OLD Uniforms

[SAR-EMT1]

Being as I am a newer member -6 years-  I would like to learn something and call upon those more experience then I for assistance.
I know we hear daily ideas and thoughts on what some folks would just love to see added to our uniforms - be they AF or Corporate or whatever.

I would like to flip the bit and ask about OLD uniforms for a moment.

What old uniforms or features of old uniforms or bling from old uniforms would you like to see make a comeback.  Also, were there any items that were killed off that you thank heaven for?
- discussion of old ID cards is also allowed.
Thank you...

Discuss

[ELTHunter]

They were way before my time, but I'd like to see the khaki summer uniform come back as a USAF uniform.  However, since the USAF doesn't plan to go back to it, that's only wishfull thinking.

[AlphaSigOU]

Two words: guayabera shirts. (Not that I have a problem with 'em, it just ain't a uniform!)

[Hawk200]

Two words: guayabera shirts. (Not that I have a problem with 'em, it just ain't a uniform!)

Agreed. I always thought they looked way too casual. The polo shirts are casual, but they still maintain a certain professional appearance that's in line with what a lot of companies are doing these days, uniform wise.

As far as old things, I really liked the old jungle fatigues. They actually looked pretty good with the blue insignia. And they could be starched nicely (I once made a set stand up by themselves after ironing them for awhile). Would love to see them again, but they wouldn't be practical, considering there are probably very few places that make them anymore. But I really liked them.

[Stonewall]

As far as old things, I really liked the old jungle fatigues. They actually looked pretty good with the blue insignia. And they could be starched nicely (I once made a set stand up by themselves after ironing them for awhile). Would love to see them again, but they wouldn't be practical, considering there are probably very few places that make them anymore. But I really liked them.

+1  Jungles were my favorite too.  Would love to have those back.

[Major Carrales]

Last year at Civil Air Portal I started some comentary on older uniforms that evolved into this yet to be completed "CAP Uniform History."

http://wiki.cadetstuff.org/index.php?title=CAP_Uniform_History

I should very much like to complete it this summer.

[ELTHunter]

Great site Joe!  Thanks for bringing it up.

I had one of the old 1950's era USAF Officer's cotton khaki shirts of my Dad's.  I wore it until it was thread bare.  I've looked on the internet to try and find another one but have been unsuccessful.  You can find replicas made of wool, but I've not located a cotton one.

[ELTHunter]

What does the second "C" stand for in the CAPC cut out?  Corporation? Corp? Cadet?

[Hawk200]

What does the second "C" stand for in the CAPC cut out?  Corporation? Corp? Cadet?

"Cadet". The old CAPC cutout was phased out some time ago. It wasn't deemed practical to have two separate collar cutouts.

[Major Carrales]

If anyone has pics of older CAP uniforms we can continue the effort here.

[MIKE]

I wasn't around for any of these, but I like the jungles... both the early and later styles.  Pretty much anything khaki. Ike/ETO jackets... OD or blue, doesn't matter.

I also like the winter blue shirt.  Well, I know I like the USCG version anyway.  Problem is I can't find any in my size. 

[Camas]

They were way before my time, but I'd like to see the khaki summer uniform come back as a USAF uniform.

So would I; I wore both versions of those back 45 years ago.  The 1505's were a cotton/polyester blend worn roughly from about 1962 to the late 70's and was a very comfortable uniform.  It's predecessor, the 505's, was a similar uniform except it was all-cotton and had to be starched.  The 505's were also available in bermuda shorts and a bush jacket which was a safari-type jacket with a big belt around it. The 505's were around from the mid 50's to the mid 60's.

I also like the winter blue shirt.

I also fondly remember the dark blue longsleeved winter shirt.  That was a great uniform component worn as a "Class B" blue uniform and yes, that's was it was called back in those days.

[Eclipse]

Two words: guayabera shirts. (Not that I have a problem with 'em, it just ain't a uniform!)

Wa-wa-wait - I just looked this up?  We had those as a "uniform"?

Pics?

[Hawk200]

Two words: guayabera shirts. (Not that I have a problem with 'em, it just ain't a uniform!)

Wa-wa-wait - I just looked this up?  We had those as a "uniform"?

Pics?

One word: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!   

[MIKE]

I can't believe I missed the part about the bling!  The obvious ones:  Blue epaulet sleeves, blue nametags and metal grade.

A derivative of the old white on blue cloth cadet grade chevrons.  Not necessarily sewn on though.  Possibly as epaulet sleeves or something similar to the ACU ranks or Brit CS95.  I think some of the old ribbons could return... In concept, but not necessarily design.  Also those cadet position badges or a derivative thereof.

[LtCol White]

Two words: guayabera shirts. (Not that I have a problem with 'em, it just ain't a uniform!)

Wa-wa-wait - I just looked this up?  We had those as a "uniform"?

Pics?

posting photos of this would constitute harrassment, and cruel and unusual punishement. I'm sure that even NHQ has destroyed all images or references to it being a uniform item. It was HIDEOUS !!!!

[ZigZag911]

By all means, let's bring back the khaki!

[JC004]

Two words: guayabera shirts. (Not that I have a problem with 'em, it just ain't a uniform!)

Wa-wa-wait - I just looked this up?  We had those as a "uniform"?

Pics?

posting photos of this would constitute harrassment, and cruel and unusual punishement. I'm sure that even NHQ has destroyed all images or references to it being a uniform item. It was HIDEOUS !!!!

Agree.

[RiverAux]

Well National has the good sense to only use Black and White photos of the old uniforms....    The horror isn't quite so obvious that way.

[JohnKachenmeister]

CAPC cutouts went away in 1966.  So did the sew-on patches for "Cadet Civil Air Patrol" and the "Pepsi Cola" patch for SM's.  All on the same order.

The old "CAP" cutouts for SM's also had periods separating the letters.  The new CAP cutouts eliminated the periods.

The uniform patches were replaced with rectangular identification badges.

I don't know when the badges went away.  I think I was overseas expending ordnance when that happened.

If someone can tell me the year, I can tell you what country it was.

[SAR-EMT1]

Why DO Seniors have Gray Nametags when Cadets have blue?
We should match.
I applauded the fact that we got the silver and blue nameplates for Service dress several years ago.
I saw one Senior a while back who had a nametag that said Civil Air Patrol followed by his name. No mention of the Air Force at all! Bad taste if you ask me, and a slap in the face to the Air Force.

What did the older Senior nametag look like?

[Hawk200]

What did the older Senior nametag look like?

It was the same as the current cadet nametag, with no variation to indicate senior or cadet. At least that was the most recent nametag.

The nametag you saw without an Air Force reference was probably the TPU nametag. It just has "Civil Air Patrol" and the members last name. It's supposed to be worn only on the white shirt, blue pants uniform variation.

[AlphaSigOU]

Why DO Seniors have Gray Nametags when Cadets have blue?
We should match.
I applauded the fact that we got the silver and blue nameplates for Service dress several years ago.
I saw one Senior a while back who had a nametag that said Civil Air Patrol followed by his name. No mention of the Air Force at all! Bad taste if you ask me, and a slap in the face to the Air Force.

What did the older Senior nametag look like?

Way back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, the nametag was black with the CAP crest - just like the current blazer nametag without the wing designation or rank. Only a metal 'CADET CIVIL AIR PATROL' (for cadets) or 'CIVIL AIR PATROL-AUXILIARY U.S. AIR FORCE' (for seniors) plate worn above the nametag distinguished one from the other.

Around 1978, the blue 3-line nameplate was introduced for both cadets and seniors. After the maroon epaulets were forced on us, the blazer nameplate was worn only by seniors on the grays before the three-line gray nameplate was introduced around 1995 with the gray epaulets. The TPU combo uses a two-line blue (or silver - for the TPU service dress) nameplate.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Why DO Seniors have Gray Nametags when Cadets have blue?
We should match.
I applauded the fact that we got the silver and blue nameplates for Service dress several years ago.
I saw one Senior a while back who had a nametag that said Civil Air Patrol followed by his name. No mention of the Air Force at all! Bad taste if you ask me, and a slap in the face to the Air Force.

What did the older Senior nametag look like?

The old nameplates were black, and had the last name in white letters.  On the side of the tag, before the start of the name, was a small gold CAP seal.

[Major Carrales]

Tell me about the powder blue female uniform.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Tell me about the powder blue female uniform.

Sparky:

The only "Powder blue" uniform I remember was the smurf suit, was was designed to make both males and females equally ugly.  In the 60's there were "Blue cords" for females, which were the equivalent uniform to the khaki 1505 or 505 for the males.

[SAR-EMT1]

So any possibility of at least getting Seniors back with the same blue nametag as cadets? - epulet color aside-

Sidebar...
What was the 'best' looking CAP ID card back -in-the-day?
and what was on it? I saw one from a LtCol once that listed a request for assitance on the backside  from servicemembers, police etc...and had the CAP or AF Seal (cant remember)  Thought it was pretty nice.

The one we have now seems pretty tame.

[SarDragon]

I'm going to answer more than one post here, so bear with me a bit.

Camas talked about the bush jacket. IIRC, it had the 1505 material, not the 505 material. I had one up until about 1982 or so, and don't recall that it had the hard cotton texture of the 505s.

I also fondly remember the dark blue longsleeved winter shirt.  That was a great uniform component worn as a "Class B" blue uniform and yes, that's was it was called back in those days.

Great uniform. I miss it. As for "Class B", not officially. I have copies of uni regs clear back to 1968, and combinations were never in that time referred to by classes.

I don't know when the badges went away.  I think I was overseas expending ordnance when that happened.

They went away in Jul '81. Additionally, the olde name tags with the CAP seal went away at the same time. The three-line style was introduced in 1978, giving an overlap period.

*****
Guayabera shirts - I can scan a uni reg page, and post it, but I refuse up front to replace any keyboards that might get puked on. Y'all's choice.

[JC004]

...
Guayabera shirts - I can scan a uni reg page, and post it, but I refuse up front to replace any keyboards that might get puked on. Y'all's choice.

Doooo iiiiiit.

[PA Guy]

I'm going to answer more than one post here, so bear with me a bit.

Camas talked about the bush jacket. IIRC, it had the 1505 material, not the 505 material. I had one up until about 1982 or so, and don't recall that it had the hard cotton texture of the 505s.

I also fondly remember the dark blue longsleeved winter shirt.  That was a great uniform component worn as a "Class B" blue uniform and yes, that's was it was called back in those days.

Great uniform. I miss it. As for "Class B", not officially. I have copies of uni regs clear back to 1968, and combinations were never in that time referred to by classes.

I don't know when the badges went away.  I think I was overseas expending ordnance when that happened.

They went away in Jul '81. Additionally, the olde name tags with the CAP seal went away at the same time. The three-line style was introduced in 1978, giving an overlap period.

*****
Guayabera shirts - I can scan a uni reg page, and post it, but I refuse up front to replace any keyboards that might get puked on. Y'all's choice.

The bush jacket only came in the shade 505 cotton material. When the 1505 came out the bush jacket was phased out.  I still have mine.

[SarDragon]

OK, I sit corrected.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Thank you for not posting the G-shirt pix.

If the TPU makes us look like officers in the Guatemalan Navy, the Gyaberra made us look like Guatemalan sugar cane plantation owners.

[Hawk200]

If the TPU makes us look like officers in the Guatemalan Navy, the Gyaberra made us look like Guatemalan sugar cane plantation owners.

I always thought it looked like a drug lord trying to look like a sugar cane plantation owner...

Or I could just have an extremely odd imagination.

[JohnKachenmeister]

Drug lords don't wear nametags!

[ZigZag911]

Tell me about the powder blue female uniform.

Sparky:

The only "Powder blue" uniform I remember was the smurf suit, was was designed to make both males and females equally ugly.  In the 60's there were "Blue cords" for females, which were the equivalent uniform to the khaki 1505 or 505 for the males.

And the color of the 'blue cords' (a blouse & skirt, IIRC) could accurately be described as "powder blue"!

[BillB]

There were two blue cord female uniforms, the cotton cord and the dacron cord. The cotton cord was worn to the mid 1960's when it was replaced by the dacron cord. The cotton cord required starch and ironing, the dacron cord only a light ironing if even that. I have "rebuilt a set of both uniforms and hopefully people can see them at the 2008 National Board meeting at Orlando where a select group of cadets will be wearing the various uniforms from 1942 and up.

[SarDragon]

Thank you for not posting the G-shirt pix.

If the TPU makes us look like officers in the Guatemalan Navy, the Gyaberra made us look like Guatemalan sugar cane plantation owners.

Well, I don't quite see a consensus yet. Bueller?

[SAR-EMT1]

How many different ID cards have we had in the last few decades?

[SarDragon]

Well, as for real IDs, I've seen two in the last 25 years or so. When we talk about membership cards, I have five different styles in my drawer, going back to 1980.

[SAR-EMT1]

Would you prefer one of the older styles in place of the one we have today?

[SarDragon]

Would you prefer one of the older styles in place of the one we have today?

Presuming that your Q was addressed to me, I think today's membership card is good. It's sturdy, has a color set that makes it easy to copy when necessary to submit with paperwork, and has the necessary personal info. So, no, I wouldn't prefer an older style.

[Grumpy]

They were way before my time, but I'd like to see the khaki summer uniform come back as a USAF uniform.  However, since the USAF doesn't plan to go back to it, that's only wishfull thinking.

Have you ever had to starch those suckers and iron in military creases?  When you broke starch taking your first step your pants wrinkled and looked terrible.  I can tell you stories about being lowered into my extra heavily starched pants when getting dressed for drill team competitions.   No thanks, the new blues are cooler and easier to maintain.

Brian Billing, Maj. CAP
CA324

[Grumpy]

Last year at Civil Air Portal I started some comentary on older uniforms that evolved into this yet to be completed "CAP Uniform History."

http://wiki.cadetstuff.org/index.php?title=CAP_Uniform_History

I should very much like to complete it this summer.

I very much enjoyed your web site.  It brought back memories of 1959 through 1963, when I was a cadet.  We didn't have the Mitchell or the Spaatz Awards then.  We had the Certificate of Proficiency (COP).  The ribbon was blue with a white three bladed propeller in the center with three horizontal stripes on either side of the propeller.  I didn't see that ribbon or the three red, white, and blue cadet ribbons in your collection.

I remember wearing the 505 uniform with bush jacket with that stupid belt.  When I went into the Air Force in June of 63 they were phasing out the 505's and phasing in the 1505's so my issue was half and half.

Memories!

Brian Billing
CA324

[SarDragon]

They were way before my time, but I'd like to see the khaki summer uniform come back as a USAF uniform.  However, since the USAF doesn't plan to go back to it, that's only wishfull thinking.

Have you ever had to starch those suckers and iron in military creases?  When you broke starch taking your first step your pants wrinkled and looked terrible.  I can tell you stories about being lowered into my extra heavily starched pants when getting dressed for drill team competitions.   No thanks, the new blues are cooler and easier to maintain.

Brian Billing, Maj. CAP
CA324

Y'olde fart, you would have to remind me of that. I thought I had excised that from my memory. Now I'm going to have nightmares thinking about that again!

On a more serious note, the olde khaki/tan uniforms had major comfort and appearance issues. They looked good when you first put them on, but showed sweat and dirt quickly. A bad press or starch job could ruin them fairly easily. And on top of all that, they were never comfortable because of all the starch. I'm glad they are gone.

[ZigZag911]

Have you ever had to starch those suckers and iron in military creases?  When you broke starch taking your first step your pants wrinkled and looked terrible.  I can tell you stories about being lowered into my extra heavily starched pants when getting dressed for drill team competitions.   No thanks, the new blues are cooler and easier to maintain.

Brian Billing, Maj. CAP
CA324

Modern materials would almost certainly overcome these defects.

When we wore the khakis, no one ever mistook us for bus drivers or postal workers!