Cvill Air Patrol Stories !

[NCRblues]

I have never heard the air force call NCO sir .   E-1 Airman E-2 Airman E-3 Airman first class E-4 Senior Airman E-5 Staff Sergeant E-6 Technical Sergeant E-7 Master Sergeant & First Sergeant E-8 Senior master sergeant & First Sergeant . E-9 Chief Master Sergeant  - First Sergeant - Command Chief Master Sergeant  - Chief Master sergeant of the air force .  this how you address them there is no ma`am our sir .

AH, troll...got it...

You have never been in the AF, Branch's handle things differently, that is why each branch has a basic training instead of one massive one for D.O.D.

Thanks for playing, but your wrong.

[Ned]

I don't have a horse in the race about how to address CAP SM NCOs, except to note that as an Army guy working in a joint environment we addressed AF NCOs as "sergeant" or "chief" as appropriate without ever being "corrected."

However, CAP actually has written doctrine on how to address cadet NCOs; and that is "sergeant" or "chief" as appropriate.

That is what we are - and should be - training our cadets as to how to address each other.


As a side note, when working with our AF partners in a joint environment, I noted a lot of first names being used in conversations amongst AF members that would have been considered highly inappropriate amongst soldiers.  Just a cultural difference, I expect.

[lordmonar]

I have never heard the air force call NCO sir .   E-1 Airman E-2 Airman E-3 Airman first class E-4 Senior Airman E-5 Staff Sergeant E-6 Technical Sergeant E-7 Master Sergeant & First Sergeant E-8 Senior master sergeant & First Sergeant . E-9 Chief Master Sergeant  - First Sergeant - Command Chief Master Sergeant  - Chief Master sergeant of the air force .  this how you address them there is no ma`am our sir .

Mr. Moon,  I understand that in your expeirnce you may never have heard USAF NCO's called sir or ma'am.

I retired as a MSgt in 2008 after 22 years in the service.......so my experince is long and still fairly freash.....and on day one my TI instructed me to call him "Sir".  I was supposed to say "Sir, Ariman Harris reports..." or "Sir, Airman Harris reports as ordered...." before I said anything else!

Now....I know other services do it differently, but as it has been said....CAP is the USAF Auxillary....so let's do it their way.

[NCRblues]

I don't have a horse in the race about how to address CAP SM NCOs, except to note that as an Army guy working in a joint environment we addressed AF NCOs as "sergeant" or "chief" as appropriate without ever being "corrected."

However, CAP actually has written doctrine on how to address cadet NCOs; and that is "sergeant" or "chief" as appropriate.

That is what we are - and should be - training our cadets as to how to address each other.


As a side note, when working with our AF partners in a joint environment, I noted a lot of first names being used in conversations amongst AF members that would have been considered highly inappropriate amongst soldiers.  Just a cultural difference, I expect.

Ned, i think that really depends on what type of AF shop your dealing with. It seems firefighters/cops/CATM and other semi combat AF units follow the rank/sir/ma'am way a lot more than say Com's/maintainers/finance/admin.....

Just my view from being on active duty AF.

[lordmonar]

To amplify what Ned said........Sergeant and Chief are ALSO acceptable terms for USAF NCO's.......we just don't (in my not so humble experience) get a hard on for it like other services (this is not a ding on other services).

My pet peeve is with people who jump down other people for using a generic term of respect.  I particularly hate "I work for a living" as that teaches disrespect toward officers.

If you perfere "sergeant" instead of sir.....just tell them "call me sergeant" and press on.

[Matt Moon]

http://www.woodfieldcap.org/SMgrade.shtml

[lordmonar]

http://www.woodfieldcap.org/SMgrade.shtml

And?

[Matt Moon]

here`s your prof . http://www.woodfieldcap.org/SMgrade.shtml

[Matt Moon]

so how am i wrong sir ?

[lordmonar]

so how am i wrong sir ?

You are not wrong.....but neither is sir or ma'am....that is my point.

[Spaceman3750]

here`s your prof . http://www.woodfieldcap.org/SMgrade.shtml

That someone somewhere can make a website that says whatever they want?

Flight Officers aren't transitional, we're full members with full grade and aren't necessarily transitioning from anywhere.

[NCRblues]

so how am i wrong sir ?

You where asked what military service you have had, you did not answer.

More than one AF NCO have told you how it is done in the active duty AF, you ignore it. The AF uses sir/ma'am for NCO's, sorry it hurts you so bad to think about that.

I understand what CAP say, if you want to make your cadets call all cadet enlisted members by their name and rank than go for it, but sir/ma'am works just as well.

[Matt Moon]

With all do respect sir i have told every one and the information is listed in front of every one now so how is it wrong when it proves it to be right ?

[Spaceman3750]

With all do respect sir i have told every one and the information is listed in front of every one now so how is it wrong when it proves it to be right ?

Here's something very, very fundamental you need to learn about CAP now. There are lots of opinions about things floating around out there which turn into legends or "how we've always done it" which then get misconstrued as fact.

Just because it's on a CAP website doesn't make it true.

[Spaceman3750]

As an example, the grade abbreviations are wrong. Also, there's no E-4 Sgt in CAP (I think, didn't I see this in another thread somewhere?)

[SarDragon]

And we're still waiting for an answer to my Q, which I will repeat here, in a more direct fashion:

Do you have any direct military experience? If so, what is it?

[lordmonar]

With all do respect sir i have told every one and the information is listed in front of every one now so how is it wrong when it proves it to be right ?

Which post did you not read?  Mr. Moon the information on the web site is not "wrong" per se......but it is not really correct either.

In the USAF we almost never address officers by their rank....as in "Yes Captain, No Captain, right away Captain" nor do we usually address NCO's by their rank.

Sir or Ma'am are what you usually hear.....some time you might also hear "boss" a time or two.

Saying "Yes Master Sergeant" or "Yes Sergeant" are not "wrong".....you just don't hear it that often. 

So where you are wrong is where you teach people to say that "Full Rank and Name" is the ONLY way to address NCO's....it is not.  Where you also going wrong is where you don't listen to your elders who are trying to keep you from making a fool of yourself.  You can do what you want, and you should do what you think is "right".....just remember that us old, been there done that, guys are trying to keep you and all your cadets (and my extention CAP) from looking stupid.

End of rank....breaking off, RTB, Out.

[lordmonar]

As an example, the grade abbreviations are wrong. Also, there's no E-4 Sgt in CAP (I think, didn't I see this in another thread somewhere?)

Actually there is an E-4 Sgt in CAP.  Part of that screwed CAP NCO program...it has not been updated since they did away with the E-4 Sgt rank in the USAF.

[SarDragon]

As an example, the grade abbreviations are wrong. Also, there's no E-4 Sgt in CAP (I think, didn't I see this in another thread somewhere?)

Actually there is an E-4 Sgt in CAP.  Part of that screwed CAP NCO program...it has not been updated since they did away with the E-4 Sgt rank in the USAF.

Actually, Mr. Harris  , the latest CAPR 35-5 shows CAP NCO grades only down through SSgt.

[lordmonar]

As an example, the grade abbreviations are wrong. Also, there's no E-4 Sgt in CAP (I think, didn't I see this in another thread somewhere?)

Actually there is an E-4 Sgt in CAP.  Part of that screwed CAP NCO program...it has not been updated since they did away with the E-4 Sgt rank in the USAF.

Actually, Mr. Harris  , the latest CAPR 35-5 shows CAP NCO grades only down through SSgt.

Well.....don't let it be said I am never wrong and can't admit it!