Preparing for Basic Encampment

[TheSkyHornet]

Since I was never a cadet, and our squadron is revamping the training program, I was wondering if I could dig into the minds of some of the cadets on here, as well as senior members, in regard to what you all think is imperative to know prior to cadets going to encampment.

I'm not being specific with every single area of knowledge, but feel free to dig deep if you'd like. This will really help us not only build up a basic cadet training program for essential knowledge in getting cadets through their first few promotions, but also getting a task list of things to cover before cadets attend their first encampment after a few months or even up to a year of being in the program before their first trip.

We've had new cadets go to encampment within 60 days of joining CAP and didn't really know what to expect, so what I would like to do is have an idea of what can really help those new cadets obtain a good amount of knowledge and skills before we send them off to a training camp. OHWG encampment is in June, so that gives us plenty of time to figure out how to get all of this together, but I could really use some more insight from a large group of people rather than asking a couple of folks who have done encampment once or twice what they think helps. The more ideas floating around, the better for me.

[lordmonar]

Nothing beyond what is required for Curry.

[Tim Day]

TheSkyHornet:

I commanded Virginia Wing's Encampment last year, and I'm happy to share what I saw. However, much will depend on how your wing runs encampment. We tried very hard to follow CAPP 52-24 in both spirit and letter. One great benefit of following the standard is that the CAPP 52-24 purpose and vision can be shared with all our prospective students (not basics), their leaders, and their parents.

As Lordmonar stated, Curry is required and that's it. There's a cautionary note about cadets under age 14, and our experience bears that out (we had most of our home-sickness issues in the 12-14 age group). 

Wings vary on the required set of uniforms and other items your cadets will need to bring. Some of these are required for safety or other practical reasons (e.g., we require an old set of running shoes for the leadership reaction course - running shoes for traction, old because they'll get muddy).

In no particular order:

• Please discourage parents from forcing cadets to attend encampment.
• Not every 12 year old is ready to spend a night (or a week of nights) away from home. Practicing, for example on a unit bivouac, is a good idea.
• It is not cheating if you read the CAPP 52-24 prior to attending, even if they are attending for the first time.

Perhaps even more importantly, stress to your cadets who will be cadre the CAP encampment vision:
"An immersion into the full opportunities and challenges of cadet life."

Let that replace all their pre-conceived notions about encampment as basic military training, Full Metal Jacket, etc. Encampment will be more rigorous and strict with regard to military customs and courtesies than normal cadet life but we don't need boot camp-level intensity, or anything close to it.

Hope that helps. I really appreciated those Deputy Commanders for Cadets and others who helped with cadre selection and training throughout the year prior to encampment. As CAP continues to shift the encampment culture we need as much help as we can get.

[winterg]

Make sure they understand that they will be interacting with cadets from all over the wing and that it will be a great oportunity to make friends in the program that will last long after encampment. 

Have the cadets bring a small notebook that is just for recording contact info for the friends they make and encourage them to maintain those friendships after encampment. If possible, maybe even get extra squadron patches to trade if possible.   

Use encampment as a means to get them in the habit of making lists for the items they need and tasks to accomplish. This will help to reinforce making a plan and following it through.

I remember my first encampment as a cadet airman. It was amazing and terrifying all at once at points! The knowledge sets like D&C and CoC are very important but so are getting them to think outside their squadron, I think. 

[TheSkyHornet]

Nothing beyond what is required for Curry.

Really? I've had cadets go as Airman grades who said they felt they could have been more prepared than the minimum requirements. I've had Tech Sergeant grades go as basics at encampment that still didn't really feel ready.

Tim's post seemed to have a lot of good points, especially about forcing cadets to attend that don't feel ready and not using their parents to talk them into it or forcefully send them. I also like the idea of having a bivouac before encampment as well, and that's definitely something I wouldn't have thought of on my own. But I can really see the plus in that, especially considering that many kids definitely never experienced time away from home, especially in that kind of environment.

I don't know what kind of senior member staff I'm going to get to help me with this before the next encampment, or even the one after that. We're short-handed as it is, and we're losing a senior member in 2016. As for the cadet staff, we're understaffed in that area as well. I'm hoping to get even some of the lower-ranking cadets to take on some small-scale responsibilities, just so they can get some experience in being assigned a task with someone to report to. It would help in the long-run with training new cadets because they'll have an edge in practical experience.

I'm surprised at how many higher-up cadet NCOs (Tech Sergeants, Master Sergeants) I've come across who have never made an encampment once yet while in pretty high positions of responsibility in squadrons.

[TheSkyHornet]

Make sure they understand that they will be interacting with cadets from all over the wing and that it will be a great oportunity to make friends in the program that will last long after encampment. 

Have the cadets bring a small notebook that is just for recording contact info for the friends they make and encourage them to maintain those friendships after encampment. If possible, maybe even get extra squadron patches to trade if possible.   

Use encampment as a means to get them in the habit of making lists for the items they need and tasks to accomplish. This will help to reinforce making a plan and following it through.

I remember my first encampment as a cadet airman. It was amazing and terrifying all at once at points! The knowledge sets like D&C and CoC are very important but so are getting them to think outside their squadron, I think.

While I agree with this completely, this always seems to be one of the hardest areas to instill, especially with the issues in the communications department that I've recently described. Any suggestions as to teaching cadets to make a plan and reinforce it, outside of just the guidance in CAP manuals and books?

I think the patch trading idea is kinda neat. It's an area of expense, though, but not undoable. I'll look into that more.

By the way, I'm writing all of this down. I've already asked our cadets to list, if they choose, their own suggestions that I'll formulate into my list and see what's doable/practical.

[Brit_in_CAP]

In no particular order:

• Please discourage parents from forcing cadets to attend encampment.
• Not every 12 year old is ready to spend a night (or a week of nights) away from home. Practicing, for example on a unit bivouac, is a good idea.
• It is not cheating if you read the CAPP 52-24 prior to attending, even if they are attending for the first time.

Perhaps even more importantly, stress to your cadets who will be cadre the CAP encampment vision:
"An immersion into the full opportunities and challenges of cadet life."

Let that replace all their pre-conceived notions about encampment as basic military training, Full Metal Jacket, etc. Encampment will be more rigorous and strict with regard to military customs and courtesies than normal cadet life but we don't need boot camp-level intensity, or anything close to it.

Quoting in part, I can offer some experience of similar activities from my time with the UK Air Cadets, which bears out the first two points in Lt Col Day's list.  I can also support, from my time as a CDC, that stressing the immersion concept is a really good idea, as is making sure the scary war stories don't get told - encampment, either side of the pond, is a great experience and is something I'd recommend to any cadet **when they're ready**.

Sometimes, of course, the cadet is ready but the parent is not..   For that, you need a wholly different set of skills!

[CAPDCCMOM]

^^ Ah yes, another Cadet in need of a Momectomy

[TheSkyHornet]

^^ Ah yes, another Cadet in need of a Momectomy

Had a CAP mom/SM from another squadron tell me this week that she expects her son to man up and take responsibility for preparing for his activities, including encampments. She said she wishes a lot of other parents would cut the cord and throw their kids from the nest from time to time and let them walk on their own. It seems like a lot of parents need to be convinced or else their cadets, many of whom are really excited and nervous at the same time, don't get to partake in some of these experience.

So, it seems like we're covering a lot of checklist items for getting ready for encampment. Any more suggestions on how to mentally prepare cadets in regard to training? We get a lot of cadets in many squadrons that meet the minimum requirements for their Curry, as mentioned earlier on in this post, and they go off to encampment, but they still don't seem to have been prepared where they should be. And a lot of cadets come back and still can't perform very well within the squadron with the minimal stuff they should have known at the Curry level, often basic drill. We don't want to set up a boot camp-style program to prepare them for encampment, but at the same time, we don't want to baby them either and be too soft. One of the criticisms some of the higher-ranking cadets I've come across say they have with newer cadets who haven't yet experienced encampment is that they say it's a lot more volume and stress than they're used to at the squadron. I've been told that they often feel the cadets should at least experience a taste of what encampment would be like at a few meetings before going off to encampment when they're going to get yelled at the minute they get off the bus.

Granted, encampment isn't Parris Island. But it's also not happy, happy, joy, joy daycare. I just don't know how in-depth I would be comfortable making it to allow training cadets to get a little "rougher" with trainees (all within regs of course). It's not that I wouldn't be okay with doing it, but there's a very broad line that starts to get crossed where people aren't happy in that environment and adults aren't happy seeing kids yelling at other kids. How much is too much? How much is not enough?

[MSG Mac]

Remind them that the encampment is only 7 or 8 days and that the encampment gets better and easier  every day.

[GroundHawg]

I don't know if they still do them or not but we used to have a Type "B" Encampment as a preparatory for the Type A. It was held over two successive weekends. It was good prep work! It allowed those who had attachment issues to get used to being gone, staff cadets could work out wrinkles, logistics found issues before the big game, those going to the ALS or NCO course got lots of prep work, etc.... They were held at Campbell, Knox, WHFRTC, and a couple times at colleges during the summer when the students were gone.

I "think" you earned an encampment ribbon if you went both weekends (6 days), but it didn't count toward your Mitchell. I'm not suggesting you run something as expansive as this, maybe start with a weekend and see if that helps at all.

[Jaison009]

I went to two of those Type Bs at Ft. Knox, KY WIWAC in the Ft. Campbell Composite Squadron in the late 90s. Attended one as an airman and then another one as an NCO. They were great especially as a younger NCO serving on encampment staff for the first time. We also did weekend leadership schools for airman, NCO, and officers in the fall and winter months.

[PHall]

Some of you guys are working off of old memories.
A through review of CAPP 52-24, 1 June 2014 would be a very good idea.

[GroundHawg]

Some of you guys are working off of old memories.
A through review of CAPP 52-24, 1 June 2014 would be a very good idea.

Type B is still around, and can be completed over multiple weekends in a 60 day period. After reading the requirements however, I think that it would need to be over three weekends minimum to squeeze in all that is now required.

Back to the original poster, CAPP 52-24 and CAPP 52-25 have lots of base info to start your unit training plan off of. 

[Spam]

PHalls point is valid though, go read the pubs carefully, including 52-16 as he says, and the new curriculum.

One thought here is that there isn't such a term as "Basic Encampment" in the program. There should be no cadets at the activity who have not completed their Curry award, hence no Cadet Basics by definition (the program should correctly refer to them as students or trainees, not "Basics").  Referring to them as "Basics" can feed the erroneous mindset that they are there for basic military training, which they aren't.

From that mindset, everything needful "should" be encompassed by the Curry. We know that isn't always the case, even with simple things like D&C, right (e.g. how many encampment pass in reviews have you seen, where 1 stripers stumble through a column movement because the LL1 Curry drill practical only covers up through flanks)?

My Wing doesn't use all the encampment tools, but one assessment tool I tried in vain to get used was the entry/exit survey, which would have helped me (when I was DCP) to diagnose which units weren't administering the PFT properly, or weren't requiring the Cadet Oath to be memorized for advancement (as is mandated). That quick survey is a nice short assessment tool (unfortunately they let our cadets write their own oddball quizzes). Go take a look...

V/R,
Spam

[SarDragon]

I don't know if they still do them or not but we used to have a Type "B" Encampment as a preparatory for the Type A. It was held over two successive weekends. It was good prep work! It allowed those who had attachment issues to get used to being gone, staff cadets could work out wrinkles, logistics found issues before the big game, those going to the ALS or NCO course got lots of prep work, etc.... They were held at Campbell, Knox, WHFRTC, and a couple times at colleges during the summer when the students were gone.

I "think" you earned an encampment ribbon if you went both weekends (6 days), but it didn't count toward your Mitchell. I'm not suggesting you run something as expansive as this, maybe start with a weekend and see if that helps at all.

The Type "B" I staffed counted for Mitchell, back in '73.

[Tim Day]

So, it seems like we're covering a lot of checklist items for getting ready for encampment. Any more suggestions on how to mentally prepare cadets in regard to training? We get a lot of cadets in many squadrons that meet the minimum requirements for their Curry, as mentioned earlier on in this post, and they go off to encampment, but they still don't seem to have been prepared where they should be.
...

Granted, encampment isn't Parris Island. But it's also not happy, happy, joy, joy daycare. I just don't know how in-depth I would be comfortable making it to allow training cadets to get a little "rougher" with trainees (all within regs of course). It's not that I wouldn't be okay with doing it, but there's a very broad line that starts to get crossed where people aren't happy in that environment and adults aren't happy seeing kids yelling at other kids. How much is too much? How much is not enough?

CAPP 52-23 has some very useful guidelines for setting the right intensity level - it specifically addresses yelling and used of raised voices. VAWG's encampment leaders train to this reference and I expect them to fully implement it. The more we all standardize to it, the better.

As far as a specific recommendation for your home squadron meeting, I wouldn't raise the intensity to encampment level unless you can provide the rest of the full experience of the cadet program at the same time.

[abdsp51]

If you want to prep them then I recommend the following:

1) Have their D&C upto Par (teach them the RIGHT WAY!!! per AFMAN 26-2203
2) Teach them about heat injuries
3) Teach them proper foot care (broken in boots, proper socks, applying mole skin)
4) Obtain the packing list and emphasize that it needs to be followed.  (Attention to detail)

These are the key things for encampment.  You don't need to ramp up anything or increase the intensity at home units for it. 

[kwe1009]

If you want to prep them then I recommend the following:

1) Have their D&C up to Par (teach them the RIGHT WAY!!! per AFMAN 26-2203
2) Teach them about heat injuries
3) Teach them proper foot care (broken in boots, proper socks, applying mole skin)
4) Obtain the packing list and emphasize that it needs to be followed.  (Attention to detail)

These are the key things for encampment.  You don't need to ramp up anything or increase the intensity at home units for it.

Exactly.  Outside of being homesick, the biggest problems I have seen at encampments are each of these items.

I've added to your list a little.

• Cadets don't know how to march (36-2203 and Youtube can really be your friend here.  There are tons of great USAF-based drill videos)
• Heat injuries should be a focus of your monthly safety briefing, especially just before your encampment
• Proper foot care - another emphasis for your safety briefing
• Packing List - this is a big one from what I have seen.  Cadets either bring too much stuff or not enough.  I have seen cadets show up with just a small backpack and other with large backpacks AND a trunk.

In my squadron we start prepping the new cadets a few weeks before encampment.  This generally consists of going over items 3-4 on the above list.  We also require the cadets to bring in their gear on the meeting one week prior to leaving for encampment for us to check.  That gives them time to get missing items and remove items they don't need.

Some of the more senior cadets also set expectations for the cadets so they know what is going to happen on day 1 - day 7.  We go by 36-2203 always so that isn't an issue for us.  This has worked very well for us as we have had no homesickness issues in the 3 years we have been doing this and have had very minor issues with blisters and heat.

[PHall]

The most effective thing you can do to make sure your cadets succeed at Encampment?
Don't send them until they can handle it!
Just because they meet the minimum standards to attend doesn't mean that they're mature enough to handle it.
Do the cadet a favor and don't send them until they're mature enough to handle it.  They'll be much happier for it.

[TheSkyHornet]

PHalls point is valid though, go read the pubs carefully, including 52-16 as he says, and the new curriculum.

One thought here is that there isn't such a term as "Basic Encampment" in the program. There should be no cadets at the activity who have not completed their Curry award, hence no Cadet Basics by definition (the program should correctly refer to them as students or trainees, not "Basics").  Referring to them as "Basics" can feed the erroneous mindset that they are there for basic military training, which they aren't.

From that mindset, everything needful "should" be encompassed by the Curry. We know that isn't always the case, even with simple things like D&C, right (e.g. how many encampment pass in reviews have you seen, where 1 stripers stumble through a column movement because the LL1 Curry drill practical only covers up through flanks)?

My Wing doesn't use all the encampment tools, but one assessment tool I tried in vain to get used was the entry/exit survey, which would have helped me (when I was DCP) to diagnose which units weren't administering the PFT properly, or weren't requiring the Cadet Oath to be memorized for advancement (as is mandated). That quick survey is a nice short assessment tool (unfortunately they let our cadets write their own oddball quizzes). Go take a look...

V/R,
Spam

In our wing, "Basic" is the term used for first-time cadets at encampment. The wing officially refers to first-time, non-staff cadets as "basic cadets." All cadets MUST have achieved Curry before attending.

It seems as if it's becoming more the norm in our locale to refer to basic encampment as a mini boot camp, and that's what the CDCs and Character Development Officers are getting at when they prep cadets for their first encampment experience. Everyone knows that it's a kids program, but it does get regarded quite often as a miniature military-esque indoctrination course.

It seems some of our cadet NCOs at the Tech Sergeant and Master Sergeant grades feel that first-timers should know beyond the minimum expected of Curry, feeling that knowing Curry standards alone isn't enough to do "well," just enough to get by and figure it out by the end of encampment week.

Some of you guys are working off of old memories.
A through review of CAPP 52-24, 1 June 2014 would be a very good idea.

Type B is still around, and can be completed over multiple weekends in a 60 day period. After reading the requirements however, I think that it would need to be over three weekends minimum to squeeze in all that is now required.

Back to the original poster, CAPP 52-24 and CAPP 52-25 have lots of base info to start your unit training plan off of. 

Precisely the point of this topic. We are structuring the training program to prepare cadets for encampment, from step 1 to step 10 (or however many steps it takes), over the defined period. It seems that meeting the minimums to excel at basic encampment is the commonality between squadron training plans for new cadets when done in groups, rather than as individuals.

We're currently taking in walk-ins, and while we can try to get them each up to speed for encampment, it's hard to track where each is at as they progress because none of them are on the same timeline for building up their knowledge and experience.

So, it seems like we're covering a lot of checklist items for getting ready for encampment. Any more suggestions on how to mentally prepare cadets in regard to training? We get a lot of cadets in many squadrons that meet the minimum requirements for their Curry, as mentioned earlier on in this post, and they go off to encampment, but they still don't seem to have been prepared where they should be.
...

Granted, encampment isn't Parris Island. But it's also not happy, happy, joy, joy daycare. I just don't know how in-depth I would be comfortable making it to allow training cadets to get a little "rougher" with trainees (all within regs of course). It's not that I wouldn't be okay with doing it, but there's a very broad line that starts to get crossed where people aren't happy in that environment and adults aren't happy seeing kids yelling at other kids. How much is too much? How much is not enough?

CAPP 52-23 has some very useful guidelines for setting the right intensity level - it specifically addresses yelling and used of raised voices. VAWG's encampment leaders train to this reference and I expect them to fully implement it. The more we all standardize to it, the better.

As far as a specific recommendation for your home squadron meeting, I wouldn't raise the intensity to encampment level unless you can provide the rest of the full experience of the cadet program at the same time.

I think this question comes from seeing other squadrons conduct themselves at different styles. Some seem more disciplined and intense than others. Some CDCs have commented to me that they want to step up the intensity slightly so to establish that quick level of thinking from the cadets and snap-to customs and courtesies.

I find that the squadrons where the majority of the senior members are prior military seem to prefer a little bit of intensity, without going overboard, knowing that these are kids. But there's a lot of kickback from the non-military crowd that kids need to be treated like kids. When you have ages ranging from 12 and up, it's very easy to treat a 12 year old differently than a 17 year old, but when they're all in a group, you have to tone it down to the level of the youngest one present. Just an observation, and something that's come up in discussion with other squadron CCs and CP specialists.

It's a huge grey area to know when it's too much versus room to get some more in there. Like our Safety Officer/Chaplain said at our meeting yesterday: The point is to provide a military environment where every senior member and cadet knows that nobody's safety is ever in jeopardy, and to have a culture where if anyone feels safety is being compromised, even verbally, we can address it and identify the level of severity of the action. That being said, he has his own teenager in the cadet program who he admits needs a good kick in the pants at times to get him to lock up the shenanigans.

If you want to prep them then I recommend the following:

1) Have their D&C upto Par (teach them the RIGHT WAY!!! per AFMAN 26-2203
2) Teach them about heat injuries
3) Teach them proper foot care (broken in boots, proper socks, applying mole skin)
4) Obtain the packing list and emphasize that it needs to be followed.  (Attention to detail)

These are the key things for encampment.  You don't need to ramp up anything or increase the intensity at home units for it. 

I totally agree with the safety aspects of this. I think those are areas that can be applied back at the home unit, not just encampment, and should be reminded on regularly.

If you want to prep them then I recommend the following:

1) Have their D&C up to Par (teach them the RIGHT WAY!!! per AFMAN 26-2203
2) Teach them about heat injuries
3) Teach them proper foot care (broken in boots, proper socks, applying mole skin)
4) Obtain the packing list and emphasize that it needs to be followed.  (Attention to detail)

These are the key things for encampment.  You don't need to ramp up anything or increase the intensity at home units for it.

Exactly.  Outside of being homesick, the biggest problems I have seen at encampments are each of these items.

I've added to your list a little.

• Cadets don't know how to march (36-2203 and Youtube can really be your friend here.  There are tons of great USAF-based drill videos)
• Heat injuries should be a focus of your monthly safety briefing, especially just before your encampment
• Proper foot care - another emphasis for your safety briefing
• Packing List - this is a big one from what I have seen.  Cadets either bring too much stuff or not enough.  I have seen cadets show up with just a small backpack and other with large backpacks AND a trunk.

In my squadron we start prepping the new cadets a few weeks before encampment.  This generally consists of going over items 3-4 on the above list.  We also require the cadets to bring in their gear on the meeting one week prior to leaving for encampment for us to check.  That gives them time to get missing items and remove items they don't need.

Some of the more senior cadets also set expectations for the cadets so they know what is going to happen on day 1 - day 7.  We go by 36-2203 always so that isn't an issue for us.  This has worked very well for us as we have had no homesickness issues in the 3 years we have been doing this and have had very minor issues with blisters and heat.

Using YouTube seems to be a problem at times because it goes back to being taught outside of training country and it may not be correct. Too many people look stuff up on the internet and take it as being proper format. I think this needs to be carefully considered when it comes to telling anyone "Go look up videos" because what happens when they come back and they're doing something we've never seen before?

Granted, this topic is more specific to what can be done at the meetings, no so much homework. We can always figure out what to suggest gets studied outside of the meeting, but this is for a structured hands-on training program. Appreciate the input anyway.

The most effective thing you can do to make sure your cadets succeed at Encampment?
Don't send them until they can handle it!
Just because they meet the minimum standards to attend doesn't mean that they're mature enough to handle it.
Do the cadet a favor and don't send them until they're mature enough to handle it.  They'll be much happier for it.

I fully agree. I think, in the past, we've had cadets go off to encampment who really weren't prepared, and a couple of cadets who bailed out of going to encampment out of fear/discomfort. It seems a lot of the previous suggestions here, especially the bivouac idea, gear to helping those cadets who aren't so comfortable in that environment away from home get accustomed to it. Encampment should be encouraged, but not forced, and should definitely not be something that a cadet who gets their Curry on June 1 attends a June 5 encampment.




Loving the feedback so far. Taking a lot of notes here, and I'm getting some good input from the squadron. We're going to have a lot of work ahead of us to put all of this together.

[PHall]

In our wing, "Basic" is the term used for first-time cadets at encampment. The wing officially refers to first-time, non-staff cadets as "basic cadets." All cadets MUST have achieved Curry before attending.

Better get used to calling them Students, because that what the new Encampment Manual says they will called.
And you don't have Cadet Staff either, they're the Cadre now.

[Fubar]

In our wing, "Basic" is the term used for first-time cadets at encampment. The wing officially refers to first-time, non-staff cadets as "basic cadets." All cadets MUST have achieved Curry before attending.

Better get used to calling them Students, because that what the new Encampment Manual says they will called.
And you don't have Cadet Staff either, they're the Cadre now.

Well based on this:

It seems as if it's becoming more the norm in our locale to refer to basic encampment as a mini boot camp, and that's what the CDCs and Character Development Officers are getting at when they prep cadets for their first encampment experience.

Just reading the encampment manual in general might be a good idea.

[TheSkyHornet]

In our wing, "Basic" is the term used for first-time cadets at encampment. The wing officially refers to first-time, non-staff cadets as "basic cadets." All cadets MUST have achieved Curry before attending.

Better get used to calling them Students, because that what the new Encampment Manual says they will called.
And you don't have Cadet Staff either, they're the Cadre now.

I'm not calling them anything Wing doesn't recognize, even if it differs from the national standard. Wing hasn't put out the 2016 packet yet, but the 2015 packet specifically refers to first-timers as "Basic Cadets," coming straight from the Commander. The same goes for "Cadet Staff." Many wings are using these terms still, even though they go against what's written in CAPP 52-24/25. That's a semantic issue anyway. I'll let NHQ handle the terminology end of it. That's off topic.

I find the cadet encampment handbook seems to work better for my purpose here than the encampment manual, which is more focused on how to structure and run encampment. This is about setting up a cadet training program for new members, to get them ready to be sent off to encampment, not to get them to conduct an encampment or live away from home for a week.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I'm not calling them anything Wing doesn't recognize, even if it differs from the national standard. Wing hasn't put out the 2016 packet yet, but the 2015 packet specifically refers to first-timers as "Basic Cadets," coming straight from the Commander. The same goes for "Cadet Staff." Many wings are using these terms still, even though they go against what's written in CAPP 52-24/25. That's a semantic issue anyway. I'll let NHQ handle the terminology end of it. That's off topic.

This will be year 3 of the new program, and people are STILL having this issue? I know this is off topic, but saying "not my problem" is actually...a problem. Have you tried inquiring why they haven't "got with the times" yet?

[arajca]

I'm not calling them anything Wing doesn't recognize, even if it differs from the national standard. Wing hasn't put out the 2016 packet yet, but the 2015 packet specifically refers to first-timers as "Basic Cadets," coming straight from the Commander. The same goes for "Cadet Staff." Many wings are using these terms still, even though they go against what's written in CAPP 52-24/25. That's a semantic issue anyway. I'll let NHQ handle the terminology end of it. That's off topic.

This will be year 3 of the new program, and people are STILL having this issue? I know this is off topic, but saying "not my problem" is actually...a problem. Have you tried inquiring why they haven't "got with the times" yet?

Calling the student cadets "Students" is fine. Calling the cadet staff 'cadre' is a problem in COWG. This is due to a couple of CAWG transplants that created significant issues with "Cadre" attitude that negatively affected the units and promoted secret rituals and habits to be hidden from senior members and cadets who were not part of the "Cadre". The folks who established the "Cadre" encouraged that behavior.  It was bad enough that that the "Cadre" t-shirts are prohibited from being worn at Encampment. The past two wing commanders have prohibited using the term 'cadre' to refer to the cadet staff. We figure it'll take another two years before the effects have been mitigated.

[Майор Хаткевич]

I'm not calling them anything Wing doesn't recognize, even if it differs from the national standard. Wing hasn't put out the 2016 packet yet, but the 2015 packet specifically refers to first-timers as "Basic Cadets," coming straight from the Commander. The same goes for "Cadet Staff." Many wings are using these terms still, even though they go against what's written in CAPP 52-24/25. That's a semantic issue anyway. I'll let NHQ handle the terminology end of it. That's off topic.

This will be year 3 of the new program, and people are STILL having this issue? I know this is off topic, but saying "not my problem" is actually...a problem. Have you tried inquiring why they haven't "got with the times" yet?

Calling the student cadets "Students" is fine. Calling the cadet staff 'cadre' is a problem in COWG. This is due to a couple of CAWG transplants that created significant issues with "Cadre" attitude that negatively affected the units and promoted secret rituals and habits to be hidden from senior members and cadets who were not part of the "Cadre". The folks who established the "Cadre" encouraged that behavior.  It was bad enough that that the "Cadre" t-shirts are prohibited from being worn at Encampment. The past two wing commanders have prohibited using the term 'cadre' to refer to the cadet staff. We figure it'll take another two years before the effects have been mitigated.

I may not be understanding the issue, but besides some "dank meme" behaviour, there was nothing secret the cadet cadre could get away with at our encampment that I, or other SMs weren't aware of. This is why we have RST. Cadre is a word. It's not a special status. They are there to train and teach cadets, so any issues get hammer out early on, or they don't get to play.

[arajca]

I'm not calling them anything Wing doesn't recognize, even if it differs from the national standard. Wing hasn't put out the 2016 packet yet, but the 2015 packet specifically refers to first-timers as "Basic Cadets," coming straight from the Commander. The same goes for "Cadet Staff." Many wings are using these terms still, even though they go against what's written in CAPP 52-24/25. That's a semantic issue anyway. I'll let NHQ handle the terminology end of it. That's off topic.

This will be year 3 of the new program, and people are STILL having this issue? I know this is off topic, but saying "not my problem" is actually...a problem. Have you tried inquiring why they haven't "got with the times" yet?

Calling the student cadets "Students" is fine. Calling the cadet staff 'cadre' is a problem in COWG. This is due to a couple of CAWG transplants that created significant issues with "Cadre" attitude that negatively affected the units and promoted secret rituals and habits to be hidden from senior members and cadets who were not part of the "Cadre". The folks who established the "Cadre" encouraged that behavior.  It was bad enough that that the "Cadre" t-shirts are prohibited from being worn at Encampment. The past two wing commanders have prohibited using the term 'cadre' to refer to the cadet staff. We figure it'll take another two years before the effects have been mitigated.

I may not be understanding the issue, but besides some "dank meme" behaviour, there was nothing secret the cadet cadre could get away with at our encampment that I, or other SMs weren't aware of. This is why we have RST. Cadre is a word. It's not a special status. They are there to train and teach cadets, so any issues get hammer out early on, or they don't get to play.

And a beret is just a hat. While many may say the term just a word, words have meanings. The folks who created the problem were in place for several years. We still have attitude problems from their time. They preached that "The Cadre" were an elite training force only created at encampment and were to spread their vision throughout the wing. Many times, this entailed spreading the word away from seniors and other who would not appreciate or accept the word.

[Garibaldi]

It sounds like someone read The Lords of Discipline and took it way too seriously. I haven't been to an encampment since 2011, but things I hear and have heard in the past still bother me. Its not just the cadets; it's the SM staff that promulgate the culture of "it's always been this way, what's the harm?"

Changing the names of things doesn't get rid of the problem.Changing the attitudes does.

[THRAWN]

I'm not calling them anything Wing doesn't recognize, even if it differs from the national standard. Wing hasn't put out the 2016 packet yet, but the 2015 packet specifically refers to first-timers as "Basic Cadets," coming straight from the Commander. The same goes for "Cadet Staff." Many wings are using these terms still, even though they go against what's written in CAPP 52-24/25. That's a semantic issue anyway. I'll let NHQ handle the terminology end of it. That's off topic.

This will be year 3 of the new program, and people are STILL having this issue? I know this is off topic, but saying "not my problem" is actually...a problem. Have you tried inquiring why they haven't "got with the times" yet?

Calling the student cadets "Students" is fine. Calling the cadet staff 'cadre' is a problem in COWG. This is due to a couple of CAWG transplants that created significant issues with "Cadre" attitude that negatively affected the units and promoted secret rituals and habits to be hidden from senior members and cadets who were not part of the "Cadre". The folks who established the "Cadre" encouraged that behavior.  It was bad enough that that the "Cadre" t-shirts are prohibited from being worn at Encampment. The past two wing commanders have prohibited using the term 'cadre' to refer to the cadet staff. We figure it'll take another two years before the effects have been mitigated.

I may not be understanding the issue, but besides some "dank meme" behaviour, there was nothing secret the cadet cadre could get away with at our encampment that I, or other SMs weren't aware of. This is why we have RST. Cadre is a word. It's not a special status. They are there to train and teach cadets, so any issues get hammer out early on, or they don't get to play.

And a beret is just a hat. While many may say the term just a word, words have meanings. The folks who created the problem were in place for several years. We still have attitude problems from their time. They preached that "The Cadre" were an elite training force only created at encampment and were to spread their vision throughout the wing. Many times, this entailed spreading the word away from seniors and other who would not appreciate or accept the word.

You're correct. Words do have meaning. I'm thinking of one right now....

Try these words to those who can't follow the rules: "Pack your trash, you're fired!" If they can't or won't follow the rules, lose them.

[BFreemanMA]

In addition to what has already been said, our squadron holds a weekend-long bivouac. Not only does it allow us time to reinforce all the preparations we've been making during our meeting nights, but it also gives cadets a chance to be away from home in a familiar and controlled session. I've served as FTO at an encampment (admittedly not as experience as others who have posted) and homesickness and the inability to cope with it was a real problem.

[PHall]

arajca, FYI, Cadre is not a CAWG thing.  We used Basic Cadets or Basics and Cadet Staff. 
We now use Student and Cadre because that's what we're all required to use now.

[Майор Хаткевич]

arajca, FYI, Cadre is not a CAWG thing.  We used Basic Cadets or Basics and Cadet Staff. 
We now use Student and Cadre because that's what we're all required to use now.

+100.


The faster everyone just accepts that the rules are the rules, or NHQ actually cracks down on encampments...the better.

[Ned]

The faster everyone just accepts that the rules are the rules, or NHQ actually cracks down on encampments...the better.

Come on, now.  We do our best.  We specifically sent folks to several encampments this summer, including Massachusetts and California, just to see how things were going.  And overall, we think the new standards are being implemented fairly consistently.  And we will visit at least one of the winter encampments and probably 3-4 summer encampments next year.  Summer, of course, is our busy season and there are also NCSAs and the odd national convention to worry about.  Overall, we rely on our colleagues at the wing and region level to do the lion's share of monitoring encampments and sharing best practices.

And truth be told, I am more concerned about the sleep rules and curriculum compliance than I am about the nomenclature used for students and staff.  First things first, and all that.


Ned Lee
Col, CAP
National Cadet Program Manager

[Майор Хаткевич]

The faster everyone just accepts that the rules are the rules, or NHQ actually cracks down on encampments...the better.

Come on, now.  We do our best.  We specifically sent folks to several encampments this summer, including Massachusetts and California, just to see how things were going.  And overall, we think the new standards are being implemented fairly consistently.  And we will visit at least one of the winter encampments and probably 3-4 summer encampments next year.  Summer, of course, is our busy season and there are also NCSAs and the odd national convention to worry about.  Overall, we rely on our colleagues at the wing and region level to do the lion's share of monitoring encampments and sharing best practices.

And truth be told, I am more concerned about the sleep rules and curriculum compliance than I am about the nomenclature used for students and staff.  First things first, and all that.


Ned Lee
Col, CAP
National Cadet Program Manager

I get priorities are the priorities. But is that a reason to "let it slide" because something is more important? Really? I also share your sentiment on getting this addressed by wings and regions, but unfortunately the reality seems to not be uniform across the land.


We've had a number of reports of the old terminology and practices on CAPTalk, I've heard some from cadets who traveled to other wings, etc. These are the basic (No pun intended) elements of the program, so if there are problems with getting on track with those, THEN I'd worry about what else might not be followed as outlined in the Encampment Manual.

[PHall]

Yeah, killing off the "we've always done it this way" is going to be difficult.
And I don't see it changing until there are some consequences for not following the new standards.

[Spam]

The faster everyone just accepts that the rules are the rules, or NHQ actually cracks down on encampments...the better.

... Overall, we rely on our colleagues at the wing and region level to do the lion's share of monitoring encampments and sharing best practices.

And truth be told, I am more concerned about the sleep rules and curriculum compliance than I am about the nomenclature used for students and staff.  First things first, and all that.

That reliance on the "dog not barking" to use Sherlock Holmes' term, may be contributing to a false sense of security. In my Wing, the DCP isn't part of the review chain, and isn't in the loop on most encampment planning and execution (at least, my predecessor and I weren't, as DCPs).  Our Wing/CC and CV have pointed out their disagreement with the newly approved Encampment Guide lines of command, with the justification that an Encampment/CC is an appointed line position, and as such should not report through the DCP as a staff director. So, at least some DCPs are not in the loop on Encampments, by design, and I think I'll stop there on that topic.


Back to the OP's thrust: as I've now returned my focus to retaining excellence at my local heritage unit, we're including modules on Encampment Student prep for our Basic Cadet Training modules based around the Wingman curriculum, on Encampment Cadre prep in our C/NCO modules, and on Encampment Command prep in our C/Officer modules. My unit supplied about a third of our Wing's C/Officer and C/NCO cadre this year, including the Encampment C/CC (although, apparently none of them intend to apply to my Wings event again, based on our internal review this summer). I'm trying to capture their cadre "prep" lessons learned on a local level, before their experience evaporates.


I suppose then, my point would be that a broad spectrum encampment "prep" would include an institutionalized training program for students, for cadre, and for officer staff. Beyond the RST event, that is. For adult officers, we should document and cover actual encampment planning and execution, logistics, admin, communication and delegation vice organizational breakdown, how to network with DoD agencies and POCs to get things done (from military O rides to getting the AC turned on BEFORE graduation), on actually turning ORM into smart decision making to avoid incidents, on criteria for reportable safety incidents, and on conducting an open, honest, accurate public AAR and in pivoting off those results to improve for successive years. Selecting and equipping ADULT officers seems to be the biggest preparation task that's not being filled, I would suggest, although I don't want to distract from the OP's great original point.

V/R,
Spam

[Ned]

In my Wing, the DCP isn't part of the review chain, and isn't in the loop on most encampment planning and execution (at least, my predecessor and I weren't, as DCPs).  Our Wing/CC and CV have pointed out their disagreement with the newly approved Encampment Guide lines of command, with the justification that an Encampment/CC is an appointed line position, and as such should not report through the DCP as a staff director. So, at least some DCPs are not in the loop on Encampments, by design, and I think I'll stop there on that topic.

Interesting.  But that was one of the changes effective just this year.

4.3 Position Descriptions
Senior staff positions are described below. For cadet cadre position descriptions, see CAPP 52-15. Encampments may customize the descriptions to meet their needs; the outlines below and at CAPP 52-15 are starting points.

a. Encampment Commander. Appointed by the wing or region commander to direct the overall
encampment program, under the supervision of the director of cadet programs. This position's major functional
areas include:

I suppose Curt or I should start planning to visit your wing's encampment next year.

[PHall]

Like I said Ned, until it becomes "painful" to not follow the new regs. Compliance will be a problem.

[abdsp51]

I suppose Curt or I should start planning to visit your wing's encampment next year.

Sir,  should this not happen to make sure the National standard is beig adhered to? 

We get SAV'd and UEI'd in the AF every couple years and with MICT now being the norm why could we not do it here?

I agree with PHall for this to be effective it should be reviewed by NHQ to ensure compliance and action should be taken when Wgs don't comply. 

Ca Wg runs their leadership schools and the one I had thevpleasure of helping to plan, staff, and execute went well. 
Part of that was the sit down with the cadet staff and they were told flat out no yelling, raised voices etc.  The were told they were to address the cadets as "cadets or grade and last name". 

The staff was told also anyone caught uellong and trying to make it Encampment would be reassigned. 

The entire weekend was a success and effective partly due to those steps. 

It wouldn't hurt to do a SAV or even and ECI(envampment compliance inspection). 

[Spam]

Ned, I really would like to reserve further public comments on our Wing's execution at this point, having submitted formal write ups from my unit at my WG/CV's request. I don't want to sandbag my Wing here, as they hopefully address our issues.


How to put this? "Be the change that you want to see happen"?  I'm trying to move forward constructively back down at my legacy/home unit, hence the modest suggestions for unit level training as the original poster had requested.  Having directed several TLCs I might even suggest that if the successful TLC curriculum is entering a revision cycle, we might consider an expansion to devote to encampment staff officer training (from tactical officers up through support, to command). That might be worth starting an entire new thread here, or on the Proving Grounds: suggested additions/updates/mods to TLC...


V/R,
Spam

[JC004]

The faster everyone just accepts that the rules are the rules, or NHQ actually cracks down on encampments...the better.

Come on, now.  We do our best.  We specifically sent folks to several encampments this summer, including Massachusetts and California, just to see how things were going.  And overall, we think the new standards are being implemented fairly consistently.  And we will visit at least one of the winter encampments and probably 3-4 summer encampments next year.  Summer, of course, is our busy season and there are also NCSAs and the odd national convention to worry about.  Overall, we rely on our colleagues at the wing and region level to do the lion's share of monitoring encampments and sharing best practices.

And truth be told, I am more concerned about the sleep rules and curriculum compliance than I am about the nomenclature used for students and staff.  First things first, and all that.


Ned Lee
Col, CAP
National Cadet Program Manager

Out of curiosity, how many encampments ARE there on average, in a year?

[Ned]

Sir,  should this ["encampment inspections"]not happen to make sure the National standard is beig adhered to? 

Mostly because CAP relies on a chain of command to assist us with span of control issues like this.  But even more importantly, we have outstanding CP officers serving as wing and region DCPs and staffers who are much more familiar with individual wing encampment programs than us "ivory tower" types at NHQ could ever be.

When I was a wing DCP, it was my job to go to encampment every year (usually as an FTO) and observe the largest single CP activity my wing put on.  If I saw something that could be improved, I mentored and coached the CC, Commandant, or whoever.

As a region DCP, I actively travelled to my wings to monitor and improve CP activities, including encampments.  I had a modest travel budget to help me and my deputy get away from the flagpole and spread best practices throughout the region.

Finally, just as a practical matter the NHQ CP shop is very small.  We simply don't have the resources (staff time and travel budgets) to visit even 10% of the encampments every year. 

So, we rely on the chain of command, pretty much like every other CAP functional area.

[Ned]

Out of curiosity, how many encampments ARE there on average, in a year?

About 40 during the summer, and another 4 or 5 during the winter.  Some of those are in wings that have more than one encampment a year.

[JC004]

Out of curiosity, how many encampments ARE there on average, in a year?

About 40 during the summer, and another 4 or 5 during the winter.  Some of those are in wings that have more than one encampment a year.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Out of curiosity, how many encampments ARE there on average, in a year?

About 40 during the summer, and another 4 or 5 during the winter.  Some of those are in wings that have more than one encampment a year.

*cough* Spring *cough*


IIRC, that school unit in Indiana also has a version of "encampment" in the spring break week for their cadets only?

[lordmonar]

Why the cough cough?

Is this supposed to a secret or something?

Also why the "encampment" with the quotes?

Is it not an an encampment?

Does it not follow the regulations?

[Майор Хаткевич]

Why the cough cough?

Is this supposed to a secret or something?

Also why the "encampment" with the quotes?

Is it not an an encampment?

Does it not follow the regulations?

Cough because he didn't mention them.


As to the quotes, IIRC, it's kinda-sorta-like-an encampment, but was told it's run differently.

[SarDragon]

Out of curiosity, how many encampments ARE there on average, in a year?

About 40 during the summer, and another 4 or 5 during the winter.  Some of those are in wings that have more than one encampment a year.

*cough* Spring *cough*


IIRC, that school unit in Indiana also has a version of "encampment" in the spring break week for their cadets only?

Oh, no, call out the Waaaambulance. 

[TheSkyHornet]

In addition to what has already been said, our squadron holds a weekend-long bivouac. Not only does it allow us time to reinforce all the preparations we've been making during our meeting nights, but it also gives cadets a chance to be away from home in a familiar and controlled session. I've served as FTO at an encampment (admittedly not as experience as others who have posted) and homesickness and the inability to cope with it was a real problem.

This seems to be a crowd favorite from both online and in-person discussions. It appears that homesickness is one of the most common, if not the most common, issues at arise with first time encampment cadets. Our incoming CC is a big fan of bivouacs and outdoor activities. Our encampment is held during the summer, so we have plenty of opportunities to have "field training," as well as various outdoor team-building exercises. Definitely doable.

The faster everyone just accepts that the rules are the rules, or NHQ actually cracks down on encampments...the better.

... Overall, we rely on our colleagues at the wing and region level to do the lion's share of monitoring encampments and sharing best practices.

And truth be told, I am more concerned about the sleep rules and curriculum compliance than I am about the nomenclature used for students and staff.  First things first, and all that.

That reliance on the "dog not barking" to use Sherlock Holmes' term, may be contributing to a false sense of security. In my Wing, the DCP isn't part of the review chain, and isn't in the loop on most encampment planning and execution (at least, my predecessor and I weren't, as DCPs).  Our Wing/CC and CV have pointed out their disagreement with the newly approved Encampment Guide lines of command, with the justification that an Encampment/CC is an appointed line position, and as such should not report through the DCP as a staff director. So, at least some DCPs are not in the loop on Encampments, by design, and I think I'll stop there on that topic.


Back to the OP's thrust: as I've now returned my focus to retaining excellence at my local heritage unit, we're including modules on Encampment Student prep for our Basic Cadet Training modules based around the Wingman curriculum, on Encampment Cadre prep in our C/NCO modules, and on Encampment Command prep in our C/Officer modules. My unit supplied about a third of our Wing's C/Officer and C/NCO cadre this year, including the Encampment C/CC (although, apparently none of them intend to apply to my Wings event again, based on our internal review this summer). I'm trying to capture their cadre "prep" lessons learned on a local level, before their experience evaporates.


I suppose then, my point would be that a broad spectrum encampment "prep" would include an institutionalized training program for students, for cadre, and for officer staff. Beyond the RST event, that is. For adult officers, we should document and cover actual encampment planning and execution, logistics, admin, communication and delegation vice organizational breakdown, how to network with DoD agencies and POCs to get things done (from military O rides to getting the AC turned on BEFORE graduation), on actually turning ORM into smart decision making to avoid incidents, on criteria for reportable safety incidents, and on conducting an open, honest, accurate public AAR and in pivoting off those results to improve for successive years. Selecting and equipping ADULT officers seems to be the biggest preparation task that's not being filled, I would suggest, although I don't want to distract from the OP's great original point.

V/R,
Spam

For now, our squadron is focusing primarily on the cadet newbies, not so much the officer staff and cadre. While I do agree with some of the points you've made on the side of building up the cadet officers, it's not really applicable at the moment to what we're trying to get done back at home base.

It's been well-known how I feel about some of the things that have been done in our squadron in the past when it comes to cadet leadership and responsibilities. We have had way too many people in officer positions that were totally inappropriate. I'm finding that this is a common issue in many squadrons, and I'm thinking this comes from CDCs not knowing how to properly structure and manage cadet duty positions on top of commanders who are filling slots for the sake of filling slots. It makes it very difficult to train even the newest of cadets because the cadets in high-up positions aren't trained enough themselves and are failing at the lead-by-example theory. Still, I find, based on what I know, that our wing's encampment does a very good job at making sure people are placed in staff positions appropriate for their level of experience and maturity; however, I also find that some of these cadets return to their home squadrons and still think they're at encampment in those positions of responsibility and can't turn it off when they get back to the norm. There's a lot of prep work that goes into heading off to encampment, but there's also a lot of work that we seem to have to put in, from the CP standpoint, to get some of these cadets off the totem pole and back to the squadron-level operation.