CAP [Transformers]: "More than meets the skies"

[Major Carrales]

Steps in the right direction, probably.  But just realize it's a massive issue deserving of serious, lengthy conversation, debate, and thought.  Don't dismiss our criticism as empty banter designed to further disjoint our organization.   Rather, it is constructive concern on our part for the direction our organization is going with this sensitive and important project.

I don't see it as "constructive," if it really was constructive concern the place to whine about it is through channels. 

Send a letter to National, make an official suggestion or commentary.  Don't come to a non-"CAP official" Internet forum and join a chorus of other "incredulous" sorts taking very public smacks a the tag line of a new Marketing Effort.   When, really, the best that could happen is that Brig General Courter might see it here and the worst that could happen is some potential CAP Officer or Cadets comes here and sees numerous (we don't know who is a members and who is not here) people swating at it in a display of disunity.

Maybe it was that I was there at the PAO Academy and saw the confidence, professional and zeal filled presentation of it by EXPERTS, who showed the date driven reason for its inception.  Maybe it is just that...for the first time...a unified PUBLIC AFFAIRS effort is going forward.  Then I come here and see people take pot shots at a tag line (the MOST ancillary part of it all) to the discredit of us all.

How can you defend this...?!?

[RiverAux]

Sorry, but you're making the same objections that can be said about just about everything on this web page -- if seen by those not familiar with CAP, it gives them a bad idea about the organization.  Well, this is not a recruiting site.  It is a site for CAP members to discuss CAP. 

Now, in this area in particular NHQ missed a major opportunity.  I don't know how many other organizations that I've been in where they ask for member input on things like the name of the organization, motto, etc...They usually ask for input and often have a member vote on it.  I see this whole thing as no different -- a situation where the widest possible input from the members could have been helpful.  And, if nothing else it would allow for a sense of buy-in to the program.  Even if people don't like the final finished product, they are much less inclined to go after it with a blowtorch if they had some reasonable say during its development. 

[Pylon]

I don't see it as "constructive," if it really was constructive concern the place to whine about it is through channels. 

Send a letter to National, make an official suggestion or commentary.  Don't come to a non-"CAP official" Internet forum and join a chorus of other "incredulous" sorts taking very public smacks a the tag line of a new Marketing Effort.   When, really, the best that could happen is that Brig General Courter might see it here and the worst that could happen is some potential CAP Officer or Cadets comes here and sees numerous (we don't know who is a members and who is not here) people swating at it in a display of disunity.

Maybe it was that I was there at the PAO Academy and saw the confidence, professional and zeal filled presentation of it by EXPERTS, who showed the date driven reason for its inception.  Maybe it is just that...for the first time...a unified PUBLIC AFFAIRS effort is going forward.  Then I come here and see people take pot shots at a tag line (the MOST ancillary part of it all) to the discredit of us all.

How can you defend this...?!?

Calm down.  Have some dip.

You're way off base in my opinion.  By saying this:

I don't see it as "constructive," if it really was constructive concern the place to whine about it is through channels.

That would indicate that every conversation that has and could possibly take place on CAPTalk is not constructive in nature.  Is the only place to have constructive conversation within the chain of command?  I, for one, think CAPTalk is the perfect place to have productive, thought-provoking conversations.  I guess you disagree.  There's always the door called "logout".

Send a letter to National, make an official suggestion or commentary.  Don't come to a non-"CAP official" Internet forum and join a chorus of other "incredulous" sorts taking very public smacks a the tag line of a new Marketing Effort.

CAPTalk is the place for us to develop these ideas.  It's also fair to criticize an idea that one honestly feels is bad.  Do I need to tell my Squadron Commander in an official memorandum, destined ultimately for NHQ/PAO that I feel it's bad?  I don't think so.  I would much rather hash out the ideas, thoughts, and suggestions here and make a much more cohesive, productive, and positive piece to send up the chain.

I understand you like it.  You were there when the "sell" was made, we weren't.  From the perspective of the 99% of CAP members who didn't get the lengthy explanation of why we should like the tagline, I don't like it.  It doesn't mean I'm a destructive person hell-bent on bad-mouthing national headquarters.   I would think by now you would have realized this.

Maybe it was that I was there at the PAO Academy and saw the confidence, professional and zeal filled presentation of it by EXPERTS, who showed the date driven reason for its inception.  Maybe it is just that...for the first time...a unified PUBLIC AFFAIRS effort is going forward.  Then I come here and see people take pot shots at a tag line (the MOST ancillary part of it all) to the discredit of us all.

Unfortunately, you claim that the tagline is the most ancillary part of it all, but it's really the only piece of significance that's been presented here.  Care to share the rest of the marketing plan that went along with it?  Maybe it will help us all to see the bigger picture into which the tagline falls.

By the way, I'm not taking pot shots.  I also would figure by now you'd be able to discern legitimate concern for the public affairs state of Civil Air Patrol and a true personal want to see that turned around.




But hey, what do I know.  I'm just the guy writing from his office with "Marketing & Communications" engraved below his name on the door.

[Major Carrales]

I'm sorry...but when I see people "dog-piling" on something based only on cursory understanding, I find it concerning.

That is not debating, or discussing matters...its wreckless.  And, what's more, its public!

[Al Sayre]

From chaos comes innovation...

[jimmydeanno]

Tag lines are ancillary and likely forgotten.

I don't think they really are - if CAP did a National advertising campaign and actually got some commercial time, radio time, etc I do believe that people would remember it.

Just think of how many military "tag lines" you can remember, years after they discontinued them...

Be all that you can be...
Army of One
Army Strong (which hasn't been out too long and people already remember it)
The few the proud
Cross into the blue
Get an edge on life
You and the Navy, full speed ahead
Be part of the action
Aim High
It's not just a job, it's an adventure
It's a great place to start
Opportunity is waiting for you
Stand up, stand out
It's a great way to serve
Americans at their best
Let the journey begin
We're looking for a few good men
Make it happen
You can...

So you can see that picking a tag line is important because people DO remember them and they may represent your organization for YEARS to come...

[Al Sayre]

You know, after chewing on it a bit, the Transformers thing kind of fits.  Most of the time, we are just Joe Average Citizen doing our regular jobs, but when the telephone rings or the workday ends we tranform ourselves in to CAP Officers, faster than a speeding ultralight, with spectral imaging vision capabilities, able to leap tall buildings in a single engine Cessna... er performing ES, CD, and HLS missions, teaching Cadets and AE and so on. 

[Sgt. Savage]

I'm sorry...but when I see people "dog-piling" on something based only on cursory understanding, I find it concerning.

That is not debating, or discussing matters...its wreckless.  And, what's more, its public!

Cursory understanding.... I think we may have a little more insight than that, we are the membership at large. I am much more concerned that potential members will have little more than cursory understanding of our organization and likely include this hokey tag line in their overall assesment of the organization.

Mind you, I don't hate the tag line, it serves a purpose. What I don't like is its striking resemblance to a cartoon phrase that is most universaly recognized from the "Transformers" cartoon seiries. It isn't the message, it's the delivery that's flawed.

[A.Member]

I don't see it as "constructive," if it really was constructive concern the place to whine about it is through channels. 

Send a letter to National, make an official suggestion or commentary.  Don't come to a non-"CAP official" Internet forum and join a chorus of other "incredulous" sorts taking very public smacks a the tag line of a new Marketing Effort.   When, really, the best that could happen is that Brig General Courter might see it here and the worst that could happen is some potential CAP Officer or Cadets comes here and sees numerous (we don't know who is a members and who is not here) people swating at it in a display of disunity.

Maybe it was that I was there at the PAO Academy and saw the confidence, professional and zeal filled presentation of it by EXPERTS, who showed the date driven reason for its inception.  Maybe it is just that...for the first time...a unified PUBLIC AFFAIRS effort is going forward.  Then I come here and see people take pot shots at a tag line (the MOST ancillary part of it all) to the discredit of us all.

How can you defend this...?!?

Calm down.  Have some dip.

You're way off base in my opinion.  By saying this:

I don't see it as "constructive," if it really was constructive concern the place to whine about it is through channels.

That would indicate that every conversation that has and could possibly take place on CAPTalk is not constructive in nature.  Is the only place to have constructive conversation within the chain of command?  I, for one, think CAPTalk is the perfect place to have productive, thought-provoking conversations.  I guess you disagree.  There's always the door called "logout".

Send a letter to National, make an official suggestion or commentary.  Don't come to a non-"CAP official" Internet forum and join a chorus of other "incredulous" sorts taking very public smacks a the tag line of a new Marketing Effort.

CAPTalk is the place for us to develop these ideas.  It's also fair to criticize an idea that one honestly feels is bad.  Do I need to tell my Squadron Commander in an official memorandum, destined ultimately for NHQ/PAO that I feel it's bad?  I don't think so.  I would much rather hash out the ideas, thoughts, and suggestions here and make a much more cohesive, productive, and positive piece to send up the chain.

I understand you like it.  You were there when the "sell" was made, we weren't.  From the perspective of the 99% of CAP members who didn't get the lengthy explanation of why we should like the tagline, I don't like it.  It doesn't mean I'm a destructive person hell-bent on bad-mouthing national headquarters.   I would think by now you would have realized this.

Maybe it was that I was there at the PAO Academy and saw the confidence, professional and zeal filled presentation of it by EXPERTS, who showed the date driven reason for its inception.  Maybe it is just that...for the first time...a unified PUBLIC AFFAIRS effort is going forward.  Then I come here and see people take pot shots at a tag line (the MOST ancillary part of it all) to the discredit of us all.

Unfortunately, you claim that the tagline is the most ancillary part of it all, but it's really the only piece of significance that's been presented here.  Care to share the rest of the marketing plan that went along with it?  Maybe it will help us all to see the bigger picture into which the tagline falls.

By the way, I'm not taking pot shots.  I also would figure by now you'd be able to discern legitimate concern for the public affairs state of Civil Air Patrol and a true personal want to see that turned around.

But hey, what do I know.  I'm just the guy writing from his office with "Marketing & Communications" engraved below his name on the door.

Well said.

[Skyray]

Jimmy missed one in his list of forgotten tag lines.  Years ago the Marines used "Looking for a few good men."  It was years before Gender Correctness struck our great nation.

To appreciate the next anecdote, you have to know that the marines don't have chaplains, medical corps, supply corps, and all that other stuff, they depend on the Navy.

I had a roommate years after who used to say:

The Marine Corps has a few good men.  They call them Corpsmen.

[JC004]

Jimmy missed one in his list of forgotten tag lines.  Years ago the Marines used "Looking for a few good men."  It was years before Gender Correctness struck our great nation.

To appreciate the next anecdote, you have to know that the marines don't have chaplains, medical corps, supply corps, and all that other stuff, they depend on the Navy.

I had a roommate years after who used to say:

The Marine Corps has a few good men.  They call them Corpsmen.

oh my...stay away from beaches.  Marines are likely to show up, land, and destroy you now

[JohnKachenmeister]

I was a Corpsman, and I support that statement!

[pixelwonk]

Jimmy missed one in his list of forgotten tag lines.  Years ago the Marines used "Looking for a few good men."  It was years before Gender Correctness struck our great nation.

To appreciate the next anecdote, you have to know that the marines don't have chaplains, medical corps, supply corps, and all that other stuff, they depend on the Navy.

I had a roommate years after who used to say:

The Marine Corps has a few good men.  They call them Corpsmen.

oh my...stay away from beaches.  Marines are likely to show up, land, and destroy you now

Skyray's a Marine himself.

[RiverAux]

Have any of you checked out those "We're There" PSAs on CAPCHANNEL?  Thats not a bad slogan. 

[A.Member]

Have any of you checked out those "We're There" PSAs on CAPCHANNEL?  Thats not a bad slogan. 

I agree, the're not too bad.  Much better than the current offering that's for certain.