CAP Photos of 9/11- have they been released?

Started by Orville_third, February 13, 2010, 07:04:42 PM

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JayT

Quote from: DG on February 17, 2010, 12:45:28 PM
Quote from: flyboy1 on February 17, 2010, 11:49:10 AM
So, the original question was where are the CAP photos now? You used to be able to go to a NHQ web page that detailed all CAP operations from that period, but the page was eliminated several years ago. Fortunately I copied everything, but the photos had an unusual format that meant when they were printed some information would be lost due to the size. The photographer is now a NER staffer. Perhaps we should all gang up (joking) on him at the next conference?


I went and looked at the Long Island Group website and photos.

The buddy I referenced was not in the picture!  So I called him.

Turns out, he did not fly September 12.  Rather he flew the next day.  He was the photographer in the Red, White, and Blue CAP aircraft depicted in the paintings that were done of the event.

The airplane in the Long Island Group photo can be seen to be an old paint scheme (not R/W/B).  My buddy tells me that the CAP plane and crew that flew September 12 was almost shot down by a NYPD helicopter.

....NYPD helo's don't pack that kind of firepower....
"Eagerness and thrill seeking in others' misery is psychologically corrosive, and is also rampant in EMS. It's a natural danger of the job. It will be something to keep under control, something to fight against."

BTCS1*

But the NYPD ESU team that was onboard it is packin' some serious heat!
C/2d Lt. B. Garelick, CAP

JayT

Quote from: BTCS1* on February 17, 2010, 06:25:56 PM
But the NYPD ESU team that was onboard it is packin' some serious heat!

Yeah, but there's a big difference between shooting some skele with an M4 or Mini-14 and an airplane.
"Eagerness and thrill seeking in others' misery is psychologically corrosive, and is also rampant in EMS. It's a natural danger of the job. It will be something to keep under control, something to fight against."

Seabee219

I think that most American's still have memory of that day, but others forget, and protest the war we are in to give them the freedom to say and do what they want.  The over 3000 people that died  that day still makes me mad.  Most of the flags are down now, and most forgot. We should play that over and over and they can see what our service people are fighting for.  I love this country and if I could I would put on a uniform and go over there myself.  So, please do not forget the people that served and died for our country. Wave your flags.
CAP Capt, Retired US Navy Seabee.
  MRO, MS, MO, UDF, GT3, MSA, CUL
1. Lead by example, and take care of your people

Seabee219

Quote from: Seabee219 on February 18, 2010, 06:18:52 PM
I think that most American's still have memory of that day, but others forget, and protest the war we are in to give them the freedom to say and do what they want.  The over 3000 people that died  that day, and it still makes me mad.  Most of the flags are down now, and most forgot. We should play that over and over and they can see what our service people are fighting for.  I love this country and if I could I would put on a uniform and go over there myself.  So, please do not forget the people that served and died for our country. Wave your flags.
CAP Capt, Retired US Navy Seabee.
  MRO, MS, MO, UDF, GT3, MSA, CUL
1. Lead by example, and take care of your people

JayT

Quote from: Seabee219 on February 18, 2010, 06:18:52 PM
I think that most American's still have memory of that day, but others forget, and protest the war we are in to give them the freedom to say and do what they want.  The over 3000 people that died  that day still makes me mad.  Most of the flags are down now, and most forgot. We should play that over and over and they can see what our service people are fighting for.  I love this country and if I could I would put on a uniform and go over there myself.  So, please do not forget the people that served and died for our country. Wave your flags.

So we should play video of the Pearl Harbor attacks every day to?

In one sentence, you say that most Americans have forgotten, but before you say most haven't. Which is it?

Yeah, we shouldn't forget what our servicemen and women are fighting for, but we also have to live and be Americans. Patriotism isn't waving a flag and watching videos of the greatest crime in modern history. Patrotism is being a good member of society and trying to make the world a better place.
"Eagerness and thrill seeking in others' misery is psychologically corrosive, and is also rampant in EMS. It's a natural danger of the job. It will be something to keep under control, something to fight against."

Seabee219

Sorry on not being clear there. I will say that some have forgot, not all. But it seems the one that forget are the ones that complain. Yes all good points I agree 100%. 
CAP Capt, Retired US Navy Seabee.
  MRO, MS, MO, UDF, GT3, MSA, CUL
1. Lead by example, and take care of your people

Gunner C

Quote from: JThemann on February 18, 2010, 06:26:35 PM
Quote from: Seabee219 on February 18, 2010, 06:18:52 PM

So we should play video of the Pearl Harbor attacks every day to?

In one sentence, you say that most Americans have forgotten, but before you say most haven't. Which is it?

Yeah, we shouldn't forget what our servicemen and women are fighting for, but we also have to live and be Americans. Patriotism isn't waving a flag and watching videos of the greatest crime in modern history. Patrotism is being a good member of society and trying to make the world a better place.
We're not at war with the Japanese, but every Dec 7 you'll see footage replayed of the attack, and probably will for several more years. 

I have to disagree with the term"crime." Calling the attacks of Sept 11 "crimes", lessens the impact of it.  They were acts of war from a transnational group that has the tacit, if not explicit support of several nations.  Our first two wars as a nation were exactly the same - Barbary Pirates were the Islamic terrorists of the early 19th century.  They weren't criminals they were naval raiders who kept our nation at bay.

BTW, international law calls it irregular warfare which, if carried out correctly, can be legal.  The law of land warfare requires that the participants carry arms openly, have fixed insignia, and have a discernable chain of command.  Also, you can't target civilians.  These terrorists have no protections under international law.  The closest it comes to being a crime is a war crime.  The capturing country determines how they are disposed of.  Execution, by international law, is allowed.

Spike

^ International laws only comes into play with those that have signed the Geneva Convention.  Terrorists are not a signatory entity, thus have no international rights.  When captured, they can be executed by a summary military tribunal consisting of the immediate Commander should we so decide.  We only have to treat other signatory entities according to the Geneva Convention articles, no other groups.  We as Americans, however do set higher standards for OURSELVES, thus treat even terrorists as though they were part of a uniform combatant enemy.

   

JayT

Quote from: Gunner C on February 20, 2010, 03:52:14 AM
Quote from: JThemann on February 18, 2010, 06:26:35 PM
Quote from: Seabee219 on February 18, 2010, 06:18:52 PM

So we should play video of the Pearl Harbor attacks every day to?

In one sentence, you say that most Americans have forgotten, but before you say most haven't. Which is it?

Yeah, we shouldn't forget what our servicemen and women are fighting for, but we also have to live and be Americans. Patriotism isn't waving a flag and watching videos of the greatest crime in modern history. Patrotism is being a good member of society and trying to make the world a better place.
We're not at war with the Japanese, but every Dec 7 you'll see footage replayed of the attack, and probably will for several more years. 

I have to disagree with the term"crime." Calling the attacks of Sept 11 "crimes", lessens the impact of it.  They were acts of war from a transnational group that has the tacit, if not explicit support of several nations.  Our first two wars as a nation were exactly the same - Barbary Pirates were the Islamic terrorists of the early 19th century.  They weren't criminals they were naval raiders who kept our nation at bay.

BTW, international law calls it irregular warfare which, if carried out correctly, can be legal.  The law of land warfare requires that the participants carry arms openly, have fixed insignia, and have a discernable chain of command.  Also, you can't target civilians.  These terrorists have no protections under international law.  The closest it comes to being a crime is a war crime.  The capturing country determines how they are disposed of.  Execution, by international law, is allowed.

I'm sorry, I feel the exact opposite. Calling it an 'attack' gives it more justification and more power to their cause then they deserve. They're not 'freedom fighters' or irregular warriors or enemy combatants. They're criminals, thugs, nothing more. Frankly, I say hold the trial in New York Federal court. I'm not afraid of them, nore are most of my fellow New Yorkers.

We, as Americans, and as the current generation of the greatest nation Earth has ever known, cannot allow ourselves to become butchers.
"Eagerness and thrill seeking in others' misery is psychologically corrosive, and is also rampant in EMS. It's a natural danger of the job. It will be something to keep under control, something to fight against."

flyboy53

Quote from: JThemann on February 18, 2010, 06:26:35 PM
Quote from: Seabee219 on February 18, 2010, 06:18:52 PM

So we should play video of the Pearl Harbor attacks every day to? ...Yeah, we shouldn't forget what our servicemen and women are fighting for, but we also have to live and be Americans. Patriotism isn't waving a flag and watching videos of the greatest crime in modern history. Patrotism is being a good member of society and trying to make the world a better place.

Agree. Daily viewing of that stuff would only desensitize a public that has attemped to move on and deal with everything that happened since that day.

Besides, I just realized that the photos are part of the ES training materials. You can find some of them in the scanner and observer training slides. However, what was really interesting about those photos was how they could be zoomed in as digital photos and you could see details that were otherwise naked to the eye.

By the way, the thing with the helicopter is a myth.

Eclipse

As I move all of my data up to the cloud, I am working through a decade of backups, system images, and other files.

I found my personal archive of everything I could find related to 9-11, including the versions of the CAP photos posted at the time.
The compressed .zip file is over 430 MB, and includes videos, photos, .pdfs, even some flash files.

If you would like a copy, PM me with an email address so I can share it to you.

"That Others May Zoom"

AirDX

I was supposed to fly to LAX that day - got woken up by a wild phone call from a friend at Scott AFB about 3:30 AM.  I turned on the news and sat mesmerized for about an hour.  After I watched the second tower come down at about 4:30 AM my time, I figured I wasn't flying anywhere that day, got dressed and went to work.  Strapped on a headset about 5:15 and vectored a bunch of flights coming off the ocean that had been diverted to HNL.  Most of them had no idea what was going on.  Worked through the chaos as Guard F-15s intercepted and eyeballed all the diverts, and the Navy sortied an Aegis cruiser that sat just offshore challenging everyone on guard.  A foreign air carrier aircraft strayed through the localizer and toward the city at one point, and I'm told he came within about 30 seconds after having a pair of Standard missiles launched at him. 

By 8 AM we were done, and the skies were empty.  By 10 AM we were coordinating the first post 9/11 civil flight, an air ambulance run from Maui.  By 11 AM I was back home, sitting in shock, staring at the TV.

My proudest moment of the whole day was due to my wife - as I headed out the door to work at 4:45 in the morning, she instinctively grabbed our American flag and posted it outside in its holder.  She just thought it was the thing to do at the time.  I agree.
Believe in fate, but lean forward where fate can see you.

a2capt

Quote from: AirDX on July 01, 2011, 06:49:03 AMMy proudest moment of the whole day was due to my wife - as I headed out the door to work at 4:45 in the morning, she instinctively grabbed our American flag and posted it outside in its holder.  She just thought it was the thing to do at the time.  I agree.
I posted the flag as I walked out the door, too. Went to work, got 'hassled' for being late, to which I responded, "I guess you're the only one that didn't turn on the TV this morning", and our work day ended about 2 hours later anyway. No one was in the mood.


I, too have about a gig and a half of stuff I saved from the following days. I've not looked at it all that much since, either. Still annoyed.


Other than a weird twist of fate, of my Goldberg type contraption for using an 8mm shoulder mount recorder as a VCR, that I had meant to record the History Channel that morning, (37), I missed it by one and set it for 36 instead, and ended up recording CNN and got two hours of recording that included the breaking news when the first one hit and they thought it was an accident, through most of the news breaking before the recorder stopped.  I didn't even realize I had done that until a couple years later when I was looking through unlabeled tapes to see what was on them. As that day I picked up a crapton of blanks and was recording quite a bit.


I didn't want it to be like events we read about in in school and only had the same six photos of, I wanted as much as I could get to have for sharing in the later years. 


I still have not gone through it all yet, either.

Майор Хаткевич

We would never have the "Same" 6 photos, because the internet existed in 2001. Barring world civilization collapse, those photos are forever there.

Luis R. Ramos

Are the photos online or not?

The link posted in the OP message does not work now.

There were at least two CAPflights to take photos. The first was from the Long Island Group, NY. The second one was the New York City Group airplane.

I am sure these photos are not lost!

Luis Ramos


Squadron Safety Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer

Eclipse

The link in the OP is 18 months old, not surprising it is dead.

When I have a minute I will post up the ones I have here.

"That Others May Zoom"

Eclipse


"That Others May Zoom"

LTC Don

Wow.  Awesome pictures.  Do you have any date/time info with those to provide some sort of timeline?


Cheers,
Donald A. Beckett, Lt Col, CAP
Commander
MER-NC-143
Gill Rob Wilson #1891

Eclipse

The versions I have don't have the EXIF data, but the flights were early on the 12th.

"That Others May Zoom"