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CAP Talk  |  Operations  |  Aviation & Flying Activities  |  Topic: Off-topic uniform rants
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ColonelJack
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,358
Unit: SER-GA-153

« Reply #20 on: May 11, 2018, 12:21:21 PM »

I've said this before, and I'll say it again (and probably more times in the future), and I am not addressing any one individual:

I cannot understand why people join an organization like CAP - which wears uniforms and has a military-style grade structure - and then do every single thing that they can do to avoid wearing uniforms and possessing military-style grade.

If you really want to just get by with not even wearing the minimum uniform called for in our regulations - the regulations you agreed to when you joined - then why did you join in the first place?

Bob's right.  CAP needs members who are in for the whole program.

If all you want to do is fly SAR and/or traipse through woods on ES missions, aren't there far more suitable organizations to be a part of?  Ones that don't require (again with those pesky regs that you agreed to abide by when you signed up) you to feel as if you're playing military?

Good grief.

Jack
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Jack Bagley, Ed. D.
Lt. Col., Civil Air Patrol
Gill Robb Wilson Award No. 1366, 29 Nov 1991
Admiral, Great Navy of the State of Nebraska
Luis R. Ramos
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 2,615

« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2018, 12:38:33 PM »

Saying that otherwise:

People move to live near airports, then complain about the noise. If you do not like airplane noise, why move near an airport?


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Squadron Administrative Officer
Squadron Communication Officer
Squadron Emergency Services Officer
Fubar
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 670

« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2018, 01:58:18 PM »

I cannot understand why people join an organization like CAP - which wears uniforms and has a military-style grade structure - and then do every single thing that they can do to avoid wearing uniforms and possessing military-style grade.

We're desperate for members. New folks wander in, hear about all the great opportunities CAP has to offer and then notice a couple of cadets marching around in some sort of military-style uniform. The prospective member raises an eyebrow and asks if everyone has to do that. The answer is, "Don't worry about it, all you need is a polo shirt and you'll just have to worry about flying and helping out in some sort of staff job that helps keep the unit running."

Most people I know that have joined CAP had some variation of that conversation (or joined a senior-only squadron which is essentially a flying club). That's why people join an organization like CAP without being interested in uniforms and military stuff. I don't think people like me are join and then immediately start scheming how to avoid the aspects of CAP we aren't interested in, we're told up front not to worry about it.

Once you're in and you start to run into people who joined specifically for uniforms and behaving as if they're in the military, it's easy to see where conflict arises. As long as there is a CAP polo shirt uniform, you'll have members who aren't interested in the military dress up.

As for the grade structure, since it doesn't actually mean anything (especially when someone can walk in from the military and be granted advanced grade with no CAP knowledge), people who aren't military aficionados are going to have a hard time caring about it since it doesn't directly affect their mission success (flying missions, serving as the squadron DO, preparing safety briefings, etc). If you want me to care about the grade structure, have it mean something.

Quote
If you really want to just get by with not even wearing the minimum uniform called for in our regulations - the regulations you agreed to when you joined - then why did you join in the first place?

I certainly wouldn't advocate not wearing a uniform at all, even though they're only required during specific circumstances (flying for one). If I was required to wear something more than a polo shirt, I'd probably consider it, depending on what's involved, cost, and so forth.

Quote
Bob's right.  CAP needs members who are in for the whole program.

I feel as though I am in for the whole program. I work part-time like hours on CAP and for the most part, it's fun or I wouldn't do it. I certainly adhere to everything this program requires me to do. I don't understand why there are people out there who don't think that's enough.
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kwe1009
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 908

« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2018, 02:58:36 PM »

Quote
If you really want to just get by with not even wearing the minimum uniform called for in our regulations - the regulations you agreed to when you joined - then why did you join in the first place?

I certainly wouldn't advocate not wearing a uniform at all, even though they're only required during specific circumstances (flying for one). If I was required to wear something more than a polo shirt, I'd probably consider it, depending on what's involved, cost, and so forth.

The minimum required uniform for Senior Members is the gray/whites or USAF-style blues per CAPM 39-1 so you are required to have something more than the polo shirt.  The polo combination is a utility uniform and is optional.
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etodd
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,131

« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2018, 04:01:19 PM »


The minimum required uniform for Senior Members is the gray/whites or USAF-style blues per CAPM 39-1 so you are required to have something more than the polo shirt.


Yep.  I own it as required.

Quote
  The polo combination is a utility uniform and is optional.

Has been listed as one of the UOD at every event I've ever attended, including tomorrow's event where I'll fly 8 sorties.

All is good.  All is by the book. :)

Some folks' problem isn't with me, and those like me .... its with the Regs. If there are certain uniforms you just can't stand, then take it up the chain and get the Regs changed. Until such time as that occurs ... you're fussing at the wrong people.  Look up higher in the chain. ;)
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MS - MO - AP - MP - FRO
PHall
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 6,083

« Reply #25 on: May 11, 2018, 09:35:14 PM »


The minimum required uniform for Senior Members is the gray/whites or USAF-style blues per CAPM 39-1 so you are required to have something more than the polo shirt.


Yep.  I own it as required.

Quote
  The polo combination is a utility uniform and is optional.

Has been listed as one of the UOD at every event I've ever attended, including tomorrow's event where I'll fly 8 sorties.

All is good.  All is by the book. :)

Some folks' problem isn't with me, and those like me .... its with the Regs. If there are certain uniforms you just can't stand, then take it up the chain and get the Regs changed. Until such time as that occurs ... you're fussing at the wrong people.  Look up higher in the chain. ;)

Well, when you signed that membership application you agreed to follow all the regulations, not just the ones you like.
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etodd
Salty & Seasoned Contributor

Posts: 1,131

« Reply #26 on: May 11, 2018, 10:57:08 PM »


Well, when you signed that membership application you agreed to follow all the regulations, not just the ones you like.

Did you not see where I said "all is by the book"?  I think you would be hard pressed to find me in violation of anything.
Go ahead ... try one. :)
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MS - MO - AP - MP - FRO
SarDragon
Global Moderator

Posts: 10,335
Unit: NAVAIRPAC

« Reply #27 on: May 11, 2018, 11:07:50 PM »

OK, I think we've worn this one out. I moved it in the first place because there was some residual benefit with regard to attention to detail. Since that even got off track ...
Click!
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Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret
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CAP Talk  |  Operations  |  Aviation & Flying Activities  |  Topic: Off-topic uniform rants
 


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