Wing Conference: To go or not to go?

[Walkman]

A Wing conference is a place to bring the membership together to celebrate accomplishments, network with fellow members (and ideally partner agencies and vendors), share ideas, and align the membership with a vision for the future.

And wing conference is also a good place to be re-inspired and re-invigorated about how cool CAP is and what it's value is for those of us who spend too much time getting bogged down in the dirt here on CT. It was for me anyway...

[SarDragon]

I've been to 4 or 5 wing conferences over the years. California is one of the three biggest wings (not counting Alaska) in terms of end-to-end distance. Because of that distance, and the layout of the population centers, we move the conference around - North, Central, South, Central, repeat. North is in the SF Bay area, Central is usually in Santa Maria, a small city with a Radisson right at the airport, and South is usually in Orange County, south of LA. Everybody has a conference close to their local area every couple of years. Some folks have to drive 5 or 6 hours to get there, no matter where it is, so the crowd differs every year, but it seems to work out OK.

As for content, I've never found it to be horribly repetitive. It's often a chance to get up-to-date on new tech,and procedures. Last year, we had a great class on Aerial Photographer. I've never been disappointed with attending.

[Brad]

Ugh what I would do for a Wing conference this year. We didn't have ours this past year because our Wing CC had medical issues, so now I'm waiting to hear about the next big thing I can jump on. Having a 6-month old kid kinda limits my ability to travel great distances, and I don't really have the money for the larger conferences anyway so I'm having to wait for the next Wing conference so I can pick up my last Level III requirement.

[ol'fido]

We could have had the conference at the IMA in Springfield. Plenty of room for lodging, conference rooms, a large auditorium , and room for a banquet. It would haveg  cost both the organization and the members a fraction of what any hotel or conference center would cost. We could probably have let the cadets stay for free. Expensive is a relative term. Many of the counties down here are at double digit unemployment. My own county is at nearly 14o/o . And just because the majority of members are in the "Chicago" area doesn't mean that the rest of the wing should always have the burden of travelling to the opposite end of the state for conferences,missions, or training. BTW, the cost per night for a private BOQ room at the IMA is 20 dollars. I don't think that the Holiday Inn could negotiate for that. Plus, conferences shouldn't be convenient for the AF , region, or NHQ folks.That's their job. Make conferences happen in a way that doesn't cost 4-5 hundred dollars for a weekend.

Actually, that's exactly what that means.  You're suggesting that the majority should support the minority?  That doesn't make sense on any scale, and makes even less sense in the practical reality that the odds are the participation from those areas won't be any greater just because the activity is in their backyard.

As to unemployment and other non-CAP factors, not relevant.  Things are tough all over.

As to the AF, Region and NHQ folks, most of those people are volunteers just like the rest of us, and again, you don't drag the majority of people around to the benefit of the minority, especially when the odds of the minority even showing up are minimal.

We've been having this conversation in our wing forever - most of it is based on North / South bias and issues that are based in economic and population reality and are not related to CAP.  More then 2/3rds of the membership as a whole is in the Northern part of the state,
and if you factor in being active, probably even more then that.

The only way that is ever going to be fixed is for the areas with lower membership and participation to step up and build their numbers so they are a legitimate factor in planning. we're told "that's not possible", etc., etc., fair enough, but you can't have it both ways.

Most wing conferences are an exercise in checking boxes anyway - a few breakouts that rehash information readily available to all and months old by the time its presented, schedules that never take into account that the same people do everything so you don't run major OPS and CP classes at the same time because you cannabilze your audience and defeat your own purpose, and a rubber-chicken banquet
to hand out awards where 1/2 the people on the list didn't show.

Add-in the "We need something for cadets..." which is nearly impossible, 1/2-empty commander's calls and CAC meetings (because not everyone showed up), and a lot of smoke with little fire.

Getting people interested at all is difficult enough, let alone expecting them to drive 3-5 hours for no other reason then to
"move things around", only to find that no one in the local area could be bothered to show and the drive was a complete waste of time and money.

Some activities have no choice in venue - they require a specific facility or the options are limited, but when options are available,
you don't plan something with a location where 100 people drive for 4 hours just to avoid 10 people driving 6.

No, I am not suggesting that the majority support the minority and it's just pomposity to look at it like that. What I am suggesting is that the "wing" act like a "wing"  and do things in such a way that all members feel like they are vital to the organization. It's unit friggin' cohesion. And it's the kind of thing that will build the numbers you are talking about. You don't write people off just because of a happenstance of geography.

What came first? Downstate units not wanting to participate because they don't want to drive to the Chicago area eight or nine times a year. Or wing just deciding that since downstate units weren't participating at the same rate as area units it just makes more sense to hold activities within the metro Chicago areas. The reason this discussion has been going on for years is because thing like this have been happening for years. People from downstate have been complaining about this for years. It's gotten to the point that they have pretty much given up trying to participate. So now you have the proverbial self-fulfilling prophecy.

Yes, most of the people from the AF, region, or national are volunteers too. So what? You complain about the "I'm just a volunteer" mentality all the time and then use it to explain why these people shouldn't travel to Springfield. " Lord help us, they might have to take a commuter flight and stay in a hotel". "Heavens to Betsy, there might not even be a Starbucks!" It doesn't seem to stop a group of cadets and seniors from traveling from Texas every year for a week of encampment. They drive for TWO DAYS to get there to CHECK OFF A BOX for their encampment credit.

As for that check box , rubber chicken, poorly organized thing, most people like Walkman said go for the chance to network, see old friends, and have a good social experience. They don't go to watch wing staff members give each other awards and drone on about their functional areas. If they wanted to do that they would just go to a wing staff meeting.

The Illinois Military Academy at Camp Lincoln is where we hold summer encampment. We house up to 172 cadets and 60 some odd seniors there every year in the middle of summer. If we do the conference during the late fall or early spring we would probably have the entire place to ourselves  and could house nearly as many senior as cadets. The only drawback on senior billeting is that the Qs don't provide for co-ed billeting. So a married couple would have to rent two adjoining BOQ rooms. For two rooms for two nights would cost $80. It is $20 dollars per room per night.

For me, since my wife doesn't attend these things, it would cost me approximately $80 for gas(trip up, trip back, refill at home after), $40 dollars for two nights billeting($20 if I came up Sat morning), $60-75 dollars for the conference fee, and whatever other food I wanted for the weekend. So I would spend around $200 to attend a conference 3 hours from my house. The drive time from the Chicago area is longer but not by much(straight shot down I-55). The IMA has a large theater like auditorium, billeting for a couple of hundred, several classrooms for breakouts, and it's cheap. We could afford to comp the cadets billeting.

For me to go to Chicago for a conference: double the gas so $160-200 dollars(taking into account the price in gas in the metro area), two nights stay in the "Holiday Inn" will be approx. $80 to 100 per night( and most likely it would be two nights since I wouldn't want to get up at 2-3 am to drive up 5 or 6 hours to Chicago and be there by the time the conference starts, $60-75 for conference fees, plus my other meals. So if I use the low end of those figures it comes to about $400 dollars or the high end would be $500+.  So should we let everybody drive a 3-4 hours and spend about $200 or make those from down south drive to Chicago and spend $500 while those in Chicago that chose to stay at the hotel are going to be spending $200 anyway in hotel, registration, and meals?

Seems to me that even if they did have to drive to Springfield, the Chicago area members would be spending the same and probably less than the "Holiday Inn" option.

[Eclipse]

I had an overly long response, but it's unnecessary as I remembered this key point...

The Chief of Staff begged for someone to chair the 2013 conference staff for nearly a year. Crickets.  Had anyone stepped up and volunteered to POC the event,
you could have had it in your AOR.  No one did.

[ol'fido]

I had an overly long response, but it's unnecessary as I remembered this key point...

The Chief of Staff begged for someone to chair the 2013 conference staff for nearly a year. Crickets.  Had anyone stepped up and volunteered to POC the event,
you could have had it in your AOR.  No one did.

WRONG!!! The very day the COS sent out a email requesting a project officer, I responded that I would be glad to be the project officer if we could have it at the IMA in Springfield. I received no response or acknowledgement from him. Plus, it wasn't nearly a year as the email came out late last summer after the summer encampment.

A month or so later, Barb put out another e mail looking for a project officer.  I responded immediately that I would be glad to be the project officer if we could hold the conference at the IMA. She at least answered and said they were looking to have it in the northern end of the state since it had been in the southern end the year before. I replied that it wasn't in the "southern" part of the state since I live in "southern" and Springfield is 3 hours NORTH OF "southern".

Better polish off that "overly long response".

[Spaceman3750]

I had an overly long response, but it's unnecessary as I remembered this key point...

The Chief of Staff begged for someone to chair the 2013 conference staff for nearly a year. Crickets.  Had anyone stepped up and volunteered to POC the event,
you could have had it in your AOR.  No one did.

WRONG!!! The very day the COS sent out a email requesting a project officer, I responded that I would be glad to be the project officer if we could have it at the IMA in Springfield. I received no response or acknowledgement from him. Plus, it wasn't nearly a year as the email came out late last summer after the summer encampment.

A month or so later, Barb put out another e mail looking for a project officer.  I responded immediately that I would be glad to be the project officer if we could hold the conference at the IMA. She at least answered and said they were looking to have it in the northern end of the state since it had been in the southern end the year before. I replied that it wasn't in the "southern" part of the state since I live in "southern" and Springfield is 3 hours NORTH OF "southern".

Better polish off that "overly long response".

Randy, if I end up going you're more than welcome to link up with me in Bloomington or Peoria and ride the rest of the way .

[Eclipse]

I had an overly long response, but it's unnecessary as I remembered this key point...

The Chief of Staff begged for someone to chair the 2013 conference staff for nearly a year. Crickets.  Had anyone stepped up and volunteered to POC the event,
you could have had it in your AOR.  No one did.

WRONG!!! The very day the COS sent out a email requesting a project officer, I responded that I would be glad to be the project officer if we could have it at the IMA in Springfield. I received no response or acknowledgement from him. Plus, it wasn't nearly a year as the email came out late last summer after the summer encampment.

A month or so later, Barb put out another e mail looking for a project officer.  I responded immediately that I would be glad to be the project officer if we could hold the conference at the IMA. She at least answered and said they were looking to have it in the northern end of the state since it had been in the southern end the year before. I replied that it wasn't in the "southern" part of the state since I live in "southern" and Springfield is 3 hours NORTH OF "southern".

Better polish off that "overly long response".

Randy,

If that was how you phrased it, then I'm not surprised.

IMA Springfield is an inappropriate choice for a professional conference.  For starters, who's going to cook?  This isn't an encampment, and most of the participants would be
less then interested in a "chow line" for 2-3 days plus a banquet.

It also doesn't change the math on who would be attending and where they would be coming from.

The bottom line is that you don't drag 100-150 to a location just to make things easier on 10-20 (on a good weekend).  That's simply not a good use of anyone's time
or resources.

There's no point in the verbose response because you are looking at this through a personal filter instead of the best plan for the most people.

[ol'fido]

If you're a corporate or business drone with an expense account and trying to sell 10,000 units of widgets, it probably is not where you would want to hold a conference. No bar. Although, the Guard and other agencies seem to be able to use it for their conferences and seminars. It's about holding a conference in a location that will open it up to all the members of Illinois wing. The only personal filter I am using is what's good for EVERYONE and what is affordable for all of our members without undue hardship. We have a top notch facility that has a theater quality auditorium, classrooms for breakouts, and AFFORDABLE billeting for everyone including cadets. If we could find a hotel that has all that but doesn't cost $200 for 2 nights, I'd be all for it. $200 vs. $40. Plus, we can arrange for meals. We do a pretty good job of it every year. In fact, I had people who volunteered to help out with meals and staffing if we did do this. They didn't seem to think that it was not a good place to run a conference. In fact, with the exception of you and apparently the COS, everyone I have mentioned this to thought it was an outstanding idea.

You say the IMA is not place for a  "professional" conference. I would say it's better than a "inordinately expensive" one.

[Eclipse]

No matter where a conference or other activity is held, it will never be "perfect" for everyone.   What needs to be managed is what is
best for the largest group of anticipated participants.

A conference within 1-2 hours driving makes hotel costs irrelevant for the majority, since the majority won't need a hotel.  By holding it in the general vicinity of where
the membership lives, by far most will simply attend for a single day and go home, with the likely cost to the average member being less then $50 total,
with no need to get a hotel, nor the background noise of having to staff a kitchen, etc.

Surely you're not suggesting that the majority of the membership, in these "hard economic times", be forced to incur unnecessary lodging costs and
2-3x's the driving expense simply to accommodate a small number of members who need to travel farther?

As to having cadets present - the further it is from their home, the less likely they are to attend.  Just because they can stay for free doesn't mean
they can get there.  Having it in the vicinity of other attractions mom & dad might be interested in means they can be dropped off and picked up
while mom & dad do "other".  Having it 3 hours away, next to nothing else, means a 6-hour+ round trip twice in two days.  Not something most parents are
going to be interested in.

[SarDragon]

FWIW, if I've got a two hour drive to get to a multi-day event, I'm not doing that commute every day. The hotel cost is partly offset by the lower fuel cost.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I went to the 2006 ILWG Conference in the geographical middle of the state as a cadet, ONLY because:

Eclipse was my ride.
I believe I got to bum the room space for free as well.

Outside of that, that long a drive at 16, only a few months with a DL? Not a chance.
As an interested level? Just about zero chance as well.

Now, if it was held up north? Chances are there would be more than ten cadets at that conference...

[a2capt]

Ask KSWG for feedback on how their Wing Conferences go. They hold it at a military installation of similar nature.

[Al Sayre]

You are never going to make everyone happy, no matter where you hold it.  The best you can hope for is that everyone is equally unhappy...

[Nuke52]

You are never going to make everyone happy, no matter where you hold it.  The best you can hope for is that everyone is equally unhappy...

The words of a true optimist--you, sir, have obviously spent time in our military! 

The Air Force Personnel Center's motto:  "Why should I make you happy, when I can $#*@& him, too?"

[RogueLeader]

The Air Force Personnel Center's motto:  "Why should I make you happy, when I can $#*@& him, too?"

That made my day.   :clap: :clap: :clap:

Even more than the CAPF 27 naming me as Commander.

[Nuke52]

The Air Force Personnel Center's motto:  "Why should I make you happy, when I can $#*@& him, too?"

That made my day.   :clap: :clap: :clap:

Even more than the CAPF 27 naming me as Commander.

I aim to please (or, in some cases, harass).

And my condolences--I mean--congratulations on taking command.

[Capt. $]

I had debated whether or not I should try to attend the Wing Conference here, as it will be about a month after my join date (waiting for NHQ to approve my app at the moment), and I didn't know what I would get out of it being that new. On the other hand, I don't know when they'll be holding another one 20 minutes from home.

I was trying to figure out if I was going to the CAWG Conference I can honestly say that it was the MOST UNORGANIZED EVENT I'VE EVER BEEN TO!

[SarDragon]

I had debated whether or not I should try to attend the Wing Conference here, as it will be about a month after my join date (waiting for NHQ to approve my app at the moment), and I didn't know what I would get out of it being that new. On the other hand, I don't know when they'll be holding another one 20 minutes from home.

I was trying to figure out if I was going to the CAWG Conference I can honestly say that it was the MOST UNORGANIZED EVENT I'VE EVER BEEN TO!

Would you care to share more specific details? I was at last year's conference, and saw little evidence of lack of organization.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I went to the 2006 ILWG Conference in the geographical middle of the state as a cadet, ONLY because:

Eclipse was my ride.
I believe I got to bum the room space for free as well.

Outside of that, that long a drive at 16, only a few months with a DL? Not a chance.
As an interested level? Just about zero chance as well.

Now, if it was held up north? Chances are there would be more than ten cadets at that conference...

Kicker down the road: can't even prove I was there.