Comm Truck

[♠SARKID♠]

Our role in missions and what we bring to the table is decided by us.  If a group of members has the resources, time, and dedication to put together a functional asset that will allow them to play in a bigger game, more power to them.  To say that such an attempt is laughable shows nothing more than a lack of vision and drive.  Just like everything else in CAP, you get out what you put in.  And if a team puts in the effort to build such an asset and builds strong relationships with other agencies then they will be rewarded with many opportunities to put it to good use.  We're at the point that other agencies have started requesting to use our MCC because their assets are inadequate for their own needs.  Rescue826 wants to build something great and if he does it right he'll find himself with a high demand asset sitting comfortably in his back pocket.  People like this are the ones that will make CAP a bigger player in our operational world.  Thread after thread has been posted on this board about how to get more diverse missions, how to get "ins" with other agencies, and how to take CAP ES to the next level.  This is one of the ways we'll do it.

[caphornbuckle]

First off , it wont be a motorhome, but a professionally build mobile command post.

Each radio is connected to a dispatch console.  Each operator has a headset, and can select what they  can hear , and transmit on.  So no loud noise. 

Again, Im not talking about a make shift home build truck, but a real professional Command post.


In the past 10 years or so in my CAP Comm 'career' I would say 80% of the many high scale missions the Wing has completed has involved us communicating with another agency via radio.

We have had a REGULAR need to talk to various agencies on UHF,VHF-Low, VHF-Hi, 800, and Airband.

In no way would this be overkill, or ridiculous.  It would open the door to CAP to have a little more credibility, Look like the professionals, and talk to them.
It would also give CAP a facility to work out of in a disaster, instead of a run down hangar or tent.
The vehicle would also provide voice, Data, and radio comms to any facility to augment during any CAP mission.

And if it all of that is what you need to perform the mission, then get it.  Just don't add anything to it unless you find you do need it.  Allow access areas where you can add needed items as time/technology moves forward.

Sorry, guess the "motor home" should have been quoted.  Not everyone knows that they are specially built so they assume it's just a modified motor home.  I was speaking about how those not familiar with them (like kids).

[Eclipse]

That's OK - I'll say it. "specially built" is even more ridiculous than an RV.  At least most RV's can be driven without a CDL.

This misses the entire point of the "minuteman" idea of CAP  using existing personal resources and volunteer time as a force multiplier for
professional agencies and the military.

No agency cares about what the resources look like if they get the job done.  The desire to have these "ego-mobiles" is all about shiny, unnecessary toys that generally become liabilities and hanger queens.

[caphornbuckle]

This misses the entire point of the "minuteman" idea of CAP  using existing personal resources and volunteer time as a force multiplier for professional agencies and the military.

Considering the time it would take to set up a command post in a tent or hangar and then begin operating out of it versus a Mobile Command Post that is already fully functional within a couple of minutes of arrival, I think that would make things faster and would advance the "minuteman" idea of CAP.  But as I said before, that's ONLY if it's USED.

As for existing personal resources, I don't know how your units operate but the only personal resources I used was my field gear.  The rest (comm, vehicles, aircraft) have been existing CAP resources.  A Mobile Command Post would become an existing CAP resource once purchased.

[Rescue826]

That's OK - I'll say it. "specially built" is even more ridiculous than an RV.  At least most RV's can be driven without a CDL.

No agency cares about what the resources look like if they get the job done. 

I beg to differ.  When CAP showes up and we look like this:


or this


That really dosent make us look any better than Ham radio operators (Nothing Wrong With Hams).  We are supposed to execute at a higher level, not like a bunch of amateurs that just cobbled together a bunch of radios in a wooden box. 


So all Mobile command posts are "Ego-Mobiles'??


how is a mobile platform with comm gear unnecessary?  I think I illustrated several replys ago that its not going to be a "hangar queen".

I think Florida Wings has more missions in a week than most wings have in a year!  With a high operational tempo, a need for interoperable comms, and a mobile 'office'  I think it is absolutely necessary.

[Jerry Jacobs]

That's OK - I'll say it. "specially built" is even more ridiculous than an RV.  At least most RV's can be driven without a CDL.

This misses the entire point of the "minuteman" idea of CAP  using existing personal resources and volunteer time as a force multiplier for
professional agencies and the military.

No agency cares about what the resources look like if they get the job done.  The desire to have these "ego-mobiles" is all about shiny, unnecessary toys that generally become liabilities and hanger queens.

CAP being minutemen? In CAWG it often takes us 2 hours to get the people for a competent ground team together.

[Eclipse]

CAP being minutemen? In CAWG it often takes us 2 hours to get the people for a competent ground team together.

Two whole hours to spin up volunteers who aren't even really "on call" or expecting activity?  Sounds pretty good to me.

[a2capt]

It might take longer now that those who only have the AF style uniforms can't go on missions.

...but at least the Comm Truck wouldn't be included in that.

... let them discuss the Comm Truck here, look for a thread on response time and/or crew motivation if you want to discuss response time.

[wuzafuzz]

... let them discuss the Comm Truck here, look for a thread on response time and/or crew motivation if you want to discuss response time.

Interestingly enough, a properly equipped and maintained comm truck or trailer will permit much faster response time for setting up a mission base.  Less wear and tear on communications gadgets too. 

In my neck of the woods we have to grab all the toys from a cache and hope we didn't miss anything.  If we are lucky none of the gadgets are checked out.  Load it all in one or two cars, go to whatever facility we've borrowed for the mission, evaluate where and how to set things up, then set it all up as best we can in what almost always winds up being less than acceptable working conditions.  This process is slow, inefficient, and is part of the typical MRO/CUL "abuse" on missions or SAREX's.  No one gives a darn how crappy the setup is, just make it work or we will whine and complain.

With a comm truck or trailer you simply drive or tow it, park it, and turn the radios on.  Critical supplies aren't missing because they are bolted in.  Little to no setup time needed.

[Jerry Jacobs]

Instead of creating a small number of large MCP's  and spreading them all over the place, It would be much more beneficial to create a larger number of small MCP's like what could be fit into the back of one of our vans with some seats removed or an SUV. The ideal setup would be one mobile VHF and HF radio set in the front of the van. In the back there would be a large white board with a stand along with 5 handheld VHF radios on a charger with a spare battery for each one.  ALong with some basic ICS forms, we could go on and on but what I have put down is a very realistic list.

And for all the History buffs

[arajca]

I am currently writing specs for one, so I have avoided commenting in this thread previously.

As the issue is considered, remember, the communications Table of Allowances is based on the large scale incident, not the small, typical incident. Trying to run an incident with more than two or three aicraft/ground teams out of a van or suv doesn't work. There is a reason the TA includes such things as Incident Command Posts and Staging Bases. That being said,  the TA also includes the following equipment for a Mobile ICP Package:
HF-ALE Base
HF-ALE Mobile
VHF-FM Base (2)
VHF-FM Mobile (1)
VHF-AM Base
Mobile Repeater
ISR (5)
Telescopic Mast (2)
2500Amp Generator (2)

Believe it or not, National and the AF understand that not all of our incidents can be run from a fixed base and occasionally, a operating base must be set in the field. A good example would be at a major incident when CAP is one of many supporting agencies. A van with two people or an suv with one person standing at the back doesn't cut it.

Here is what the TA says about Mobile ICPs:

Mobile ICP: One mobile ICP to every 2 fixed ICPs. Mobile communications resources can provide support to a transportable ICP; they can serve as primary communications node for a fixed ICP in a communications stressed environment; or they can serve as deployed communications relay nodes from an ICP into a distant mission area. Minimum allotment of one per wing. Note: The Communications TA supports only the radio equipment necessary for a Mobile ICP. See the Transportation TA for vehicle support.

Each wing is authorized at least one. Most wings are authorized more. For example, COWG is authorized four.

Another point - most mobile communications units do not provide long haul radio (HF). Instead, they rely on cell phones and othr commerical infrastructure, which is something CAP is trying to avoid. Hence the resurrection of HF in CAP.

[Al Sayre]

Never mind, some one beat me to it...

[Rescue826]

Our current Comm Trailer is a 16 foot tandem axle converted Cargo Trailer.  We used a modular concept for all the gear.  we have 3 portable rack cases that bolt to the countertop.  That way if the trailer is inoperable you can unclip the cases and put them in a van or truck.

Images is from 2006 ish when we  were building the trailer





I will find a new picture of the trailer that is current.  The above pic is  in the middle of the construction process.   For 5k to build it, I think we did good.

[N Harmon]

We have 3 portable rack cases that bolt to the countertop.  That way if the trailer is inoperable you can unclip the cases and put them in a van or truck.

I can't say I'm a big fan of that arrangement. It seems like multiple radio operators would be on top of each other trying to operate them.

I much prefer this type of setup, and have mimicked it for our squadron communications room:

[FCCSmattskinner]

For OK Wing, we keep it simple. We use a donated FEMA trailer (basic trailer and bumper pulled) and a EFJ VHF base transceiver and a couple EFJ bricks (for monitoring different channels). We can talk to base ops, ground and air. Coax runs outside to a portable tripod mast with a 1/4 wave vertical antenna. Works for all of our SAREX's and FTX's. This simple setup meets the communication demands very well.

[jeders]

Our current Comm Trailer is a 16 foot tandem axle converted Cargo Trailer.  We used a modular concept for all the gear.  we have 3 portable rack cases that bolt to the countertop.  That way if the trailer is inoperable you can unclip the cases and put them in a van or truck.

Images is from 2006 ish when we  were building the trailer

We have 3 portable rack cases that bolt to the countertop.  That way if the trailer is inoperable you can unclip the cases and put them in a van or truck.

I can't say I'm a big fan of that arrangement. It seems like multiple radio operators would be on top of each other trying to operate them.

I much prefer this type of setup, and have mimicked it for our squadron communications room:

Maybe I'm not seeing it, but these seem to be pretty much the same set-up. Three people in a row with a foot or two between them talking on the radio. Other than a few fancier toys, how is Harmon's better than Rescue's?

[N Harmon]

Maybe I'm not seeing it, but these seem to be pretty much the same set-up. Three people in a row with a foot or two between them talking on the radio. Other than a few fancier toys, how is Harmon's better than Rescue's?

The radios aren't grouped together in a single box, but spread out among the operators.

[jeders]

Maybe I'm not seeing it, but these seem to be pretty much the same set-up. Three people in a row with a foot or two between them talking on the radio. Other than a few fancier toys, how is Harmon's better than Rescue's?

The radios aren't grouped together in a single box, but spread out among the operators.

Rescue's has three boxes, not one. Each box has a group of radios for the operator to use. At least that's what it looks like to me.

[vento]

I see strength and weakness with both approach. Rescue's setup is more portable and easier when operated by only one or two comm guy (when we have limited number of radio operators). Harmon's spread approach is much better when multiple comm guys can man the stations and each attending just one or two frequencies.

[Rescue826]

All the radios in the racks have a 4 wire 'Remote' that allows each radio to be used simply by connecting up to 2000' of CAT5 cable to the back of the rack then to the remote.  This way the comm trailer can be setup, and if OPS, or any other unit  needs a radio you dont have to setup another antenna, ground it ect.   you just run a remote.

Each position in the trailer also have a 'mini console' were they can select what radio(s)  they listen to and transmit on.   So it dosent matter were the rack is.  everyone in the trailer can talk on everything.