Beards?

[RogueLeader]

I'll turn the question around, Why should we have to be clean shaven?  There is no practical reason, unlike the military which has the requirement because of the protective masks.

Sure there is, it has a distinctively professional look.  Look at most companies around the country, most have policies that state clean shaven- including mustaches. Most of the companies that do not mandate clean shaved also have very tight rules on beards and goatees.  It's all about the image.

I agree with the sentiment here, but in my 15+ years in the workplace, I have never been anywhere that had a beard / hair policy. 

I have worked at numerous jobs, and applied at many more that have restrictive hair/grooming standards.  They aren't high-end places, but the standards are national through some of the corporations.

[SarDragon]

I have worked at numerous jobs, and applied at many more that have restrictive hair/grooming standards.  They aren't high-end places, but the standards are national through some of the corporations.

Would it be safe to guess that most of these jobs had some involvement with food? Now you are in a very specialized arena.

With regard to the broad job market, I've seen very few restrictions on hair and beards unless there are safety issues involved. Some companies want a "professional" appearance, but that can certainly be achieved wearing a beard, and a reasonably short haircut.

[RogueLeader]

I have worked at numerous jobs, and applied at many more that have restrictive hair/grooming standards.  They aren't high-end places, but the standards are national through some of the corporations.

Would it be safe to guess that most of these jobs had some involvement with food? Now you are in a very specialized arena.

With regard to the broad job market, I've seen very few restrictions on hair and beards unless there are safety issues involved. Some companies want a "professional" appearance, but that can certainly be achieved wearing a beard, and a reasonably short haircut.

Only about 25 to 40 %

[SarDragon]

I have worked at numerous jobs, and applied at many more that have restrictive hair/grooming standards.  They aren't high-end places, but the standards are national through some of the corporations.

Would it be safe to guess that most of these jobs had some involvement with food? Now you are in a very specialized arena.

With regard to the broad job market, I've seen very few restrictions on hair and beards unless there are safety issues involved. Some companies want a "professional" appearance, but that can certainly be achieved wearing a beard, and a reasonably short haircut.

Only about 25 to 40 %

And what were the others, in general? No company names needed.

[jimmydeanno]

My comany is very lax...right now I am barefoot (in my cube) wearing cargo shorts and a CAP T-Shirt, no belt, unshaven and bedhead...welcome to the world of computer network hardware engineering...

[Lancer]

And what were the others, in general? No company names needed.

I work for 'the world's biggest soft-drink bottler' and they do not restrict hair or beard wear on the production floor. Granted you have to wear hair and beard nets, but there are no restrictions on clean shaven or not.

I had a goatee before I started working here and I opted to shave it off just so I don't have to fuss with a beard net on the rare occasion's that I had to work or pass through the production floor.

Did I like my goatee? and not shaving around my mouth and chin? Sure...but for me it wasn't a big deal to shave it off. I do have to admit to a more 'professional' looking appearance being clean shaven, but you can look 'professional' with a beard too.

I don't have an issue with someone wanting to wear a neatly trimmed beard or goatee with the new Corporate Service Dress if it helps narrow down the uniform choices we have.

[Pumbaa]

I shave off my goatee when I feel like it.  No one tells me to.

I keep it really neat and trim, I actually look more professional with it than without.

If I want to wear blues or TPU, then I will shave.  I choose not to anymore.  I wear greys.

Leave things as is, or you will have a mass exodus, I for one am very tired of this type of stuff..

[fyrfitrmedic]

My comany is very lax...right now I am barefoot (in my cube) wearing cargo shorts and a CAP T-Shirt, no belt, unshaven and bedhead...welcome to the world of computer network hardware engineering...

When I worked in IT, the ISP I worked for had to politely ask folks to wear shoes when clients came to tour the facility. The sales force had a dress code; we techies had one that said 'please wear underwear, please don't wear ties'.

[Chappie]

I had a full beard for 24 years before I joined CAP.  I knew that I could opt out for the Blazer combo for dressier occasions, the white aviator shirt-blue polo shirt/grey slacks for meetings, and the smurf suit for missions....but I felt since a majority of the work I would be doing was with cadets, the beard went so I could wear the USAF-style uniforms and BDUs -- which I felt would be more appropriate in the settings where I would be participating with cadets.  Figured, if they take great pride in wearing the uniform....why shouldn't I?

[RogueLeader]

I have worked at numerous jobs, and applied at many more that have restrictive hair/grooming standards.  They aren't high-end places, but the standards are national through some of the corporations.

Would it be safe to guess that most of these jobs had some involvement with food? Now you are in a very specialized arena.

With regard to the broad job market, I've seen very few restrictions on hair and beards unless there are safety issues involved. Some companies want a "professional" appearance, but that can certainly be achieved wearing a beard, and a reasonably short haircut.

Only about 25 to 40 %

And what were the others, in general? No company names needed.

Merchandise outlets, and sales stores, where personnel are in the public viewpoint for a good portion of the time.

[SarDragon]

Merchandise outlets, and sales stores, where personnel are in the public viewpoint for a good portion of the time.

Mostly staffed by folks 25 or under?

BTW, I'm going somewhere with this once I get all the info. This should be the last piece.

[Trung Si Ma]

There are other reasons to wear a beard ...

I find that my beard hides the scars from PH#2 quite well - guess I'll keep it.

[Ford73Diesel]

I agree with the sentiment here, but in my 15+ years in the workplace, I have never been anywhere that had a beard / hair policy. 

My work has a strict facial hair policy, they will send you home or make yuo shave if you come in with facial hair.

[capchiro]

Back in the 60's-70's, didn't the Navy have real lax regulations concerning beards, hair and side burns?  When did they change back and does anyone know why?  I personally feel that if a person works with cadets, they should keep their beards neat, especially the women.. I guess with the  various uniforms we have and the current regulations, CAP has deemed personnel with beards are as valuable as personnel without beards.  I personally don't like the TPU as I think double breasted jackets make "portly" gentlemen look "wider".  Didn't Jackie Gleason use to wear one similar to our TPU?

[RiverAux]

I agree with Dragoon in concept.  CAP does not actually have a uniform since it lets anyone wear almost any uniform they want at almost any time.  I really am starting to wonder why we even bother anymore.  When you're at the point where on almost any occassion there are anywhere from 3-8 (and I'm only guessing at the top number) potential uniforms that can be worn generally at the individual's discretion, it just doesn't make any sense. 

CAP needs to pick a side, any side, and go for it. 

[SarDragon]

Back in the 60's-70's, didn't the Navy have real lax regulations concerning beards, hair and side burns?  When did they change back and does anyone know why?  I personally feel that if a person works with cadets, they should keep their beards neat, especially the women.. I guess with the  various uniforms we have and the current regulations, CAP has deemed personnel with beards are as valuable as personnel without beards.  I personally don't like the TPU as I think double breasted jackets make "portly" gentlemen look "wider".  Didn't Jackie Gleason use to wear one similar to our TPU?

As one of the Canoe Club experts here, and a beard wearer while on AD, here's my knowledge.

The Navy, to the best of my knowledge and research, did not specifically prohibit beards at any time from 1969 (when I enlisted) until 1 Jan 1985, when they went away forever. Prior to Adm. Zumwalt's term as CNO, beards were generally discouraged on shore, and required to be grown. At sea, the rules were significantly relaxed, but the big shave was expected prior to pulling into port.

Zumwalt pretty much opened the door for wear by anyone, anytime. The reg was then enforced at its face value. After his departure, there were various attempts to discourage beards, but they were largely unsuccessful, and enforcement was inconsistent.

All that ended on 1 Jan 1985. The "official" reason was stated as safety concern associated with personal protective equipment. Most breathing apparatus will not properly seal on a bearded face. I have that knowledge empirically.

Another reason, IMHO, was the appearance factor presented by the under 25 guys who had shaggy, poorly trimmed beards they had no business growing. Call it a form of age discrimination if you will, but most guys under 25 can't grow good looking beards. My first attempt at 21 or 22 looked bad, so it went away quickly. My next effort at 24 was well accepted by my superiors, so I kept it. I had a beard off and on from '73 to '85, and full time since I retired from the Navy in '89.

[SeattleSarge]

CAP is... say it with me... "not the military"

Thank you Justin.  I like hearing that coming from someone else....

-SeattleSarge

[John Bryan]

I know the Navy did away with them but there is still one Uniformed Service which allows them....the United States Public Health Service....In fact 2 of the recent Surgeons General have had beards....Vice Adm Charles Everett Koop (1981 - 1989) and Vice Adm David Satcher (1998 - 2002)

[RogueLeader]

Merchandise outlets, and sales stores, where personnel are in the public viewpoint for a good portion of the time.

Mostly staffed by folks 25 or under?

BTW, I'm going somewhere with this once I get all the info. This should be the last piece.

about 1/2 and 1/2. Depending on the time of day.  some more, some less.

[SarDragon]

My reason for asking should be obvious from my last post. It's all an image thing, and, sadly, the younger folks need all the help they can get to fit in.

I know very few folks in CAP under 30 with beards, and none of them looked all that good, mostly due to the patchiness. I have only seen one member over 30 that had a beard that need some serious attention, and he got some one-on-one counselling about it. It quickly ceased to be a problem.