CPR Patch

[Shuman 14]

Not sure if these are any better but:

http://www.medpins.com/store/p/759-First-Aid-CPR-AED-Trained-Emblem-Pin.aspx

[Storm Chaser]

Not sure if these are any better but:

http://www.medpins.com/store/p/759-First-Aid-CPR-AED-Trained-Emblem-Pin.aspx

Those are not allowed. CAPM 39-1 clearly states that the patch must be awarded/authorized by the organization conducting the training (i.e. ARC, AHA, ASHI, etc.).

[Luis R. Ramos]

Shuman-

Also not allowed as they are pins, not cloth patches.

CAPM 39-1 allows patches on BDUs but does not authorize metal pins on the Blues. Go figure...

[Shuman 14]

I just Google searched and that's what came up. 

[THRAWN]

Shuman-

Also not allowed as they are pins, not cloth patches.

CAPM 39-1 allows patches on BDUs but does not authorize metal pins on the Blues. Go figure...

Time to get your peepers checked. Scroll down....

[BuckeyeDEJ]

I have to ask: Why do you need a patch for CPR training? Isn't it enough to have the myriad others that either require the training or imply it?

[lordmonar]

I have to ask: Why do you need a patch for CPR training? Isn't it enough to have the myriad others that either require the training or imply it?

Well....first....other the EMT badge....I can't think of any other badge that actually requires CPR training.

Second....I think this is a hold over from long ago when CPR was "new" and the ARC and AHA were trying to get as many people as possible qualified.    So CAP joined in by offering the wear of the patch...which is above and beyond any other ES requirements.

Having said that.....I too think it is something that CAP should drop.   We need to add the CPR requirement to our GT and UDF ratings....but I don't see a need for a patch.  But don't care one way or the other if someone chooses to wear it. 

[SarDragon]

CPR used to be required for GTM3, back when the split to GTM3, GTM2, and GTM1. That's why my qual expired back then, because I couldn't manage to find a convenient class.

[sardak]

Actually, there was never a requirement for ground team leaders, members or anyone else to have CPR. I've gone through all the ES regs back to 1983 and none mention CPR or any other resuscitation training (like mouth-to-mouth, arm-lift-chest pressure, etc.) being required or even recommended. I think that for a time, first aid courses just automatically included CPR training since it was new and potentially lifesaving. Once someone figured out that more money could be made by teaching CPR separately, it was. Wings may have made CPR an add-on requirement.

I think the other item that led to the belief that CPR was required was the format of the application for a 101 card (form 100). It had a space for the applicant to check off their level of first aid/medical training and expiration date, and a block for CPR with expiration date. The form only stated to attach a copy of the first aid certificate.

In 2004, the year that GTM was split into three, we also switched to SQTRs, so the form 100 was no longer required. That was also the year that advanced first aid was dropped from the GTL SQTR. GTLs weren't always required to have advanced first aid or equivalent.

Beginning in 1996 there was a requirement that all ground teams have two members trained in bloodborne pathogen protection. This became a task for GTLs to demonstrate the use of a protective suit. Now it's a GTM3 task to exercise universal precautions.

Mike

[Luis R. Ramos]

By Thrawn...

Quote from: Luis R. Ramos on July 17, 2014, 04:56:43 PM

    Shuman-

    Also not allowed as they are pins, not cloth patches.

    CAPM 39-1 allows patches on BDUs but does not authorize metal pins on the Blues. Go figure...

Time to get your peepers checked. Scroll down....

I re-read and scrolled down.

I think you read too fast and missed the connection. I was responding to a message about the CPR patch. Therefore my response was referring to wear of the CPR patch and CPR pin only. If I respond to a message about a CPR patch, I do not need to state the word "CPR." But apparently you need to see it...

So, CAPM 39-1 allows CPR patches on BDUs but does not authorize CPR metal pins on the Blues. Go figure...

Or copy where does CAPM 39-1 states that CPR pins can be worn on the Blues...

And also I stated that the American Heart association sold CPR pins but not CPR patches anymore...

[Jaison009]

As a nonpracticing Paramedic, I am quite honestly not sure why someone would want to wear a CPR patch or pin. Just about every GT member has CPR to go with the First Aid so it is nothing special.  Every nurse, doctor, EMT, Paramedic, etc wearing their insignia have it. If you wear a GT patch and are current, it is fairly obvious that you have probably taken first aid and CPR.  For those who wear it, it can make them liable for not acting if something goes wrong or they take no action. Additionally, this is not the boy scouts where we wear a patch for every single thing.

[Luis R. Ramos]

Not really.

I am an American Heart Association instructor.

The American Heart Association has the following classes:

BLS for the Healthcare Professional (no First Aid class, just CPR and AED for nurses and the like).

CPR/AED and First Aid (CPR, AED, and First Aid some places require all, others only CPR).

CPR/AED (no First Aid class, some places require only CPR such as child care, mall security workers).

For every five CPR AED classes the company I work people require only one CPR First Aid class.

The same format is taught by the National Safety Council. That is, their instructors can teach CPR/AED only, First Aid only (no CPR), and CPR/AED/First Aid. I am not aware of the ratio as I am not an NSC instructor.

I am not aware how the Red Cross conduct their First Aid and CPR classes at the time. However I was an ARC instructor ten years ago teaching for only four or five years. I could teach First Aid alone, CPR alone, or both together.

[Jaison009]

I am not sure if your reply post is to me or not but I work for the Red Cross in humanitarian- disaster services so I do not teach classes anymore; however, I taught for a few years in CPR and First Aid, CPR Pro, EMR, and Wilderness First Aid. We have a variety of CPR courses for lay rescuers and then CPR for Professional Rescuer. We also have emergency medical responder which is an OSHA version of the DOT first responder curriculum. I taught for the AHA for nearly 12 years. I taught BLS, HeartFacts, and some other courses. Every state requires nurses, EMTs, EMT-Is, Paramedics, and most physicians to recertify.  As part of the re-certification, CPR is required. To be honest even though ARC offers CPR for Professional Rescuers, nearly every medical provider recertifies through the BLS for HCP for AHA.

Not really.

I am an American Heart Association instructor.

The American Heart Association has the following classes:

BLS for the Healthcare Professional (no First Aid class, just CPR and AED for nurses and the like).

CPR/AED and First Aid (CPR, AED, and First Aid some places require all, others only CPR).

CPR/AED (no First Aid class, some places require only CPR such as child care, mall security workers).

For every five CPR AED classes the company I work people require only one CPR First Aid class.

The same format is taught by the National Safety Council. That is, their instructors can teach CPR/AED only, First Aid only (no CPR), and CPR/AED/First Aid. I am not aware of the ratio as I am not an NSC instructor.

I am not aware how the Red Cross conduct their First Aid and CPR classes at the time. However I was an ARC instructor ten years ago teaching for only four or five years. I could teach First Aid alone, CPR alone, or both together.

[Eclipse]

For those who wear it, it can make them liable for not acting if something goes wrong or they take no action.

A patch doesn't make you liable for anything, one way or another.

Additionally, this is not the boy scouts where we wear a patch for every single thing.

Cite pl.....((*snicker*))...plea...((*snort*))...((*sigh*))...

I can't even get it out...

[Luis R. Ramos]

Yes, the response was for you Jaison.

So the Red Cross is still as I was before. And like the AHA and NSC. Every state does require BLS for the Healthcare Provider (AHA) or a corresponding class CPR for Professional Rescuer (Red Cross).

The point is that CAP would be seen at most as a lay rescuer, when NHQ states that CAP is not a First Aid responder.

(I know I know I am not using the exact words, here is where DRUMROLL! twenty other readers will jump to correct me!)

Since NHQ does not mandate nor expect us to be a professional rescuer nor list us in the regulations as a First Aid provider, it does make those of us certified as Ground Team with CPR as something special by itself. More so when the only thing mandated by NHQ from ES personnel is First Aid and not CPR. It is this mandate that will make the majority of us take First Aid and not First Aid / CPR. The difference is about $35 for AHA classes: CPR / AED with First Aid = $80; CPR / AED alone or First Aid alone = $65.

Unless the unit can find a good deal...

[Luis R. Ramos]

Eclipse-

He is probably referring to public expectations but left some (most) out...

The reason why, when I worked at a volunteer ambulance service we were told not to wear our uniforms to / from our station, people see us with our EMT uniform, they have an emergency and would expect us to help without stopping to think 1) we were alone; 2) did not have equipment thus not able to treat much; 3) not on an ambulance so cannot transport injured / ill safely...

And the reason why I see School Safety Agents who in New York City are part of the New York City Police Department (although unarmed) when they go home they take off their uniforms. And probably why many, many policemen / policewomen take off their uniforms when going home: 1) they are alone; 2) did not have equipment thus not able to call or might have to arrest / fire / without backup; 3) not on a police car so cannot transport safely...

Thus the public see us with the CPR patch they expect us to act...

I think that is the leap or connection that Jaison is trying to make... or break... or not be made...

[RiverAux]

Thus the public see us with the CPR patch they expect us to act...

I'm not aware of any regulation that prevents a properly trained and certified CAP member from administering CPR to a member of the public in an emergency situation.  Granted it is still up to the CAP member to decide if they are willing to use this skill or not in any particular instance, but I suspect anyone proud enough of this skill to wear the patch would give it a try. 

The EMT patch is a little more problematical since from what I understand there are quite a number of EMT-level skills that the EMT probably isn't going to want to try to use outside the scope of the agency for which he is an EMT. 

[Luis R. Ramos]

River:

The sequence of events was like this:

Jaison posted a message re the CPR patch.

I answered.

Eclipse said something where he doubted the CPR patch making any expectations to perform.

I made the connection between Jaison and Eclipse's posting.

Now your response is as if I stated the liability.

You are right on your message about a properly trained and certified member but that training expires every two years, and if you are going to wear that patch you have to remove it when your training expires. You will find a large number of members will not remove it. So your point becomes moot. When their CPR expires they will not be properly trained or certified.

[sarmed1]

Many CPR cards say "recommended renewal date".... so in the spirit of may, will or shall that means that you may renew , but you may also perform CPR even if that date is in the past.  So "technically" speaking it doesnt expire.  This is theory most applies to "lay person" level cards.

Not that I agree mind you, personally I think every operations level person should be current certified in at least adult CPR/AED.

MK 

[Luis R. Ramos]

Are you a CPR instructor? Do you teach CPR classes, either BLS (Healthcare) or CPR (lay)?

I am.

The people I talk to when I start my classes I always ask them "why are you taking this class?"

Those that are renewing always say "my company said my card expired..."

And if you read New York State law it states and I paraphrase, that the card expires after 1 year in the case of working at a summer camp, but a different NY law states that healthcare has to renew it after two years. Not "recommended" as the card states but "required." I bet it is the same in other states.

Maybe you will feel comfortable that CAP personnel go with "recommended," ut I feel more comfortable with what the law says...