Main Menu

Ultrathin questions

Started by Laplace, June 03, 2019, 12:26:23 PM

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Laplace

Considering getting an Ultrathin rack and don't see how I can place the silver numeric longevity device (30) on the Red Service Ribbon.  The silver numbers aren't a device choice from Ultrathin.

Is it possible to manually add the device after receipt?

Has anyone done it, and, if so, do you change every 5 years or just leave as is in lieu of buying another rack?

Thanks!

Toad1168

Just select the numbers.  When you get it, they are silver (at least mine are).  Chances are you will need a new rack (or several) within five years, so that's not an issue.  They also can change devices if you ship the rack back to them.
Toad

jhighman

If you phone their customer service line, they are very responsive and helpful. They probably have that option just not built into the tool.

They are also great at making changes after the fact. By the time you have 30 years in, I'm sure you have a sizable collection of ribbons. As long as they aren't too dirty or faded, they can work with your original rack and either add ribbons or devices. It isn't cheap, but if you have more than seven or eight ribbons and some devices, it's cheaper and easier (and better quality) than buying the components and assembling yourself.

I highly recommend springing for the magnetic option for shirts. I haven't tried them on a coat as I don't wear the AF service dress, so hopefully someone else can weigh in. I also picked up the "grey nameplate" with magnetic backing and love it. 

PHall

Quote from: Toad1168 on June 03, 2019, 01:09:37 PM
Just select the numbers.  When you get it, they are silver (at least mine are).  Chances are you will need a new rack (or several) within five years, so that's not an issue.  They also can change devices if you ship the rack back to them.

And tell them in the remarks box to use a CAP XX years device.
It's what I've always done and they haven't messed up an order yet.

baronet68

Funny that there no regulatory guidance as to what type of metal the numeric longevity devices are to be made.  While there is an illustration, which appears to be silver, the regulation simply states "A metal number..." 

Theoretically, one could use bronze, copper, wrought iron, silver, gold, or even platinum numbers on their red service ribbon.** 

Generally speaking, the military uses bronze numerals but common practice in CAP has gravitated toward using silver.



** Anyone wearing gold numbers and saying, "... but Major Moore said I could... " will be severely beaten with a wet noodle and fed to the fishes.
Michael Moore, Lt Col, CAP
National Recruiting & Retention Manager

PHall

Quote from: baronet68 on June 03, 2019, 07:23:10 PM
Funny that there no regulatory guidance as to what type of metal the numeric longevity devices are to be made.  While there is an illustration, which appears to be silver, the regulation simply states "A metal number..." 

Theoretically, one could use bronze, copper, wrought iron, silver, gold, or even platinum numbers on their red service ribbon.** 

Generally speaking, the military uses bronze numerals but common practice in CAP has gravitated toward using silver.



** Anyone wearing gold numbers and saying, "... but Major Moore said I could... " will be severely beaten with a wet noodle and fed to the fishes.

But CAP uses a one piece device to show 20, 25, 30, etc... years of service. So I guess no wet noodle floggings for you!
NTM that Ultra Thin knows what to use. They take pride in doing it right!

Luis R. Ramos

Funny how people insist on being "more Catholic than the Pope" in this forum...
Squadron Safety Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer

NIN

Quote from: Luis R. Ramos on June 03, 2019, 07:42:25 PM
Funny how people insist on being "more Catholic than the Pope" in this forum...

I'm sorry, what exactly do you mean by this?

Darin Ninness, Col, CAP
I have no responsibilities whatsoever
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2024 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

Luis R. Ramos

Some people here think that CAP regulations, manuals, pamphlets, and other publications should cover all known and unknown problems, possibilities, etc that might, could, or have happened. If NHQ personnel was to do this, the result would be a publication the size of the National tax code. Not to mention is that those people that prepare said documents, although they bring a vast knowledge and experience to the preparation of those documents, cannot foresee everything that will happen. And for sake of simplicity, those regulations have to be prepared in a way that will be understandable and readable by the majority of the population at large. 
Squadron Safety Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer

Eclipse

Quote from: Luis R. Ramos on June 04, 2019, 07:50:48 PM
Some people here think that CAP regulations, manuals, pamphlets, and other publications should cover all known and unknown problems, possibilities, etc that might, could, or have happened.

To be fair, most of the cases you're referring to are people introducing "not CAP" into CAP, whether through interpretation or wishes.

There's very little of important that isn't in the regs and curriculum, as long as you're reading with "mission" as the driver.


"That Others May Zoom"

LATORRECA

Are the ultrathin really worth it. I mean I been in the CAP for a while and the service (never mix the ribbons). Never use it, are not the same of a ribbon rack well put together. My opinion.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Eclipse

Honestly, they are superior in appearance, fit, and finish, but you get what you pay for.

I've always like the magnetic option for shirts, especially, the hold is pretty good, but can sometimes
slip on the jacket.

For someone wearing a service coat a lot with a fairly stable rack, I'd say yes, for newer
members, iffy.

"That Others May Zoom"

PHall

Quote from: Eclipse on June 09, 2019, 09:32:52 PM
Honestly, they are superior in appearance, fit, and finish, but you get what you pay for.

I've always like the magnetic option for shirts, especially, the hold is pretty good, but can sometimes
slip on the jacket.

For someone wearing a service coat a lot with a fairly stable rack, I'd say yes, for newer
members, iffy.

I would never recommend a Ultrathin set for a cadet. Their ribbons change too much.

LATORRECA

Quote from: PHall on June 09, 2019, 10:05:40 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on June 09, 2019, 09:32:52 PM
Honestly, they are superior in appearance, fit, and finish, but you get what you pay for.

I've always like the magnetic option for shirts, especially, the hold is pretty good, but can sometimes
slip on the jacket.

For someone wearing a service coat a lot with a fairly stable rack, I'd say yes, for newer
members, iffy.

I would never recommend a Ultrathin set for a cadet. Their ribbons change too much.
Glad not one.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

OldGuy

Quote from: Laplace on June 03, 2019, 12:26:23 PM
Considering getting an Ultrathin rack and don't see how I can place the silver numeric longevity device (30) on the Red Service Ribbon
Bragging much? Congrats and THANK YOU for three decades of service.

(And you should brag, that takes grit!)

baronet68

Quote from: LATORRECA on June 09, 2019, 09:27:50 PM
Are the ultrathin really worth it...

My opinion, a member's ribbon rack tends to be in a state of constant change until they've been in for about 10 years.  After that, things seem to slow down enough to allow an Ultrathin rack.  Unless I were to receive some significantly new award, I update my Ultrathin rack about every 5 years.

I've never used the magnetic option as I don't wear ribbons on shirts.  However, for ribbons on my service jacket and all other insignia I use this style of high-quality clutch backs:  https://www.amazon.com/Metal-Locking-Backs-Keepers-Silver/dp/B078MLG5SY/  (not endorsing any particular seller/vendor, just showing an example of my preferred design... these things never accidentally fall off)
Michael Moore, Lt Col, CAP
National Recruiting & Retention Manager

NIN



Quote from: baronet68 on June 10, 2019, 03:10:47 AM
My opinion, a member's ribbon rack tends to be in a state of constant change until they've been in for about 10 years.  After that, things seem to slow down enough to allow an Ultrathin rack.  Unless I were to receive some significantly new award, I update my Ultrathin rack about every 5 years.

It's hitting that 5 year cycle that's the trick. :)

When I came back from being retired 6 years ago, I added one ribbon to my rack (a military ribbon that was earned after the fact).  I considered updating to Ultra-Thins then, but figured I'd get some other award 10 minutes later. That's how my luck runs.

By last year, I was in a position to add three ribbons (an achievement award, a DSA and the AFOEA) so I dropped 3 ribbons to avoid the Bolivian admiral look.

I'm fairly sure I'm not adding more ribbons this year, but my goal is NSC and the Wilson next year, so I'm gonna hold off again, just in case.

Quote
I've never used the magnetic option as I don't wear ribbons on shirts.  However, for ribbons on my service jacket and all other insignia I use this style of high-quality clutch backs:  https://www.amazon.com/Metal-Locking-Backs-Keepers-Silver/dp/B078MLG5SY/  (not endorsing any particular seller/vendor, just showing an example of my preferred design... these things never accidentally fall off)

Strongly concur here. Jewelers clasps, they're the bomb. You've reminded me I need to order some more (I use these on my service coat and regular clutch backs on my shirt. Time to go all in)
Darin Ninness, Col, CAP
I have no responsibilities whatsoever
I like to have Difficult Adult Conversations™
The contents of this post are Copyright © 2007-2024 by NIN. All rights are reserved. Specific permission is given to quote this post here on CAP-Talk only.

GroundHawg

Quote from: LATORRECA on June 09, 2019, 09:27:50 PM
Are the ultrathin really worth it. I mean I been in the CAP for a while and the service (never mix the ribbons). Never use it, are not the same of a ribbon rack well put together. My opinion.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Not a fan of them honestly. I have not had good dealings with their customer service, and that combined with the overall expense, rules them out for me.
I hope you have better luck.

N6RVT

Quote from: GroundHawg on June 10, 2019, 01:20:11 PM
Quote from: LATORRECA on June 09, 2019, 09:27:50 PMAre the ultrathin really worth it. I mean I been in the CAP for a while and the service (never mix the ribbons). Never use it, are not the same of a ribbon rack well put together. My opinion.
Not a fan of them honestly. I have not had good dealings with their customer service, and that combined with the overall expense, rules them out for me.
I hope you have better luck.


I just tried their system to put together what a complete rack would be on a blues uniform - and it puts the AFOEA above the National Defense Service Medal (??).

Granted anything military goes above anything CAP, but within that rule, anything with a medal goes above anything that's just a ribbon.  That arrangement doesn't follow anyone's regs.

They also list Coast Guard Meritorious Team as an AUX ribbon for some reason.   The AUX can be awarded it, but it is an actual USCG ribbon.

In the CAP list of ribbons there are about a half dozen ones that don't have names that I don't recognize.  Precedence seems to put these on either side of the Red Service Ribbon.  I thought at first maybe historical awards, but they would still have a name.  What is ribbon C29A?  Is Ribbon C47 for DC-3 pilots?

Jester

In the AF precedence, AFOEA goes before NDSM.

To fix the problem of the CAP AFOEA placement, I clicked a higher CAP ribbon I didn't actually have to put it on the rack. Then I added in the details that it was only really a placeholder for the AFOEA and asked for them to make the switch.

They did it with no issues, I would recommend them any time.

HandsomeWalt_USMC

Quote from: Dwight Dutton on June 12, 2019, 02:16:18 PM
Quote from: GroundHawg on June 10, 2019, 01:20:11 PM
Quote from: LATORRECA on June 09, 2019, 09:27:50 PMAre the ultrathin really worth it. I mean I been in the CAP for a while and the service (never mix the ribbons). Never use it, are not the same of a ribbon rack well put together. My opinion.
Not a fan of them honestly. I have not had good dealings with their customer service, and that combined with the overall expense, rules them out for me.
I hope you have better luck.


I just tried their system to put together what a complete rack would be on a blues uniform - and it puts the AFOEA above the National Defense Service Medal (??).

Granted anything military goes above anything CAP, but within that rule, anything with a medal goes above anything that's just a ribbon.  That arrangement doesn't follow anyone's regs.

I have two ribbon only awards from the Marine Corps, Combat Action Ribbon and Navy  Unit Commendation, that are both higher in precedence than all of my medals except for one. There are plenty of mid-placed ribbon only awards across multiple services that are placed higher than service and campaign medals.

The AFOEA awarded to CAP has a strange CAP specific wear instruction for CAP uniforms that places it behind all other military awards and ahead of all CAP awards. Jester's solution is a good workaround if you're ordering from milthin.

I make my own thin ribbon and medal racks, so it's a non-issue for me. I know at least one person on the board has asked for photos and directions on how I build mine, when I get a little more time on my hands I will put together a tutorial.
HANDSOME SENDS

Semper Fidelis

"PRIDE IS CONTAGIOUS"

Eclipse

Quote from: HandsomeWalt_USMC on June 12, 2019, 04:16:58 PM
The AFOEA awarded to CAP has a strange CAP specific wear instruction for CAP uniforms that places it behind all other military awards and ahead of all CAP awards. Jester's solution is a good workaround if you're ordering from milthin.

And aren't yhou supposed to wear it twice if you earned it in the USAF?

(The fact that ~50% of the adult membership can't wear it at all notwithstanding of course.)

"That Others May Zoom"

GroundHawg

Quote from: Dwight Dutton on June 12, 2019, 02:16:18 PM
Quote from: GroundHawg on June 10, 2019, 01:20:11 PM
Quote from: LATORRECA on June 09, 2019, 09:27:50 PMAre the ultrathin really worth it. I mean I been in the CAP for a while and the service (never mix the ribbons). Never use it, are not the same of a ribbon rack well put together. My opinion.
Not a fan of them honestly. I have not had good dealings with their customer service, and that combined with the overall expense, rules them out for me.
I hope you have better luck.


I just tried their system to put together what a complete rack would be on a blues uniform - and it puts the AFOEA above the National Defense Service Medal (??).

Granted anything military goes above anything CAP, but within that rule, anything with a medal goes above anything that's just a ribbon.  That arrangement doesn't follow anyone's regs.

They also list Coast Guard Meritorious Team as an AUX ribbon for some reason.   The AUX can be awarded it, but it is an actual USCG ribbon.

In the CAP list of ribbons there are about a half dozen ones that don't have names that I don't recognize.  Precedence seems to put these on either side of the Red Service Ribbon.  I thought at first maybe historical awards, but they would still have a name.  What is ribbon C29A?  Is Ribbon C47 for DC-3 pilots?

There are probably 20 military awards that are listed as "not authorized in the selected order of precedence", none of the DOT, USPHS, NOAA, NASA, or Merchant Marines awards are showing as authorized, all foreign awards are being placed above CAP awards, and a few of them are showing as not allowed as well.

While fooling around with their site it did bring to light an interesting scenario that I had never thought about before. It is allowing different NATO and UN ribbons to be worn instead of picking one and adding attachments.


GaryVC

Quote from: Eclipse on June 12, 2019, 04:47:18 PM
Quote from: HandsomeWalt_USMC on June 12, 2019, 04:16:58 PM
The AFOEA awarded to CAP has a strange CAP specific wear instruction for CAP uniforms that places it behind all other military awards and ahead of all CAP awards. Jester's solution is a good workaround if you're ordering from milthin.

And aren't yhou supposed to wear it twice if you earned it in the USAF?

(The fact that ~50% of the adult membership can't wear it at all notwithstanding of course.)

Yes. That would apply to me but I have too many ribbons to wear anything but my AF decorations.

PHall

Quote from: GaryVC on June 12, 2019, 09:40:35 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on June 12, 2019, 04:47:18 PM
Quote from: HandsomeWalt_USMC on June 12, 2019, 04:16:58 PM
The AFOEA awarded to CAP has a strange CAP specific wear instruction for CAP uniforms that places it behind all other military awards and ahead of all CAP awards. Jester's solution is a good workaround if you're ordering from milthin.

And aren't yhou supposed to wear it twice if you earned it in the USAF?

(The fact that ~50% of the adult membership can't wear it at all notwithstanding of course.)

Yes. That would apply to me but I have too many ribbons to wear anything but my AF decorations.

That's why I don't wear any of my military ribbons on my CAP uniform. Too many and I'm too cheap!

baronet68

Quote from: PHall on June 12, 2019, 09:47:28 PM
That's why I don't wear any of my military ribbons on my CAP uniform. Too many and I'm too cheap!

I used to wear my Army ribbons on my CAP uniform but I no longer mix-and-match. 

While I'm very proud of my Army service, it is a CAP uniform so wearing only my CAP ribbons makes sense.
Michael Moore, Lt Col, CAP
National Recruiting & Retention Manager

THRAWN

Quote from: baronet68 on June 13, 2019, 07:28:38 PM
Quote from: PHall on June 12, 2019, 09:47:28 PM
That's why I don't wear any of my military ribbons on my CAP uniform. Too many and I'm too cheap!

I used to wear my Army ribbons on my CAP uniform but I no longer mix-and-match. 

While I'm very proud of my Army service, it is a CAP uniform so wearing only my CAP ribbons makes sense.

That attitude will get you nowhere.
Strup-"Belligerent....at times...."
AFRCC SMC 10-97
NSS ISC 05-00
USAF SOS 2000
USAF ACSC 2011
US NWC 2016
USMC CSCDEP 2023

Fubar

Quote from: THRAWN on June 13, 2019, 07:46:57 PMThat attitude will get you nowhere.

Yeah, we have no use for common sense!

CAP9907

21 yrs of service

Our Members Code of Conduct can be found here:   http://captalk.net/index.php?topic=13.0