Command Patch

[Flying Pig]

I ordered the CAP Command Patch for the Flight Suit.  Vanguard told me the "US Air Force Aux" patch is not longer authorized, and that it now says Civil Air Patrol in the bottom scroll.  Just confirming that is correct before I order.

[mikeylikey]

Unfortunately they are correct.   

Here it is!  http://level2.cap.gov/documents/2006_11_CAP_Uniforms.pdf

[JC004]

Hmm...I wonder how much I can get for the AF Auxiliary patches underground...

[LtCol White]

Just hang on to them. You never know when it will switch back. LOL
Besides, I think there is a phase in period on this to transition over to the new one if I'm not mistaken.

[mdickinson]

Unfortunately they are correct.   
Here it is!  http://level2.cap.gov/documents/2006_11_CAP_Uniforms.pdf

In that memo, dated 20 Nov 06, Pineda writes:

Members may begin wearing the new patch on the CAP distinctive blue flightsuit/jacket, utility uniform and the black leather jacket as soon as they are available.  The Uniform Board is working on the specific implementation details now as well as requesting Air Force approval to change the patch worn on the AF-style green flightsuit and flight jacket.  An additional announcement will be made as soon as the details are finalized.

Has an "additional announcement" been made? If not, then the answer to the original question ("is the 'CAP U.S. Air Force Auxiliary' patch is no longer authorized?") depends whether by "flight suit" the original writer meant "AF-style green flight suit" or "CAP distinctive blue flight suit".

The Pineda memo seems to be saying that the "CAP U.S. Air Force Auxiliary" command patch is the only one currently authorized on the green flight suit, and for the time being, either command patch is OK on the blue flight suit.

[LtCol White]

Unfortunately they are correct.   
Here it is!  http://level2.cap.gov/documents/2006_11_CAP_Uniforms.pdf

In that memo, dated 20 Nov 06, Pineda writes:

Members may begin wearing the new patch on the CAP distinctive blue flightsuit/jacket, utility uniform and the black leather jacket as soon as they are available.  The Uniform Board is working on the specific implementation details now as well as requesting Air Force approval to change the patch worn on the AF-style green flightsuit and flight jacket.  An additional announcement will be made as soon as the details are finalized.

Has an "additional announcement" been made? If not, then the answer to the original question ("is the 'CAP U.S. Air Force Auxiliary' patch is no longer authorized?") depends whether by "flight suit" the original writer meant "AF-style green flight suit" or "CAP distinctive blue flight suit".

The Pineda memo seems to be saying that the "CAP U.S. Air Force Auxiliary" command patch is the only one currently authorized on the green flight suit, and for the time being, either command patch is OK on the blue flight suit.

That sounds possible given the corporate vs USAF uniforms.

[Pylon]

Vanguard told me the "US Air Force Aux" patch is not longer authorized, and that it now says Civil Air Patrol in the bottom scroll. 

I love how Vanguard dictates policy to us by telling us what we can and cannot order.   

[jimmydeanno]

AAFES Uniform Clothing Sales does it too.  When I got my mess dress jacket, I grabbed the blue braid instead of the silver (like I'm supposed to), and the lady at the counter told me I was wrong.  Granted, she didn't know I was in CAP yet.  So I told her that I was a CAP Officer and we wear the blue braid. 

She then re-corrected me and said that the officer's mess dress jacket is worn with a silver braid, CAP explanation again.  A few more rounds of the same things, and I politely said...you don't have to wear it, so if I screw it up, it doesn't affect you, so let me just buy it. Check-out proceded.

Next, I walked over to the alteration shop, next door over (still inside the clothing store), with my alteration ticket, and the alterations lady started the same thing about the silver braid, not the blue one.  CAP explanation comes out again.  Same thing as before, only this time she says that I'm not allowed to wear that braid with that coat.  Another CAP explanation.  Same situation as before, I politely said, all I'm asking is that you sew this on, I promise I won't come back if it is wrong, just do what I'm asking.  Alteration commenced.

Yes, it was a little agrevating, since I knew what I was talking about, but in some ways it is a good thing that they question it.  Everyone complains that CAP members don't wear their uniforms properly.  It is going to be an inconvenience to those who know what they're doing, but for those who don't it might save them money, or time in returns getting the right thing.  If you have a new guy who orders a Blue Flight Suit and accessories in the same order, but orders the old command patch, why not make sure that was the intent? 

Way back when, when someone else filled your gas tank, your oil got checked, they checked your tires, etc, to save you problems down the road.  It was good customer service.  Now someone tries to help and we give them heck...

[Pylon]

Way back when, when someone else filled your gas tank, your oil got checked, they checked your tires, etc, to save you problems down the road.  It was good customer service.  Now someone tries to help and we give them heck...

I see your point, and perhaps in one way they are looking out for CAP members.  However, a little more accuracy and truth in their statement would have been better.   For example:

"Hey, you can order the new Civil Air Patrol MAJCOM patch, because they're worn on the blue suits now and they're being phased in on the green bags.  You can wear the USAF Aux MAJCOM patch on the green bag, but you can save yourself buying another patch down the road if you get the CAP one now" is good customer service.

"The USAF Aux MAJCOM patch is no longer authorized.  You have to order the one with Civil Air Patrol on the scroll" is not only incorrect, it's not exactly the best customer service tactic.

[Eclipse]

Never ask Vanguard for advice with regards to regs, nor AAFES for that matter (at least CAP-wise).
Their job is to know quantity and pricing.

[dhon27]

Also, see the following from 2-3 March 2007 Draft National Board Minutes:

Agenda Item 11, 8, m
Command Patch
RECOMMENDATION: Approve immediate wear of newly revised Command Patch
on AF-style flight suit and flight jacket with mandatory wear date of 1 March 2008.
CAP-USAF/CC concurred with the proposal.
ACTION: COL CHITWOOD/SWR MOVED AND COL JENSEN/CT SECONDED
that the National Board vote to approve the recommendation of the Uniform
Board.
MOTION CARRIED

As such, I would anticipate that this will be voted on at the Summer Board.

[DNall]

RECOMMENDATION:

As such, I would anticipate that this will be voted on at the Summer Board.

It won't be voted on, that was the vote to make the recommendation to AF which was made and as far as I know has not yet been approved.

[Flying Pig]

Interesting.....Vanguard told me I couldn't even buy the AF patch. 


I remember as a Senior Member, back about 1997ish, I went to the base PX at March ARB.  The lady at the counter gave me a heck of a time.  She actually wouldnt let me even buy anything until the store manager approved everything I had bought.  It was odd.  I bought the blues, and BDU's and a new set of my Marine ribbons.  What sent them over the edge even more was a set of gold jump wings and a scuba badge I had bought.  Which, They let me buy the ribbons, but he asked if I was in Force Recon because of the badges.  I told him they were for a friend of mine for his shadow box.  It went down hill from there.

He, the manager, also tried to convince me hat all CAP membes wore the enlisted blues cover, not the officers cover.  Finally, an AF Chief who was in my CAP Sq. walked in in his AF uniform and squared it away.  I even mentioned I had just been discharged from the Marines about 3 months earlier.  The guys response was "You should have come in three months ago."  I about knocked him out.

It was weird...they werent really rude, just very serious.  I think they wernt used to civilians buying uniforms

Old story I know.  But it was funny.

[mikeylikey]

^^  This is all something AF needs to correct.  IT is far beyond the time that we are to be treated as second class airman.  Hell.......we (as CAP) volunteer our time without pay.  Granted, military and CAP are way different things, but there was a time when a CAP member had almost the exact same benefits that an AD military member had.  Who screwed the pooch on that?  It was the AF....... they realy put CAP on the back burner for MANY YEARS.  It seems that a lot of things on this board make reference to the Coast Guard AUX.  We were at a time alot like them.  The powers that be "back in the day" screwed us out of that.  I would love for CAP to become the AF AUX again!

[BillB]

Years ago, CAP could buy just about anything in the PX, and if you were on Base in Base housing, you could even buy two cartons of cigarettes. It was only one of the perks of CAP membership. All O-clubs were open to CAP members,, you could buy booze on base with just a CAP ID card. (limited amount compared to AD) Even had an older cadet buy a case of beer during an encampment, but that's another story.
This all changes in the late 1980's with the National Board and NEC assuming more authority while the Air Force backed off. Now with the multitude of corporate uniforms and the revised command patch, it appears CAP is trying to distance itself from the Air Force to assume outside missions. Time will tell if this is a good idea or not.

[LtCol White]

^^  This is all something AF needs to correct.  IT is far beyond the time that we are to be treated as second class airman.  Hell.......we (as CAP) volunteer our time without pay.  Granted, military and CAP are way different things, but there was a time when a CAP member had almost the exact same benefits that an AD military member had.  Who screwed the pooch on that?  It was the AF....... they realy put CAP on the back burner for MANY YEARS.  It seems that a lot of things on this board make reference to the Coast Guard AUX.  We were at a time alot like them.  The powers that be "back in the day" screwed us out of that.  I would love for CAP to become the AF AUX again!

Nope, the only one who screwed the pooch on this was CAP. There were members who abused the privileges, as always happens, and USAF took them away.

[SAR-EMT1]

I would be willing to mail a check to anyone willing to part with a USAF-Aux command patch.   

.... I hate the new piece of bling.

[Flying Pig]

It only took 4 days for Vanguard to send me my confirmation email.....which I had to reply to first in order for them to send my order!

[JC004]

It only took 4 days for Vanguard to send me my confirmation email.....which I had to reply to first in order for them to send my order!

Only 4 days?  You lucky bastard...

[JC004]

I would be willing to mail a check to anyone willing to part with a USAF-Aux command patch.   

.... I hate the new piece of bling.

I will look to see if I have one in storage, but I don't think that I do.   

[Smokey]

You might try the Hock Shop...they are still shown on their website