Active Member or Inactive Member?

Started by Luis R. Ramos, July 27, 2012, 03:36:08 PM

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Luis R. Ramos

Our unit has a member that is taking all online courses, renewing, and keeping himself safety current. We do not know who he is, nor has he responded to repeated requests from the commander to attend meetings. His phone is disconnected, letters are returned.

Our new commander wants to transfer him to the "ghost squadron." At this time I am kind of agreeing with him but want to hear other opinions.

What do you feel?

I tried finding these threads but was not able to find the right keywords.
Squadron Safety Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer

Phil Hirons, Jr.

He's keeping up with our required training and paying dues. He is obviously interested in keeping his membership current and is not putting the squadron out of training compliance. Ideally he should have kept his contact information current in e-services. Considering his effort, I'd be hesitant to transfer him without actually making contact.

If his listed phone # is disconnected and he has moved, how exactly can he be failing to respond to requests he is not getting?

Eclipse

I would do it and not hesitate - that or put him in Patron status, depending on your wing's preference.
A member who never shows and has no current contact information is no asset to CAP except for his financial
contribution, which he can continue to make as a Patron.

Either one will most likely get his attention.  If he's anything like some of the ones I've had to deal with,
he'll call the person who was the commander the last time he showed up to a meeting and throw
a fit about not being appreciated.

He may well be participating in a single large activity, or just wandering around the wing doing whatever he pleases
and not feeling he needs to participate at his squadron.  If that's the case, you can suggest he transfer elsewhere.

"That Others May Zoom"

Angus

I'd transfer him over to Patron, you've made a good faith effort to contact him and resolve the situation.  By not keeping his number and adress current in e-services he's showing that he doesn't want to participate. 
Maj. Richard J. Walsh, Jr.
Director Education & Training MAWG 
 Gill Robb Wilson #4030

lordmonar

Ghost Squadron or 2B him

It is one thing to have some member you never see for one reason or another.....it is something completely different having a member you don't even know and your attempt to contact him keep getting kicked back.

Call your wing to see how they want to deal with it.

Disconected phone and returned mail are all red flags in books......don't sit on this one.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Майор Хаткевич

Quote from: flyer333555 on July 27, 2012, 03:36:08 PM
Our unit has a member that is taking all online courses, renewing, and keeping himself safety current. We do not know who he is...

How did he end up in the unit?

Eclipse

Quote from: usafaux2004 on July 27, 2012, 06:29:37 PM
How did he end up in the unit?

His membership probably predates 80% of the current members. 

My group had units with membership numbers in the 120xxx's that no one in the unit had ever met, ever.

"That Others May Zoom"

starshippe

   i would give him/her the benefit of the doubt unless driven otherwise by a fairly strong breeze.
   u never can tell, this member may have an extraordinary story to tell. he/she obviously wants to support the cap. if u don't want him/her, feel free to transfer him/her to our squadron.

bill
115313


Critical AOA

He is probably waiting to get paroled before he attends meetings.
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."   - George Bernard Shaw

AirDX

First, he's not hurting anything - you know he's "nondeployable" so he's not even on the table as an asset.  If he's keeping current with everything, why the big push to boot him... even 2B him?  For all you know he's deployed to Afghanistan, or is a 50 year member in a nursing home.  I'll echo the other guy above - if you don't want him, I'll take him.
Believe in fate, but lean forward where fate can see you.

lordmonar

Quote from: AirDX on July 27, 2012, 09:29:26 PM
First, he's not hurting anything - you know he's "nondeployable" so he's not even on the table as an asset.  If he's keeping current with everything, why the big push to boot him... even 2B him?  For all you know he's deployed to Afghanistan, or is a 50 year member in a nursing home.  I'll echo the other guy above - if you don't want him, I'll take him.
but who is he?

Sure maybe he is deployed, may be he is in a nursing home......all that is possible.......but if he will not respond to phone calls, e-mails and letters......it throws up red flags........Like I suggested before......follow up with wing and get some help...maybe they know who he is.  Maybe they have his correct address. 

Not knowing who these people are and the their back story....could be setting CAP up for a fall.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Thrashed

We have a few old timers that I've never met. They don't have computers. They don't attend meetings. They don't keep safety current (obviously). They are regular members, not patron or ghost squadron. It really hurts the safety stats. (I'm the safety officer).

We also have about 8 cadets who don't attend. Ever.

Save the triangle thingy

AirDX

Quote from: lordmonar on July 27, 2012, 09:33:36 PM

Not knowing who these people are and the their back story....could be setting CAP up for a fall.

Now that argument I will buy.  Maybe he's a guest of the state somewhere.  It bears looking into - maybe his next of kin?   
Believe in fate, but lean forward where fate can see you.

AirDX

Quote from: Thrashed on July 27, 2012, 09:41:37 PM
It really hurts the safety stats. (I'm the safety officer).


Safety stats are irrelevant.  All that counts is that the folks participating in functions are current. 
Believe in fate, but lean forward where fate can see you.

flyboy53

Quote from: flyer333555 on July 27, 2012, 03:36:08 PM
Our unit has a member that is taking all online courses, renewing, and keeping himself safety current. We do not know who he is, nor has he responded to repeated requests from the commander to attend meetings. His phone is disconnected, letters are returned.

Our new commander wants to transfer him to the "ghost squadron." At this time I am kind of agreeing with him but want to hear other opinions.

What do you feel?

I tried finding these threads but was not able to find the right keywords.

If he's up to date, leave him alone.

He doesn't really hurt your unit and you never know if he's there at the request of a higher headquarters.

Otherwise, have your unit commander contact NHQ to see if they have other contact informaiton or an address on him.

jimmydeanno

Ask around with the folks at Wing...isn't that where everyone goes when they outlive their usefulness?  (I keed, I keed).  But seriously, someone in another unit who has been around the block a few times may know where this person lives, or might have contact information for them.

If you have a name, and they're obviously older, they probably have a land line telephone that is listed in the phonebook (or online version).  That's usually good for an address and phone number.

Try facebook, a bunch of folks are on there to keep up with their kids, grandkids, etc.
If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law. - Winston Churchill

RiverAux

Hmm, I'm not sure if transferring him to the ghost squadron solves any potential "security" issues.  However, if there is someone in the unit that is impossible to contact by phone or mail, I would probably want him out of the unit so that I'm not in any way responsible for him. 

Luis R. Ramos

it appears this is a former cadet who contacted the previous commander. She allowed him to be a "virtual member," she calls it. This member IS NOT deployed, is living IN THE STATE. Does not contact the unit, does not participate except to take classes or stay safety current. Why should he have the bene3fits others do?
Squadron Safety Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer

RADIOMAN015

CAPR 39-2, paragraph 3, defines an "active" CAP senior member:

a. Active Member. A member who regularly attends meetings, performs a specific duty assignment, meets training requirements, and participates in the activities of his or her unit. An active member may wear the CAP uniform and compete for grade advancement (see CAPR 35-1, Assignment and Duty Status).


The senior member clearly doesn't meet the criteria for being active and likely should be transferred to patron status.

RM

         

Thrashed

Quote from: AirDX on July 27, 2012, 09:57:01 PM
Quote from: Thrashed on July 27, 2012, 09:41:37 PM
It really hurts the safety stats. (I'm the safety officer).


Safety stats are irrelevant.  All that counts is that the folks participating in functions are current.

Understood, but my wing doesn't agree. They don't want chronic (never) current members on the active member list to go to patron or ghost. 

Save the triangle thingy