L2K Paper test destruction?

Started by Майор Хаткевич, December 13, 2012, 05:58:26 PM

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Майор Хаткевич

A couple of questions actually for Testing Officers.

CAPR 50-4 is vague to begin with, so I'm wondering a few things.

I have not found any supplements on the wing site, so I believe the destruction of tests is fully on the Testing Officer.

Is there a preferred way to destroy the tests?

Then we get to the log, where this has to be recorded.

The one that is required of us is so simple the Management-major-that-wasn't in me goes crazy.

When I say "inventory complete", where is the said list of inventory? How do I know if anything is missing? If I say "tests destroyed", what tests? Some? All? New? old? AE? L2L? etc.

Then the third question. We are finally at the point where all of our cadets are on the L2L books. So I can destroy the olde Leadership texts. BUT! What if someone transfers in, still on the old program, and they still have some time until the program sundown. Will national be able to send us out any of the old tests?

Phew, I think that's it for now.

lordmonar

Remove it from the test control log....and then sherd.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Майор Хаткевич

So you're saying make the notation of "CAPT-XX Destroyed"?

Should I do a line item for each teach test?

What of a general inventory of what is there? No requirement for the test log what so ever.

arajca

You are correct - the Testing Officer is responsible for the test destruction.

The methods I've used are shredding (cross cut - makes confetti) and burning. I have not heard of a preferred method.

Our log lists each test by number, so when they are counted, the actual on-hand is recorded.

When a test is destroyed, the log for that test number is annotated with "Test destroyed on XX XXX XX by Lt Smith by burning." IF you haven't uniquely numbered each test, use a memo for record with something like "The following tests were destroyed by Lt Smith by burning" and list the tests by achievement and how many, i.e. Curry Leadership L2K, 3.

I believe National can send out old tests if necessary, but if you're worried about it, keep one copy of each test.

Майор Хаткевич

So sounds like I should just fire up a separate excel file with quantities and numbers of all of our tests. I was specifically told to keep "inventory" off the testing log, as ours is set up online, and wing has access to it for SUIs and wants it the way they want it.

lordmonar

Quote from: usafaux2004 on December 13, 2012, 06:07:33 PM
So you're saying make the notation of "CAPT-XX Destroyed"?

Should I do a line item for each teach test?

What of a general inventory of what is there? No requirement for the test log what so ever.
You can do that...just line thru it and say it was destroyed...I do that....and redo the inventory sheet at the begining of the year.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Eclipse

In your specific case, what you have is all you need, however the format is up to you. Your predecessor was less ... involved.
Bottom line, you can't keep two sets of books, discuss changes needs with Group and then make them.

"That Others May Zoom"

Майор Хаткевич

Quote from: Eclipse on December 13, 2012, 07:56:47 PM
In your specific case, what you have is all you need, however the format is up to you. Your predecessor was less ... involved.
Bottom line, you can't keep two sets of books, discuss changes needs with Group and then make them.

I've already discussed the log with higher powers. That's going to stay in the format they mandate.

What I'm talking about is the fact that CAPR 50-4 doesn't actually provide for a real accounting of inventory.

I'd simply count all the tests, throw them on an Excel spread sheet, and keep that sheet with the tests. Come next inventory, a copy of that sheet can be used to mark off everything. At least then I'd know if something is missing.

coudano

They are controlled but they aren't classified or anything.
So any shredder is probably sufficient.
We recently burned a bunch.

We had our test copies labeled, as such
L2K-Ch1-01 (copy 1)
L2K-Ch1-02 (copy 2)
DIM-Md1-01 (copy 1)
DIM-Md2-02 (copy 2)

Then each one that is destroyed is lined through, with a destruction date and initials of the person who destroyed it.
There is also an 'action log'  "12/12/12 All copies of L2K Chapters 1-7 destroyed (14 total items).  Obsolete.  djr"


*we keep the masters in a separate binder and label them differently as well
L2K-Master   (booklet of chapter tests master copy)
L2L-BMA-Master   (billy mitchell leadership master copy)



Our test control log is a google docs spreadsheet.
And we print a copy off and keep it in the test box with the tests.

EMT-83

#9
50-4 is not subject to interpretation as to test inventory or destruction.

Test inventory is outlined in Section 1-4. The format specified in Attachment 2 must be followed. Per Note 3 on Attachment 2, each test is assigned a control number.

Test destruction is outlined in Section 1-6.

If you're keeping tests off the test inventory log, you are in violation of the regulation.

If you have need for test which has been destroyed, you can order a replacement, as per Section 2-2.

Майор Хаткевич

Quote from: EMT-83 on December 13, 2012, 11:18:38 PM
50-4 is not subject to interpretation as to test inventory or destruction.

The reg is as vague as possible...

Quote from: EMT-83 on December 13, 2012, 11:18:38 PM
Test inventory is outlined in Section 1-4. The format specified in Attachment 2 must be followed. Per Note 3 on Attachment 2, each test is assigned a control number.

Quote1-4. Test Inventory Log.
Each TO will create a test inventory log for his/her unit. The inventory log may be on paper or electronic. Format for the test inventory log will be in accordance with Attachment 2 of this regulation. All transactions associated with hard-copy test materials will be entered onto the Test inventory log by the TO/assistant. This includes, but is not limited to, receipt, transfer, destruction and inventory of test materials, as well as administration of tests. Test inventory logs will be retained in accordance with CAP Regulation (CAPR) 10-2, Files Maintenance and Records Disposition.

Attachment 2 doesn't show/list/explain/demonstrate an actual inventory.

Quote
Definition of INVENTORY1 a    : an itemized list of current assets: as  (1)   : a catalog of the property of an individual or estate  (2)   : a list of goods on hand 

Only that of actions/receipt/destruction, but not a list of quantities and tests on hand.

Quote from: EMT-83 on December 13, 2012, 11:18:38 PM
Test destruction is outlined in Section 1-6.

True, I was wondering what the general practice for most was.

Quote1-6. Test Inventory.
The TO conducts a test materials inventory at least every 180 days and whenever the TO or assistant(s) changes.

a. The TO opens the storage container and identifies each test in the container. Each test must be on the Test inventory log. If a test on file is NOT on the Test inventory log, annotate the examination number on the log and destroy the test booklet. (Tests will be shredded or burned.) If a test is on the test inventory log but not on file, refer to paragraph 3-1 for test compromise.

b. When the inventory is completed, the TO annotates and signs the test inventory log on the next available line (see attachment 2).

What CAPR 50-4 doesn't address is adding a list of all tests on the log at the beginning of the year. Those tests aren't received, they are already there, so there are technically no entries. It should say then that an inventory has to be done at the beginning of the year, and all tests must be listed. There is no such requirement on the attachment.

Quote from: EMT-83 on December 13, 2012, 11:18:38 PM
If you're keeping tests off the test inventory log, you are in violation of the regulation.

Agreed. But again 50-4 doesn't mention how it would get there year to year.

Quote from: EMT-83 on December 13, 2012, 11:18:38 PM
If you have need for test which has been destroyed, you can order a replacement, as per Section 2-2.

Yep. My question was based on the tests that are about to be phased out in 2013.

a2capt

You've hung onto them this long.. what's a few more months now?


I did thin the box out, got rid of 4 of 5 copies of each of them. I have one cadet left on paper, for Phase II. I have convinced the Phase III and IV ones to get off the paper stuff with a calendar showing them that you have to be "here" (now) in order to finish by October, and that's if you are high speed Johnny on the Spot. Otherwise, forget it.

Майор Хаткевич

Quote from: a2capt on December 14, 2012, 02:49:51 AM
You've hung onto them this long.. what's a few more months now?


I did thin the box out, got rid of 4 of 5 copies of each of them. I have one cadet left on paper, for Phase II. I have convinced the Phase III and IV ones to get off the paper stuff with a calendar showing them that you have to be "here" (now) in order to finish by October, and that's if you are high speed Johnny on the Spot. Otherwise, forget it.

I suppose. We'll probably pair it down to 1 copy of each. Then keep them separate and just leave them in the storage cabinet on testing nights.

SarDragon

Quote from: usafaux2004 on December 14, 2012, 06:00:56 PM
Quote from: a2capt on December 14, 2012, 02:49:51 AM
You've hung onto them this long.. what's a few more months now?


I did thin the box out, got rid of 4 of 5 copies of each of them. I have one cadet left on paper, for Phase II. I have convinced the Phase III and IV ones to get off the paper stuff with a calendar showing them that you have to be "here" (now) in order to finish by October, and that's if you are high speed Johnny on the Spot. Otherwise, forget it.

I suppose. We'll probably pair pare it down to 1 copy of each. Then keep them separate and just leave them in the storage cabinet on testing nights.

FTFY.  ;)
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

Майор Хаткевич


Brad

Quote from: usafaux2004 on December 14, 2012, 02:15:51 AM
Attachment 2 doesn't show/list/explain/demonstrate an actual inventory.

I just looked at it, it looks like it does to me. I see a transaction ID, the date, the test it is reference to or the control number if you prefer, the date the test was given, the date it was put back in the cabinet, the date it was destroyed, and a sign-off column. It even specifies how to assign the control number. Plus at the top of the example it specifically says "SAMPLE TEST INVENTORY LOG" (emphasis mine)
Brad Lee
Maj, CAP
Assistant Deputy Chief of Staff, Communications
Mid-Atlantic Region
K4RMN

Майор Хаткевич

They can call this an inventory all they want. It's only a log. There is no actual list of all tests on file.

Brad

Quote from: usafaux2004 on December 15, 2012, 01:19:03 AM
They can call this an inventory all they want. It's only a log. There is no actual list of all tests on file.

If you update that log whenever a new test is received it will become that. All you have to do is count the entries from the last inventory and that is your current inventory. If you receive like 10 at a time, note that in the log. Simple counting of entries is all it is.
Brad Lee
Maj, CAP
Assistant Deputy Chief of Staff, Communications
Mid-Atlantic Region
K4RMN

Майор Хаткевич

We're supposed to start a new log every year. That would make legitimate inventory hard to do.

PHall

Quote from: usafaux2004 on December 15, 2012, 03:29:51 AM
We're supposed to start a new log every year. That would make legitimate inventory hard to do.

Yeah, start a new log. But aren't you supposed to keep the old log for a couple of years?
There's your inventory for you.