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CAP Talk  |  Operations  |  Tall Tales  |  Topic: Memories - IN PROCESSING - the very beginning of enc
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Author Topic: Memories - IN PROCESSING - the very beginning of enc  (Read 20319 times)
a2capt
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« Reply #120 on: October 23, 2013, 06:01:01 PM »

The same kind of hat that was specifically called out and circulated widely as a specific example of unauthorized?
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Майор Хаткевич
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« Reply #121 on: October 23, 2013, 06:20:46 PM »

Right. After 2012 encampment season.
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ol'fido
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« Reply #122 on: October 23, 2013, 06:23:19 PM »

I will say that we have had a person wearing a "Smokey" at the Illinois Wing Summer Encampment. However, this person was a former cadet and senior member who is currently stationed at Lackland AFB as an MTI. Although, he has just been selected for commissioning in the AF Medical Service Corps. When he was wearing the smokey(and his AF ABUs) he was giving our ATS cadets a class on leadership and AVOIDING "FULL METAL JACKET" SYNDROME. I think he would find this thread very curious.
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Lt. Col. Randy L. Mitchell
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a2capt
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« Reply #123 on: October 23, 2013, 06:27:02 PM »

Right. After 2012 encampment season.
Maybe some poor PAO will slipup and post something.. and it gets noticed.
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superchief1077
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« Reply #124 on: December 30, 2013, 11:13:33 PM »

I know this is an old post but I thought this would be fun......

I got bored and started reading different posts. I got to this one and it caught my attention. A little background: I spent my last Encampment a couple of years ago and went to boot camp at Parris Island right afterwards so it's been a while. I've been to 5 Encampments as a cadet so I'm totally aware that basic training and basic Encampment are not the same. However, CAP cadets do tend to impersonate Marine Corps boot camp the most thanks to YouTube, I did to when I was 13, but who isn't guilty of being just 13.

A lot of you guys talk about the "Full Metal Jacket Syndrome" and how it doesn't happen today. So I thought I'd talk about how boot is done today in its modern state and compare/contrast FMJ since it seems like there are a few vets here that have been for a while.

People don't give enough credit to R Lee Ermy. Yeah, it's no secret his portrayal of a Drill Instructor was that of an abusive sadistic monster. However, he wasn't even supposed to be casted as Gunny Hartman. This was because he portrayed a Drill Instructor before the Hartman role and Stanley Kubrik thought he was too nice for the role.

In his role as Staff Sergeant Loyce from the movie "Boys of Company C", he acts as a Drill Instructor that is not just portrayed as some monster that crushes people's souls, but as someone who is training people to survive Vietnam. The movie still has the abusive language that you find with Hartman, however it is the MENTORSHIP provided to one of his recruits that truly shows the kind of leadership and instruction that CAP, in my opinion, lacks. He shows that he trains them to a standard because it's up to him how "they come back". Now, we don't have the job of sending these kids to war (you should all thank God you don't have that responsibility), but we still have the duty of developing these young people into better citizens and future leaders.

As the FMJ platoon had their Senior, my platoon had ours. To truly understand what a Senior Drill Instructor does that's relatable to CAP members, I'll use Encampment Staff positions to help describe him. The Senior is a mix of the TAC Officer and a Flight/Squadron CC. TAC Officer in that they have the administrative and mentoring responsibilities. Squadron/Flight CC in that they were responsibility in training and graduating them. They've usually had 4-7 cycles (12-21 months) as junior DI before picking up Senior. They act as the Dad/Mom of the Platoon. When things go south, they pick everyone up off the ground and help them stand up. If the subordinate DI's get too out of hand, the Senior "saves" the platoon from getting blazed, smoked etc. This last part is a sort of "bad cop good cop" act. It's used in order to create loyalty to the platoon instead of needlessly telling Officers which will end Marine's careers if something is slightly not done according to the SOP.

I say this last part because of this thing where things have "changed" since the Vietnam era. Drill Instructors still do things that you see in the movies. I've seen things that make Hartman look like wuss. In protection of other Marines, I won't say any specifics, but just know that what happens in the house stays in the house. Plus I know some of you cadets aspire to become Marines so I don't wanna spoil all the games you get to experience at boot and even more so in the Fleet especially if you choose to go into a combat arms MOS, mainly the grunts (get used to the tree line if you do choose 03XX and choose to be a garbage Marine).

Anyways, back to the Senior. The main he does that the other DI's and instructors won't do is sit down man to man and mentor you. He can lift you up or break your heart. He gives you his experience and tells you WHY you are being yelled at by others and WHY you are getting trained in these certain aspects. Everything has PURPOSE and there is a TIME and PLACE for everything. When we were doing drill, it was time to get serious and expect to get our footlockers dumped* in the showers if we didn't (*DISCLAIMER: Not an excuse to do this at your Encampment or unit; find other ways to prove your point). If we were sitting down in a school circle drinking gatorade that he let us have, than it was okay to let loose just a tad bit.

When we were in this school circle, we talked about core values, practical skills in the fleet (ie how to choose a faithful spouse), what he did in the fleet, how DI's work and why, and life in general. Most cadets don't have this kind of experience, but even a lot of the other DI's don't have the experience my Senior had. However, as a wise man once told me "you may not know everything, but what you DO know makes you valuable". Also, I was a squad leader, so he put some extra attention on me in making sure I was leading my squad correctly. Granted, I wasn't even 18 yet but I had experience from CAP so I knew how to yell* (yeah I know some of you are going to squirm*) and you were made sort of a "mini DI" basically to save the DI's voice from yelling or even just talking.

Did he yell at us? Let's just say he was the loudest and his veins and face turned into reddish purplish colors I have never seen.

Did he destroy us at times? Of course. It's boot camp duh.

Did he call us maggots? Of course not... but he definitely called us names that rhymes with the aforementioned words that were among his and realistically all other Marine's vocabulary. 

However, he was honest in what he told us. Everything he said was genuine and he made us into better people because of this. I've learned that honesty truly is the best policy. Do I think cadets and seniors should be using the same vocab? No. But I do think that when you don't sugarcoat it you are doing them a favor.

The other DI's were the same, despite their demeanor compared to the Senior. 3/4 DI's, including my Senior, have their Combat Action Ribbon which is very good considering how many DI's and other branches' Basic Training Instructors have actually been into combat. The mentorship, explanation of training, and the core values he instilled in us was what made us into Marines.

That's about it of what I have to say. I just thought you would like to hear my brain throw up of words. Also, to keep this in mind, boot camp is by far the EASIEST thing you will do in the military. If you think otherwise your job is too easy or you have been out for too long. After boot you're a grown up and you better be able to do your job or stand by Gunny or 1st Sgt's office for a world of hurt. God help you if you screw up in the field like losing your rifle.... ha get ready for all night games. But that's the fleet.......

I hope this helps bring more mentorship into mind when training cadets in Encampment.
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SilentPhantom
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« Reply #125 on: May 10, 2014, 08:53:11 PM »

I don't really remember much of my in-processing, even though it was only a year ago. But I do remember that the intensity level was only like 3 or 4, until the parents left anyway. Then it was like a 8 or 9. I got called out a lofty number of times during the week; but it was my own fault.
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Fubar
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« Reply #126 on: May 11, 2014, 12:28:51 AM »

I don't really remember much of my in-processing, even though it was only a year ago. But I do remember that the intensity level was only like 3 or 4, until the parents left anyway. Then it was like a 8 or 9. I got called out a lofty number of times during the week; but it was my own fault.

If waiting to change the intesity level was deliberately done after all of the parents were out of ear shot, then I worry someone was afraid of what the parents would think about how the encampment was being run. Nothing should be done to a cadet that you wouldn't do with that cadet's parent in the room.
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Майор Хаткевич
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« Reply #127 on: May 11, 2014, 01:47:10 AM »

I don't really remember much of my in-processing, even though it was only a year ago. But I do remember that the intensity level was only like 3 or 4, until the parents left anyway. Then it was like a 8 or 9. I got called out a lofty number of times during the week; but it was my own fault.

If waiting to change the intesity level was deliberately done after all of the parents were out of ear shot, then I worry someone was afraid of what the parents would think about how the encampment was being run. Nothing should be done to a cadet that you wouldn't do with that cadet's parent in the room.

While I agree with the sentiment, the new encampment curriculum actually had tasks that are to be done without parents.
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SilentPhantom
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« Reply #128 on: May 11, 2014, 11:13:41 AM »

I don't really remember much of my in-processing, even though it was only a year ago. But I do remember that the intensity level was only like 3 or 4, until the parents left anyway. Then it was like a 8 or 9. I got called out a lofty number of times during the week; but it was my own fault.

If waiting to change the intesity level was deliberately done after all of the parents were out of ear shot, then I worry someone was afraid of what the parents would think about how the encampment was being run. Nothing should be done to a cadet that you wouldn't do with that cadet's parent in the room.

What I mean is the intensity level didn't really go up until the parents had left. The basics weren't indoctrinated into their flights until after all the parents were gone.
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Fubar
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« Reply #129 on: May 11, 2014, 03:31:47 PM »

What I mean is the intensity level didn't really go up until the parents had left. The basics weren't indoctrinated into their flights until after all the parents were gone.

So my question remains, what was the purpose of waiting to increase the "intensity level" until after all the parents were gone?

I'd also like to know how cadets are "indoctrinated" into a flight. I've seen cadets assigned to a flight before, but indoctrination didn't seem to be required.
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Garibaldi
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« Reply #130 on: May 11, 2014, 04:03:43 PM »

What I mean is the intensity level didn't really go up until the parents had left. The basics weren't indoctrinated into their flights until after all the parents were gone.

So my question remains, what was the purpose of waiting to increase the "intensity level" until after all the parents were gone?

I'd also like to know how cadets are "indoctrinated" into a flight. I've seen cadets assigned to a flight before, but indoctrination didn't seem to be required.

Why am I suddenly reminded of Will Mclean's plebe year in the novel The Lords of Discipline? The cadre was all nice until the last parent left, then turned the dial into instant insanity.
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SilentPhantom
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« Reply #131 on: May 11, 2014, 04:07:07 PM »

What I mean is the intensity level didn't really go up until the parents had left. The basics weren't indoctrinated into their flights until after all the parents were gone.

So my question remains, what was the purpose of waiting to increase the "intensity level" until after all the parents were gone?

I'd also like to know how cadets are "indoctrinated" into a flight. I've seen cadets assigned to a flight before, but indoctrination didn't seem to be required.

Ok, we were marched onto the parade feild, sat down, our flight staff introduced themselves and took out watches. That's what I mean when I say 'indoctrinated'. That part was only like a 3 or 4 intensity level.
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SilentPhantom
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« Reply #132 on: June 06, 2014, 12:57:32 PM »

Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....
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C/2dLt
THRAWN
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« Reply #133 on: June 06, 2014, 01:07:37 PM »

Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....

For all that is good and holy, please don't...
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Strup
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Eclipse
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« Reply #134 on: June 06, 2014, 01:12:45 PM »

Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....

Credibility can only be lost once.
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The contents of this post are Copyright 2017 by eclipse. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

SilentPhantom
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« Reply #135 on: June 06, 2014, 01:51:10 PM »

Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....

Credibility can only be lost once.
Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....

For all that is good and holy, please don't...

haha i'm only joking! ;D  things like that are things I've only heard said during flight time and bearing busters  :o some staff just can't take their jobs seriously...
« Last Edit: June 06, 2014, 01:55:06 PM by SilentPhantom » Logged
C/2dLt
Mitchell 1969
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« Reply #136 on: June 06, 2014, 06:01:40 PM »

Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....

Credibility can only be lost once.
Staff training for my wing's encampment stars in a few days and when the basics arrive next week, I'm gonna be like, "Welcome to encampment, and may the odds be ever in your favor." I wonder if I'll be able to do it with a straight face....

For all that is good and holy, please don't...

haha i'm only joking! ;D  things like that are things I've only heard said during flight time and bearing busters  :o some staff just can't take their jobs seriously...

And......there's that silly "bearing busters" thing again. My three wishes to the genie evidently didn't work.
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Mitchell 1969; Earhart 1971; Eaker 1973. Cadet Flying Encampment, License, 1970. IACE New Zealand 1971; IACE Korea 1973.

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PA Guy
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« Reply #137 on: June 06, 2014, 06:30:44 PM »

 


Ha Ha. A staff member that can't take their job seriously should be fired and sent home. It demonstrates a lack of leadership and professionalism.
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Eclipse
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« Reply #138 on: June 06, 2014, 06:31:43 PM »

If members, across the board, seniors and cadets alike, spent as much time and effort working the program,
as they do making up silly hardkewl names for activities, "busting bearing", yelling jodies that are inappropriate and
not even close to in time, and otherwise making fools of themselves and ruining their credibility, both internally and
externally, we'd all be that much closer to CAP actually being what it purports to be.

Members do not need to "blow off steam" - they come to CAP to specifically experience the discipline and structure
they never get in their real lives.  Goofing off robs them of that structure and sets a terrible example, not to mention
it implies that CAP members ever come close to the stress or expectation(s) that those in the military do.
They don't, they >want< to be there, and assuming the activity is being run properly, they are literally craving the
structure and intensity.

Further to that, you are going home at the end of the week / weekend - by the time you are "stressed", you're home.

I have seen and worked with many top-tier cadets and seniors, but I have yet to meet any who are so experienced, proficient,
and skilled, in >ANYTHING< that they can justify wasted CAP-time goofing off.

Now...get your bikes off my lawn and I'm keeping the baseballs that flew over my fence.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2014, 06:56:16 PM by Eclipse » Logged

"The man who does more than he is paid for will soon be paid for more than he does." - Napoleon Hill.
The contents of this post are Copyright 2017 by eclipse. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

PA Guy
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« Reply #139 on: June 06, 2014, 06:51:28 PM »

If members, across the board, seniors and cadets alike, spent as much time and effort working the program,
as they do making up silly hardkewl names for activities, "busting bearing", yelling jodies that are inappropriate and
not even close to in time, and otherwise making fools of themselves and ruining their credibility, both internally and
externally, we'd all be that much closer to CAP actually being what it purports to be.

Members do not need to "blow off steam" - they come to CAP to specifically experience the discipline and structre
they never get in their real lives.  Further to that, you are going home at the end of the week / weekend - by the time
you are "stressed", you're home.

I have seen and worked with many top-tier cadets and seniors, but I have yet to meet any who are so experienced, proficient,
and skilled, in >ANYTHING< that they can justify wasted CAP-time goofing off.

As most of you are aware Eclipse and I seldom agree on anything but in this post he is spot on. 
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CAP Talk  |  Operations  |  Tall Tales  |  Topic: Memories - IN PROCESSING - the very beginning of enc
 


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