Navy Blue Flight Suit -- Vanguard vs FlightSuits

[riffraff]

Does anyone know the quality of the navy blue nomex flights suits at Vanguard?  I was an EMS pilot in a past life and still have my navy blue nomex suit. I was intending to wear it for CAP and was curious if it's comparable to the one Vanguard offers? Nobody in my unit has one.

My ex-EMS suit is an FSL-27/P by FlightSuits (www.flightsuits.com). It's a clone of the CWU-27/P USAF suit except for being made in navy blue instead of sage. Quality is excellent and color matches the dark blue BDU uniform.

[SJFedor]

Looks like it'd be fine, as long as you don't have the reflective striping that most HEMS companies have on it 

I've only ever seen 1 of the nomex blue flight suits, and honestly, they look pretty nice. The person that was wearing it didn't need to be (could have worn the AF one) but wore the blue, and had the navy blue embroidered grade on it. Looked really sharp.

[pixelwonk]

Word of warning...

The Navy Blue non-nomex flight suit referred to as the "Utility coverall" that Vanguard sells is not what's depicted in the Uniform manual.
CAPM39-1 shows what looks to be a garment identical to the navy blue flight suit.

If anybody can recall the $30 first iteration of the utility suit, it had no flap over the pocket, velcro in the wrong places, a weird collar unlike that of a flightsuit, and worst of all, it wore terrible.
"Utility suit 2.0," first put out by CAPMart, promised that was changed to a better one, and they upped the price to 40 clams.

Yeah, so I ordered one almost two months ago.  Got it after being backordered for a month.  Do you think I received the new and improved navy blue utility suit pictured on CAPM39-1 AND Vanguard's website?
Not only no, but hell no.

I got what I described above, except that I didn't pay $30 for it, I paid $40!
After sending it back almost two weeks ago and complaining to Vanguard, they have not refunded my purchase after having been authorized to returned it.
I have asked why they are advertising something they aren't selling to the consumer and have not gotten any response back, however they swapped the image of the authorized suit with yep, you guessed it...


FYI... If you want to see the blue rag, just Google "Rothco flight suit" which is what it is.
Here's what I should have gotten, since they don't have it on their website anymore:

[riffraff]

Thanks, Steve.

My suit is a stock flightsuit. We only wore black leather nametags on them. No reflective tape, etc. I have a nomex navy blue CWU-45, as well. Just looking to save some $$ and not have to buy a green suit and jacket.

Looks like it'd be fine, as long as you don't have the reflective striping that most HEMS companies have on it 

I've only ever seen 1 of the nomex blue flight suits, and honestly, they look pretty nice. The person that was wearing it didn't need to be (could have worn the AF one) but wore the blue, and had the navy blue embroidered grade on it. Looked really sharp.

[Nomex Maximus]

Vanguard is VERY slow and VERY difficult on uniform returns. I had to argue with them over many phone calls for two months to get them to refund the two suits I returned to them - the first was the wrong size (my fault) the second was the smurf suit color (their fault).

If you want a blue flight suit, I strongly recommend going to aureus international directly. You can get the blue flight suit for $195. http://www.aureusinternational.com/ When I ordered my suit they didn't have my size in stock, but sewed me a new one within a few days.

[SJFedor]

Thanks, Steve.

My suit is a stock flightsuit. We only wore black leather nametags on them. No reflective tape, etc. I have a nomex navy blue CWU-45, as well. Just looking to save some $$ and not have to buy a green suit and jacket.

Looks like it'd be fine, as long as you don't have the reflective striping that most HEMS companies have on it 

I've only ever seen 1 of the nomex blue flight suits, and honestly, they look pretty nice. The person that was wearing it didn't need to be (could have worn the AF one) but wore the blue, and had the navy blue embroidered grade on it. Looked really sharp.

Well, slap some velcro and patches on there, and you're ready to go wheels up!

[O-Rex]

Blue Nomex Flightsuits are available from Aureus International for $195

http://www.imall3d.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=FS10&Category_Code=fc&Store_Code=aureus

[Nomex Maximus]

Iddn't dat wat I sed?

[AlphaSigOU]

For the best non-nomex navy blue bag, get yerself one made by Tru-Spec. It's virtually identical to the real nomex bag except it's cotton and has some features left over from the McPeak style bag, namely no thigh-top pockets or inner thigh knife pocket (aka 'pecker' pocket - moved to the lower right leg pocket), but it does have side entry pockets, well known as 'happy pockets' that the green nomex bag doesn't have.

Plus you can sew on navy blue background grade insignia. (Applies to blue nomex and utility bag). Tru-Spec bags have metal zippers, while Rothco bags have nylon zippers. Never cared for Rothco bags.

[SAR-EMT1]

OK, I know that the fire hazzard of a 172/82 isnt great, but still...
WHAT may I ask is the point of a flight suit if it isnt noxex/aramid?

Fashion statement?    ... Reminds me of AFBlues

[O-Rex]

Iddn't dat wat I sed?

Yeah, that's what happens when I don't keep the page up and don't refresh. 

That one IS yours.....

[riffraff]

Probably a 50/50 blend of perceived safety and fashion statement for both nomex and non-nomex suits.

The perceived safety statement addresses the belief that nomex is fireproof. It isn't. Obviously a cotton suit has no fire protection properties either. 

For Nomex, the original intent was to protect against a high-temp, flash-fire -- i.e. my jet just blew up and I need a few seconds protection so I can get out. I don't recall the exact duration but I think the intent was to provide about 3-5 seconds of flash protection. Not the typical scenario for a general aviation (GA) aircraft fire. Nomex doesn't protect against long-duration/low temperature fires (e.g. avgas open flame environment).

Flightsuits were also originally issued as coveralls and intended for wear over a uniform -- to protect the underlying uniform from the grubby interiors of military aircraft. I've seen some folks use them in this fashion and, in that light, the suits perform as advertised although I'll concede that CAP aircraft tend to be pretty clean inside. The streamlined design also does a good job at minimizing getting parts of clothing snagged in doors, etc.

Lastly, there's the legacy/tradition aspect of the flightsuits. They've been worn for decades and have come to symbolize professional aircrew. Plus they look cool!

To answer your original question, IMO the non-nomex suits are probably just as effective as nomex in the CAP setting.

I've always worn nomex in both military and EMS flying. While the fire protection probably isn't really there for CAP ops, I think I feel psychologically safer wearing it -- if that makes any sense to anyone   

OK, I know that the fire hazzard of a 172/82 isnt great, but still...
WHAT may I ask is the point of a flight suit if it isnt noxex/aramid?

Fashion statement?    ... Reminds me of AFBlues

[flyerthom]

Blue Nomex Flightsuits are available from Aureus International for $195

http://www.imall3d.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=FS10&Category_Code=fc&Store_Code=aureus

I had an AI flightsuit at work. Didn't care for the fit. Using a Gibson now and it's much better. I believe Gibson bought out flightsuits but I'm not sure.

[pixelwonk]

flightsuits.com is Gibson and Barnes now.  URL still works, tho.