2009 NYWG Leadership Encampment

[BTCS1 C/CC]

Post any questions you may have about this years NYW Leadership Encampment.

[MIKE]

Is this an actual "Encampment" per CAPR 52-16.... Or some other wing level activity that does not actually qualify as an encampment by definition?  Like more of a wing level RCLS?

[BTCS1*]

It is an actual encampment, NYWG's '09 encampment is a ''leadership encampment '' I guess as opposed to an ES encampment.

[Ozzy]

Can you change the title to then read "NYWG Leadership Encampment 2009" then? Some people may just get confused.

And yes NYWG Leadership Encampment does complete all of CAPR 52-16 requirements and then some. Unlike some other encampments that are heavily involved with doing Helicopter rides, shooting, and a bunch of other similar activites, NYWG usually exceeds the normal requirements for Aero education, CPFT, and everything else required, while providing plenty of time to develop not only the inflight's leadership but the staff as well. One thing the previous encampment commander has said, was that as much as encampment is for the inflights, they're there to fulfill the Mitchell requirements while the staff is there to build and grow as leaders. It's almost completely cadet run (Although obviously it can't be completely run by them) with cadets serving everywhere from flight sergeants, commanders, squadron commanders, and first sergeants, to Logistics, PAO, Mess Ops, Training, SET, Flight Ops, Comms, Med and the cadet command staff. Senior members do serve in each of those capacities as Mentors, but for the most part, the cadets take all of the pictures, fill out all of the paperwork, help cook the food, and teach most of the classes and everything else that needs to get done.

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BTW, why do you have two accounts?

[BTCS1*]

I dont, theres me: BTCS1* and my good friend (and C/CC) whos just BTCS1. Confusing, i know. When I first saw one of his posts I was like, I didnt post this? WTF. LMAO

[Rotorhead]

Can you change the title to then read "NYWG Leadership Encampment 2009" then? Some people may just get confused.

And yes NYWG Leadership Encampment does complete all of CAPR 52-16 requirements and then some. Unlike some other encampments that are heavily involved with doing Helicopter rides, shooting, and a bunch of other similar activites, NYWG usually exceeds the normal requirements for Aero education, CPFT, and everything else required, while providing plenty of time to develop not only the inflight's leadership but the staff as well. One thing the previous encampment commander has said, was that as much as encampment is for the inflights, they're there to fulfill the Mitchell requirements while the staff is there to build and grow as leaders. It's almost completely cadet run (Although obviously it can't be completely run by them) with cadets serving everywhere from flight sergeants, commanders, squadron commanders, and first sergeants, to Logistics, PAO, Mess Ops, Training, SET, Flight Ops, Comms, Med and the cadet command staff. Senior members do serve in each of those capacities as Mentors, but for the most part, the cadets take all of the pictures, fill out all of the paperwork, help cook the food, and teach most of the classes and everything else that needs to get done.

Which is how many, if not most, other Wing's Encampments are run, and with much the same content.

Calling it a "Leadership" Encampment doesn't imply anything different or special about it.

[MIKE]

IMO... It's misleading.  If it's the NYWG Encampment, call it that... instead of Leadership, ES, Model Rocketry, whatever.

[dwb]

The term "NYWG Leadership Encampment" was originally used when there was also a "NYWG Emergency Services Encampment".  This was important in 1994, when there was a leadership-focused encampment at Fort Drum, and an ES-focused encampment at Camp Smith.

Prior to that, there was also a leadership-focused encampment at Plattsburgh that overlapped the Camp Smith ES encampment (actually, Plattsburgh preceded Smith, but that's not important).

Yes, it's a legacy term, now that there is only one encampment in the Wing.  But it still gets used, and it's not really a big deal.

[BTCS1*]

Wish they brought back ES encampment in NYWG

[dwb]

Wish they brought back ES encampment in NYWG

Getting enough senior members to support two encampments would be a chore.  We already have to do recruiting every year to get enough seniors to support the one encampment.

Also, CAP's role in ES has evolved since the last time we held an ES encampment.  New York State doesn't come to CAP to go trouncing through the woods with ground teams like it did in the '80s and earlier.  Furthermore, NESA has evolved to be quite a bit more comprehensive than it used to be, so cadets/seniors that are really in to the ground ops have a place to go that they didn't used to have.

If we can only muster the resources for one encampment every year, it makes sense for that encampment to focus on more universal cadet programs themes, rather than on a mission that is optional for cadets.

[Ozzy]

If you want to do some hardcore ES classes around New York, go to LIGSAR. It's a fairly good Emergency Services academy that'll give you more skills then you'll ever need on Long Island or New York. Last year's academy I heard we had people from two other states attend and a couple from upstate groups.

Anyways It would be nice if we could add more cadet staff and inflights to the encampment but we'd need to find a bigger place to hold us  Right now it's maxed at ~125 inflights and ~55 cadet staff plus a decent size senior staff.

[BTCS1*]

Im gonna try to. But the scheduling may not work for me.

[jimmydeanno]

Anyways It would be nice if we could add more cadet staff and inflights to the encampment but we'd need to find a bigger place to hold us  Right now it's maxed at ~125 inflights and ~55 cadet staff plus a decent size senior staff.

You guys have a ~2:1 student/teacher ratio?  That's insane.  Sounds to me that you could drop about 30 of those cadet staff off and allow more basic cadets...

[Ozzy]

Actually most of the cadet staff don't teach the inflights. There are 20 cadets on "Line Staff' (Flt Sgt, 1st Sgt, FC, and SC), 4 on the SET team, 5~6 on Training, 4 on Command Staff (CC, DCC, XO, Group 1st Sgt), and the rest on Exec Staff. Each flight is about 16~17 inflights. From the past years that I went, the classes were usually 1 : 30~ in a class room setting, to 1 : 15~ in a lab setting. I just checked the website and there are exactly 50 cadet staff, 128 inflights, and 63 senior staff (Both full-time and part-time)

[Eclipse]

What does "exec staff" do?  Normally the CC, CD, XO, & 1st Shirt are the "exec staff".

Between cadets and seniors you have 125 basic cadets (inflights?), and 118 staff. 

With that many staff, you don't need a chain of command, you can just stand a staffer next to a basic and tell them what to do.   

[Ozzy]

Well NY has several different "Staffs". Command staff as said before is the CC, DCC, XO, & Group 1sgt. Line Staff is Flight Sgt, Flight Commander, Squadron 1sgt, and Squadron Commander. Training and SET staff, are just that, the SET team and Training. And Exec staff is everything said before. Cadets on exec staff basically run everything except for a few certain things. Cadets on Admin do most of the paperwork, Cadets on PAO take the pictures, make to daily "news letter", and make the year book. Logistics is in charge of doing vehicle inspections, doing Wallmart runs, and everything else logistics normally does, while Comms is in charge of the radios, comms briefings, and such. We do have cadets on Flight Ops, which plans the O-flights, C-130 and works with the Flight academy, Service Ops (aka Mess Ops) is in charge of the Dining Facility, Kp duties, cooking/serving food, and finally Med is in charge of taking care of any injuries of the cadets.

From my understanding, it's been like this for years and it has worked perfectly to build leadership in everyone. Rarely do cadets that have been to previous NYWG encampments get the same job as before, or sometimes close to what they did. I was a flight commander last year and applied for SET, Squadron Commander, and DCC. I didn't get anything close to what I wanted. I actually got the thing that was last on what I wanted to get: Mess Ops OIC. But something is better then nothing (Over 80 applicants for staff and <50 selected), and the lesson is already beginning to be learned; Sometimes in life you need to take what you get and do your best, so that next time, They'll see that you did what was needed to be done and not complained, and put you in a better spot (Like Cadet Commander  )

[Rotorhead]

the lesson is already beginning to be learned; Sometimes in life you need to take what you get and do your best, so that next time, They'll see that you did what was needed to be done and not complained, and put you in a better spot (Like Cadet Commander  )

Another good lesson is that support positions like Mess Ops are vitally important and that without those people doing the job right, the Cadet Commander would go hungry.

It's pretty insulting for you to refer to CC as "better" but then go and eat three meals a day in a mess run by the "lesser" officer.

There are no small jobs, only small officers.

[BTCS1*]

I think by better he meant preffered.

[Ozzy]

Oh I didn't mean it in that way. What I meant was that Mess Ops isn't one of those jobs that most cadet wants to do (As compared to Flight Commander/Sergeant, 1st Sgt, SET). And yes I know that Mess Ops is extremely important to encampment. And yes once again, I plan to learn all I could as Mess Ops OIC this year.