Where is 2010 Winter Board Meeting?

[JC004]

They should call this the National Uniform Change Meeting.

National Board: The answer is simple.  Just STOP.

[Spike]

They should call this the National Uniform Change Meeting.

National Board: The answer is simple.  Just STOP.

Are you kidding.  They can't stop.  If they stopped, it may actually help improve CAP. 

The uniform situation is a freaking joke.  They should all be embarrassed on the number of uniform issues written in the agenda.  Maybe if they focused more on recruiting, retention and professional development instead of inventing uniforms, destroying uniforms and fighting with each other over uniforms they would be taken seriously. 

[DG]

A fair number of uniform issues, but a lot of meat on the agenda too.

Item 3a - uniform change process -- I find it hilarious that apparently the Uniform Committee is blaming the general membership for the "out of control" (their quote) uniform changes and that they feel the need to reinforce the ability of any commander to stop any change proposed by someone under their command.  ITS THE COLONELS WHO HAVE BEEN INSTIGATING THIS STUFF.  Still think it is a horrible idea to put the National Commander in total control of this process. 

Item 3b -- CSU -- apparently we're now saying the CSU was never actually approved the right way. 

Item 3c -- proposal that they come up with a single service dress uniform for ALL members.  The AF seems to be open to the idea of CAP having a single "military style" uniform, but doesn't indicate that they would support loosening our grooming/height/weight standards to let all CAP members wear the AF style.  So, we might be looking at a non-AF style service uniform.  Presumably this would lead us to a single non-AF style BDU/flight suit, and everything else. 

Item 5g - proposal to restrict powers of NEC -- extensive discussion on this in another thread.

Item 6b: "Quality Cadet Unit Award" -- Lets give everybody an streamer every year!  Biased against small units since you need at least 25 cadets to win.  Guess you're not quality unless you're big. 

Item 7b - A single document for all your quals -- ES, drivers, radio, first aid, etc.  Great idea!

Item 7c -- Limit CAP pilots to max 79 years old.  O-ride pilots not to exceed 69 years old.  There are 270 cadet orientation pilots age 70+ (of 2,240 total nationwide – 12%) that would be affected by this policy.  There are 34 CAPF 5 pilots age 80+ (of 3,270 total nationwide – 1%) that would be affected by this policy.

Item 8b -- election of Wing commanders.  CAP-USAF doesn't like.  Still alive, I guess. 

Air Patrol ribbon -- on the agenda.  committee reported back on criteria.

Can someone post the agenda?

[Spike]

^ First page

[High Speed Low Drag]

SIGH -  I have to admit that I am happy.  I am very scared about some of the things on the agenda, but I am still happy.  WHY?  Because it proves that the leadership is listening to the membership.  In a *large* number of those proposals, we were talked about.  Also, a lot of those issues, particularly the NEC and uniform issues, have been talked about here and a lot of what was said on the boards WAS PUT IN THE AGENDA ITEMS!!  I think that it reinforces that while every single CAP member may not be on CAPTalk and CadetStuff, in our own way, we represent (unintentionally, but still represent nonetheless) a large part of CAP Members, particularly senior members. 

Thank you to you NB members  & NHQ staff that participate actively or lurk on the boards for listening to us.  And an even bigger thank you for the willingness to step up to the plate and actually advance our thoughts.
Thank you,
Thank you,
Thank you!                   :clap:    :clap:    :clap:    :clap:    :clap:

I agree that it looks like CAP-USAF is anti-membership.   But I strongly suspect that he may be reflecting the views of a “bunch of” generals and probably the current USAF COS.  But, at least we will have tried.

And Spike - I know you are tired of unifroms and wold be perfectly happy to see us "fat/fuzzies" go away, but obvioulsy this is an item that is very important to the membership as a whole.  Just because you are tired of it does not make it any less important if the majority wants to talk about it.

[RiverAux]

FW, since you're probably our most "plugged in" active board member, do you think CAPTalk has helped push up some of these agenda items as High Speed suggests? 

[Cecil DP]

The Air Force side seems to be making some strong comments that many CAP members may not like.  I am so glad they are nonvoting members!

They're non-voting members, but they do control the uniforms, mission money, and quite a few other things.

[Spike]

And Spike - I know you are tired of unifroms and wold be perfectly happy to see us "fat/fuzzies" go away, but obvioulsy this is an item that is very important to the membership as a whole.  Just because you are tired of it does not make it any less important if the majority wants to talk about it.

You have never read my other posts then.  I am for the CSU, and wear it too. 

[flyguy06]

SYou all say thast CAP-USAF is anti-membership? How is that so? And why are people on here anti- CAP-USAF? I havent really gotten that deep into what CAP-USAF says but I think if we are their auxillary we should probably listen to them.

[FW]

FW, since you're probably our most "plugged in" active board member, do you think CAPTalk has helped push up some of these agenda items as High Speed suggests? 

By "board member" you do mean the CT board... 

Yes, I think CAPTalk has been a major force in advancing the agenda for the next NB meeting. 

SYou all say thast CAP-USAF is anti-membership? How is that so? And why are people on here anti- CAP-USAF? I havent really gotten that deep into what CAP-USAF says but I think if we are their auxillary we should probably listen to them.

CAP-USAF is not "anti-membership".  The commander has his opinions on the agenda items and, that is it.  It is the duty of the National Board to do what it feels is in the best interests of CAP and, should take his opinionions seriously.

As I've said before, the "CSU" is not the issue.  It is the process by which it was born; lived; and died.  The process is broken, IMO, and must be fixed.  Hopefully the NB will rise to the occasion and accomplish this.

[High Speed Low Drag]

And Spike - I know you are tired of unifroms and wold be perfectly happy to see us "fat/fuzzies" go away, but obvioulsy this is an item that is very important to the membership as a whole.  Just because you are tired of it does not make it any less important if the majority wants to talk about it.

You have never read my other posts then.  I am for the CSU, and wear it too.

Sorry Spike, Got you confused with another board member.  My bad.

[High Speed Low Drag]

SYou all say thast CAP-USAF is anti-membership? How is that so? And why are people on here anti- CAP-USAF? I havent really gotten that deep into what CAP-USAF says but I think if we are their auxillary we should probably listen to them.

CAP-USAF is not "anti-membership".  The commander has his opinions on the agenda items and, that is it.  It is the duty of the National Board to do what it feels is in the best interests of CAP and, should take his opinionions seriously.

As I've said before, the "CSU" is not the issue.  It is the process by which it was born; lived; and died.  The process is broken, IMO, and must be fixed.  Hopefully the NB will rise to the occasion and accomplish this.

As I read CAP-USAF's opinion, when he was talking about some issues, he was quick to say CAP is NOT military and does not follow the military model.  However, on other issues, he said that the proposal does not follow miltary models.  It seems to me that he wants CAP to follow military models when it advances his viewpoint.  I also got that feeling that he is anti-membership becuase a lot of the issues that deal with grass-roots (membership) initiated stuff, he is against.  Just MHO.

[Spike]

^ I read his comments the same way as well.

[Gunner C]

I disagree.  Having been a military officer, I can see what's happening here.  His boss (read: commander, air university after being counseled by the AF COS) has said "this is the AF position.  Make it happen."  He is not going to vary one bit from his instructions.  He's a fine fellow and I'm sure a good officer.  He's just not able to have his own opinion - it is supplied for him.

What chaps me is that the AF has declared itself the final arbiter of ANY uniform that may look military.  In the end, there may need to be some gentle persuasion from our friends in the Congressional Squadron.  Now some will say that this is going too far.  But I'll remind you that one of the most powerful political organizations in the country is the National Guard Association.  The Guard never blushes if it goes forward with political clout when necessary.

Another thought:  I'd like to thank all of those members of the national board who heard our opinions and went forward with proposals.  I read the agenda of the NB meeting and several things were nearly taken word for word from opinions that we expressed.  I think the CC/CAP-USAF did the same, thus the unusually strident opinions from him.

CAP and USAF have come to an impasse.  We may not be able to see that much of the streaming video.  I expect there will be a great deal of blood on the lens.

[High Speed Low Drag]

I disagree.  Having been a military officer, I can see what's happening here.  His boss (read: commander, air university after being counseled by the AF COS) has said "this is the AF position.  Make it happen."  He is not going to vary one bit from his instructions.  He's a fine fellow and I'm sure a good officer.  He's just not able to have his own opinion - it is supplied for him.

Thanks Gunner C - That's what I was trying (unsucessfully) to say earlier.

[Gunner C]

I disagree.  Having been a military officer, I can see what's happening here.  His boss (read: commander, air university after being counseled by the AF COS) has said "this is the AF position.  Make it happen."  He is not going to vary one bit from his instructions.  He's a fine fellow and I'm sure a good officer.  He's just not able to have his own opinion - it is supplied for him.

Thanks Gunner C - That's what I was trying (unsucessfully) to say earlier.

No extra charge. 

Just watch.  He's going to defend that position like a bulldog.  He's not going to back down and he'll never give up.  There's going to be some real fireworks there.

[NCRblues]

I agree with you gunner 100%, this is not his opinion, he is being told what it will be and to not back down from "on high"

Now some of you will disagree with the next part, but oh well...

IMO, this hard line Air force response is what cap is going to experience for a wile thanks to our past National commander, and lets be honest here folks, you can only pee in so many morning coffees of 0-7's and above before you feel the pain.

I really wish i could be their, but ill be in turkey so maybe ill watch on-line and see some of those "fireworks"

[CAPSGT]

In addition to the comments that there is probably pressure from above, the current CAP-USAF/CC seems in general to be more outspoken than his predecessor.

[FW]

^I'm not too sure about "pressure from above".  My contacts on the BoG haven't made any reference to "pressure".  But, they may not be talking about it.  I'm glad I'll be watching from the cheap seats.  It is going to be worth the train ride down to see what happens.

[Gunner C]

The BOG holds no sway on CC/CAP-USAF.  This is Hqs USAF stuff, I'm sure of it.  As far as our former CC/CAP, you're probably right.