It's finally here!

[NIN]

I was unfamiliar with the play until I saw the movie. I liked it. I might suggest using the subtitles it does help to follow the dialog.

I'll give that a try.

[Panache]

Last time I checked a uniform had it's purpose and flashy wasn't one of them.  Not every uniform needs a hat and if the membership has an issue with the uniform there is the process to recommend changes.  So far the only folks I have heard orseen have an issue with the G/W are those who choose to not abide by H/W and grooming and self defeat themselves when it comes to it.  And IMO the only reason I have heard for change is just to change.

So... the only folks you've heard or seen who have an issue with the G/Ws are those who actually wear the G/Ws?



Thank you for playing.  Please come again.

Go back and read the entire post and don't try to twist it.

I'm not trying to "twist" anything.  I quoted your exact and complete post back to you.

But that's okay, really.  Even though your reply was dripping with elitism, it demonstrates the point we've been trying to make well.  "Hey fatties and furries, it's your own fault you have to wear the G/Ws, so shut up and be glad you even have something.  Remember your place and don't think you can have nice things like the rest of us."

As mentioned by Eclipse and others, I think the big problem is that the height/weight standards aren't equally enforced across the upper echelons of the organization, so they pretty much don't have to bother with the G/Ws.  Out of sight, out of mind, right?  So despite widespread grumbling about the G/Ws, NHQ made no efforts to actually address the concerns of the people who wear it.

Question:  While I agree that changing the background color on the tapes and grade to "dark blue" is an improvement with the BBDUs, do you really think it would have happened if ABUs weren't in the future and the Powers That Be™ thought that ultramarine blue with the ABUs were ugly?

There is nothing wrong with the G/W.

Many people disagree with your opinion.  And if there's nothing wrong with it, I assume you're okay with CAP ditching the AF-blues and making everybody wear it?  If not, why?

I agree with Eclipse that in order to avoid treating some of our members as a separate class, any corporate uniform need to be complete and on par with the Air Force-style uniform, regardless of color chosen.

^ This.  If they want it to be white-and-gray, hey, that's cool.  My biggest issue is that it's a half-measure.  Separate-but-equal is fine if it actually was equal.

I like my BBDUs. I get to wear the boots that I like and I don't get dirty looks when I miss a shave (or a week's worth, like at NESA  :angel: ).

I have to agree.  I prefer my BBDUs, and would wear them even if I had the option of regular BDUs.  I think they're far more sharp-looking and more in line with our mission.  And, quite frankly, I think the ABUs (especially with all the CAP bling on it) are flat-out ugly.

[Panache]

Here's an idea if it "has" to be grey. Has anyone has seen the movie Corionalus, based on the play by Shakespeare?

They set Rome in modern time and here are some pictures of the "modern" Roman Service uniform:

I can see the next version of the 39-1:  "Those assigned to NHQ will be authorized to wear uniform cloaks in Praetorian purple."

I will say though:  the design of those wings he's wearing are sweet.

[abdsp51]

Panache if you read the that post you will see that I said choose to.  Do I need to go back and highlight it for you?

[Shuman 14]

Here's an idea if it "has" to be grey. Has anyone has seen the movie Corionalus, based on the play by Shakespeare?

Although I know you were being somewhat sarcastic, but an Air Force style officer coat in grey would look nice for a corporate service dress.  Set it up the same way as well.  As far as the hat, I do not know what to use.

Actually I wasn't being sarcastic at all. I thought the uniform looked very sharp in the movie.

Then I noticed the tie was blue and the shirt white and I naturally thought "CAP" G/W uniform. (Now that was sarcastic.  )

Seriously this could be the answer if the trousers/pants are all "uniform" and match the tunic/coat. Which means all the off-the-shelf greys slacks will have to go.

As to the hat, was never a fan of a beret, even in the movie, so how about a matching grey flight cap and/or combination cap?

[Panache]

Issue Three: Again not every uniform requires a hat, and simply because the G/W is an equivalent does mean it needs a hat.

Exactly!

[Panache]

Panache if you read the that post you will see that I said choose to.  Do I need to go back and highlight it for you?

So, I can now wear the AF-blues even though I don't make height-weight?

[Shuman 14]

Many people disagree with your opinion.  And if there's nothing wrong with it, I assume you're okay with CAP ditching the AF-blues and making everybody wear it?  If not, why?

Insert knife and twist!  :clap:

[abdsp51]

Panache if you read the that post you will see that I said choose to.  Do I need to go back and highlight it for you?

So, I can now wear the AF-blues even though I don't make height-weight?

No that is not what I said.  But nice way to try and twist as usual.  Just like you doubt AF members earn Army badges and decs.

[Panache]

Actually I wasn't being sarcastic at all. I thought the uniform looked very sharp in the movie.

Yeah, but he was wearing what was essentially a custom-made-and-tailored uniform prop.  Unless we have an accessible commercial source we could purchase these from, the point is moot.

[Shuman 14]

Here's an idea if it "has" to be grey. Has anyone has seen the movie Corionalus, based on the play by Shakespeare?

They set Rome in modern time and here are some pictures of the "modern" Roman Service uniform:

I can see the next version of the 39-1:  "Those assigned to NHQ will be authorized to wear uniform cloaks in Praetorian purple."

I will say though:  the design of those wings he's wearing are sweet.

Then liner will be in purple with the outer shell in matching grey. 

I actually have the Army's Officer Cape... it is pretty cool to wear to formal events.


And I agree, Roman Jump Wings are pretty sweet.

[Panache]

No that is not what I said.  But nice way to try and twist as usual.  Just like you doubt AF members earn Army badges and decs.

Wait.  What?

Where did I say I doubt AF members earn Army badges and devices?  Can you please quote me on that, because I never said any such thing.

Oh, and you never did answer the two questions I posited to you.  I'll repeat them for your convenience.

• While I agree that changing the background color on the tapes and grade to "dark blue" is an improvement with the BBDUs, do you really think it would have happened if ABUs weren't in the future and the Powers That Be™ thought that ultramarine blue with the ABUs were ugly?
• If there's nothing wrong with the Aviator Kit, I assume you're okay with CAP ditching the AF-blues and making everybody wear it?  If not, why?

[Shuman 14]

Actually I wasn't being sarcastic at all. I thought the uniform looked very sharp in the movie.

Yeah, but he was wearing what was essentially a custom-made-and-tailored uniform prop.  Unless we have an accessible commercial source we could purchase these from, the point is moot.

If there is a market and a profit to be made... CAP could easily find a manufacturer. If Roman Service Dress was adopted as the Class A uniform for CAP G/W, I bet you Scamguard will have in their next webpage update. 

[Panache]

If there is a market and a profit to be made... CAP could easily find a manufacturer. If Roman Service Dress was adopted as the Class A uniform for CAP G/W, I bet you Scamguard will have in their next webpage update. 

Only if they come with togas.

Then we can officially call the next Group holiday gathering a toga party.

[abdsp51]

2. With the complete adoption of USAF uniform regulations into the draft, there are going to be a few "butt hurt" veterans who have for years worn certain badges (ie the EIB, CIB, EMB, CMB, etc.) completely within CAP regulations and now have to take them off. Another slap in the face.

Being prior-service Army and having earned a CMB (first Gulf War), I feel I can comment on this.

I'm fine with that.

Basically, if we're going to wear the AF uniform, then we should abide by the AF regulations for wear of that uniform.  If the AF doesn't allow their own, active-duty airmen and officers to wear these devices (if they somehow earned them), then we should't wear them either.

Now, should I think we should be authorized?  Sure, but that's a gripe at Ma Blue, and not the CAP leadership.

Here you go. 

1.  Do I think it would happen can't say who knows what HHQ thinks half the time with anything.

2. If NHQ decided to scrap the AF style completely and go to the G/W and BBDU for all that's what I would wear.  But they haven't and I do not believe they will.  And I wouldn't gripe about not having a hat or service dress coat to go with it.  But from everything I have seen those who complain the most about the G/W are those who consciously choose to not abide by H/W and grooming, I say again CHOOSE TO. 

[Panache]

"Major Blutarsky would like to speak about the Character Development program...."

[abdsp51]

Poor attempt at deflection.

[Panache]

2. With the complete adoption of USAF uniform regulations into the draft, there are going to be a few "butt hurt" veterans who have for years worn certain badges (ie the EIB, CIB, EMB, CMB, etc.) completely within CAP regulations and now have to take them off. Another slap in the face.

Being prior-service Army and having earned a CMB (first Gulf War), I feel I can comment on this.

I'm fine with that.

Basically, if we're going to wear the AF uniform, then we should abide by the AF regulations for wear of that uniform.  If the AF doesn't allow their own, active-duty airmen and officers to wear these devices (if they somehow earned them), then we should't wear them either.

Now, should I think we should be authorized?  Sure, but that's a gripe at Ma Blue, and not the CAP leadership.

And like I pointed out before, you drastically misread what I said.  My "if they somehow earned them" was not meant as "Air Force can't earn them" but as, well, if they somehow earned them.  You know, like if they went to the appropriate Army school and.... earned them.  I meant exactly what I typed.

You, on the other hand, twistedinterpreted that into "AF can't earn Army badges".  I never said that.  I never implied that.

1.  Do I think it would happen can't say who knows what HHQ thinks half the time with anything.

Fair enough.  I will agree that they work in mysterious ways.

2. If NHQ decided to scrap the AF style completely and go to the G/W and BBDU for all that's what I would wear.  But they haven't and I do not believe they will.  And I wouldn't gripe about not having a hat or service dress coat to go with it.  But from everything I have seen those who complain the most about the G/W are those who consciously choose to not abide by H/W and grooming, I say again CHOOSE TO.

And I counter you wouldn't complain about not having a hat or service dress coat because you have an option of a kit that does.  So it's simply not important to you.

Immediately out of Basic Training and AIT, when I was in the prime of my physical condition, I had to get tape-tested because I failed height/weight.  I'm a big guy with a stocky broad-shouldered build.  I wear size 13-wide boots for cripe's sake.  While I won't lie and say that the years and too much time of riding a desk hasn't taken their toll, getting into the height-weight standards simply are not an option for me.  In my case, the cliche is actually the truth:  I am big-boned.

I'm perfectly okay that the Air Force doesn't want a lumbering goober like me walking around in their uniform.  All I'm asking for is something equally dignified.

Poor attempt at deflection.

I wasn't talking to you.

[Panache]

Heck, they don't even make AF-blue uniforms in my size....

[abdsp51]

Being prior-service Army and having earned a CMB (first Gulf War), I feel I can comment on this.

I'm fine with that.

Basically, if we're going to wear the AF uniform, then we should abide by the AF regulations for wear of that uniform.  If the AF doesn't allow their own, active-duty airmen and officers to wear these devices (if they somehow earned them), then we should't wear them either.

Now, should I think we should be authorized?  Sure, but that's a gripe at Ma Blue, and not the CAP leadership.

I perceived it as stated as you should know perception is and will be reality.  And even if i didn't have the option of the AF style I still wouldn't gripe about not having a hat.  Or feeling sub par or second class.  A wise woman once said "No one can make you feel inferior, if you do not allow it."

I have never treated anyone who only had the option of G/W as inferior or second class, period.  And I never will, unlike some I do not discriminate based on the uniform someone can or can not wear.