how are much more eager to wear the uniform then they are to do the work.  I have become jaded by people in general who are glad to tell me what they can/could do, but don't ever seem get around to doing it.

People get that impression sometimes, but it tends not to be related. While you obviously joined cause someone sold you on helping save people, people join for other reasons too. Some want to help kids succeed in life, others are heere cause they want to help the AF. Most people are some combination of those or probably a half dozen other things. That foundation attitude is generally what dictates their views on what the org should be like & the uniform policy that flows from that. Wherever someone lands in that specturm, they'll be aiding in the missions to an equal percentage with anyone else.

For me, the uniform does not give value to member; its the member who gives value to the uniform, regardless of where and when they wear it.

Certainly our members bring a lot to the table. However, connecting across the line to our parent organization causes that assembly of members to be greater than the sum of their parts. Much greater in our case cause we steal credibility from our affiliation and public perceptions.


Anyway, you're required by reg to wear a uniform. That's for insurance reasons, but there are psychological & philosophical reasons as well that greatly impact capability & performance that dictate if & how well we can get the job done.

[coshell]

I'd check your perspective there. We aren't & never have been a SaR agency. We are an AF Agency that happens to do SOME search & no rescue.

I don't know if you've ever actually saved anybody's life, I have & it isn't that big a deal. We do SaR ONLY because & to the extent Congress has tasked AF with backing up states that don't have the resources to do it for themselves. We ALSO do a whole lot of other ES work that has nothing to do with SaR. Plus besides SaR there's AE & CP, and CP is equally important to ES.

Regs state you need to be in a uniform at all CAP activities, and that includes meetings - it specificially says meetings in the reg. I'm understanding in some cases as long as it isn't habitual.

I would suggest you re-read the material in the study guide for the ECI-13 test.  CAP was not founded as a CP organization.  And yes, we do have "rescues" quite frequently...53 last year to be exact.  (CP is very important, for the record.)

I would not wish to be the person that you "saved"...it would be unfortunate to be a "no big deal".  I'm quite sure that he/she thinks it is.  As far as I am concerned, saving one person justifies all of my time and monetary contributions to CAP.

[DNall]

Just a friendly side note, AFIADL13 is THE most outdated course in all of CAP. Not that it matters so much, but if you're going to pick from the couple dozen refs that could have told you that.

I do know that CAP was not founded as & is not now a CP agency. Neither was it founded as or is it now a SaR agency. We were actually doing CP before SaR if you're curious, again not that it matters. What I said was SaR is one part of many things we do in ES, and quite well balanced nationally (which may or may not be the case in your little area).  ES is balanced equally with CP, and to a lesser extent with AE. The fact of the matter is the org would today & at numerous points in history be shut down w/o every part of that equation going for it.

And by the way, the little girl I did CPR on in HS came out just fine. It was before I joined CAP, I was a police explorer on a call actually. I'm sure it means a lot more to her then it does to me. I'm glad she got helped, I'm glad I was able to help, but it doesn't matter to me that it was "me" that did the saving. To ME, it's just something that happened, like how I had lunch this afternoon or got a speeding ticket once. What we do in CAP is search for people, and if we ever find one that needs rescuing then we're not trained for or allowed to do that, we have to call people in. It's good stuff & worthy of a save, but if you want to be a hero you're in the wrong place.

What CAP exists for, from adoption by the AAF till now, is to support the AF. We do that in many different ways. One of those happens to be taking care of the AF's responsibility for Air SaR support to states that don't have the resources to do it for themselves. We're lucky that we're able to help people, and that may be what draws you to the organization, but the mission is there because it takes it off the plate so the AF can focus on more important things, and that is why I'm here. It's not my place to question your motivations, but I would from time to time try to pull you back to earth to get some perspective on the full range of things we do & why we as an organization (not you personally) do them. That ultimately is what your units should be focused on. When you get tunnel vision on things that are important to YOU, & your unit starts to track off in that direction, then restoring perspective is called for. That's all I was trying to do, respectfully.