Awards not in 39-1 6-5

[Abn90]

I did not find the US Army parachutist badge (jump wings) listed in CAPM 39-1, Chapter 6-B, Table 6-5 even though the table does show the air assault & pathfinder badges (4) and the parachute rigger badge (5).

Does anyone know if the jump wings are authorized for senior members on the USAF-style uniform?

[James Shaw]

I believe that if you have been duly awarded or have earned them you should be able to wear them. You have to have proof though.

[SarDragon]

Is wear allowed on regular AF uniforms?

[JohnKachenmeister]

Yes

[JohnKachenmeister]

39-1 needs work.  The Army Combat Infantry Badge and Combat Medical Badge are both authorized, but the Combat Action Badge is not listed.

Why don't you add this under the thread worked elsewhere on this board about ambiguities in 39-1?

[Abn90]

I believe that if you have been duly awarded or have earned them you should be able to wear them. You have to have proof though.

Would the DD-214 count as proof?

[Abn90]

Is wear allowed on regular AF uniforms?

It's been a few years, but some Air Force PJ's I knew wore them.

[PhoenixRisen]

Would the DD-214 count as proof?

That's what every former military person in my squadron (my father included) used to prove their awards for wear on the uniform.  It's an official document, and it's got 'em listed.  Why wouldn't it count?

FYI - I know of many a person within CAWG who wear jump wings on their CAP uniforms (one of said people is currently in the Air Force).

[SJFedor]

39-1 needs work.  The Army Combat Infantry Badge and Combat Medical Badge are both authorized, but the Combat Action Badge is not listed.

Why don't you add this under the thread worked elsewhere on this board about ambiguities in 39-1?

CAB is a recent invention of the Army. I believe it just came to being in the past year or two. 39-1 needs revision every 6 months, if not from our changes, from the other services' changes.

[SarDragon]

Is wear allowed on regular AF uniforms?

Yes

Then according to the knowledge that I have, it is allowed on the CAP uniform.

YMMV.

[Fifinella]

Can you wear Army badges on USAF or CAP uniforms?  Yes.  See:

CAPM 39-1 Section B 6-7. US Military Badges.  CAP members may wear only the US military badges authorized for wear on the US Air Force uniform when earned through qualification and awarded by competent authority for service performed in any branch of the Armed Forces of the United States or its allies.  The military badges authorized for wear on the CAP uniform and BDU are listed in Table 6-5.  Before wearing any badge not listed in this table, contact National Headquarters/LMM for clarification.  US Military badges are not authorized for wear on any of the CAP distinctive uniforms.

http://level2.cap.gov/documents/M39_1_chap_6_sec_B.pdf

In my opinion, where the confusion comes in about jump wings is (IMO) when the CAPM was written, I believe someone assumed jump wings were included in the "US military aeronautical badges" category.  However, USAF regs clearly state they are not in this category.  (Why?  Beats me.  Someone must have been jealous.  ) 

I agree, this needs to be addressed in the re-write, and the Table amended to specifically include parachutist badges.

Meantime, I wear mine, and if anyone has a problem with that, they can come and get them.  "Molon Lave"

"Molon lave" (Μολών λαβέ, Come and take them) is found in Plutarch's Apophthegmata Laconica.
Πάλιν δε του Ξέρξου γράψαντος "πέμψον τα όπλα", αντέγραψε "μολών λαβέ".

....In ancient Greece, the Spartan General Leonidas was charged with guarding a mountain pass with just 300 men to delay the invading million man Persian army. When the Persian leader Xerxes offered to spare his men if they gave up their arms, Leonidas replied "Molon Lave", or "Come and get them."...

[brasda91]

They were listed in the previous edition.  It may have been an honest mistake.

[Gunner C]

IMO a major problem in the 39-1 is the lack of an order of precedence for badges.  There is a "hint" of one, but it's not accurate and flies in the face of military tradition.  For instance, the CIB is regarded as the highest military badge (excepting chaplain stuff) but the 39-1 hints that it is worn below aviation badges.  That would also hint that it is worn below jump wings not to mention CAP wings.  This is why most former military with a CIB/CMB don't wear theirs - it's rather silly to think that a private pilot's experience trumps close combat with an opposing armed military force.

What's the rationale behind the CIB being the highest?  The entire military (minus the strategic forces) is built around the infantryman engaging the enemy, gaining and holding ground. 

GC

[TankerT]

In my opinion, where the confusion comes in about jump wings is (IMO) when the CAPM was written, I believe someone assumed jump wings were included in the "US military aeronautical badges" category.  However, USAF regs clearly state they are not in this category.  (Why?  Beats me.  Someone must have been jealous.  ) 

Actually, up until recently a few years ago, several AFIs classified the parachutist badge as an aeronautical badge.  The AFIs then followed up by stating that while the parachutist badge was an aeronautical badge, the personnel were not considered aeronautically "rated" or something of the like. 

Over the last few years, this has been changed to eliminate all references to the badge as one in the aeronautical classification.  (In fact, they went so far as to specifically mention in some AFIs that it is NOT classified as one.)

[JayT]

IMO a major problem in the 39-1 is the lack of an order of precedence for badges.  There is a "hint" of one, but it's not accurate and flies in the face of military tradition.  For instance, the CIB is regarded as the highest military badge (excepting chaplain stuff) but the 39-1 hints that it is worn below aviation badges.  That would also hint that it is worn below jump wings not to mention CAP wings.  This is why most former military with a CIB/CMB don't wear theirs - it's rather silly to think that a private pilot's experience trumps close combat with an opposing armed military force.

What's the rationale behind the CIB being the highest?  The entire military (minus the strategic forces) is built around the infantryman engaging the enemy, gaining and holding ground. 

GC

Well, that's because aviation badges trump everything except chaplain stuff. That's a carry over from the same USAF traditions and order of precedence.

I'm sure that when the Air Force and CAP got together to adopt the AF D&A manual, they didn't think about excluding the CIB, CAB, and CMB. After all, how many Airmen have any of the above?

[TankerT]

IMO a major problem in the 39-1 is the lack of an order of precedence for badges.  There is a "hint" of one, but it's not accurate and flies in the face of military tradition.  For instance, the CIB is regarded as the highest military badge (excepting chaplain stuff) but the 39-1 hints that it is worn below aviation badges.  That would also hint that it is worn below jump wings not to mention CAP wings.  This is why most former military with a CIB/CMB don't wear theirs - it's rather silly to think that a private pilot's experience trumps close combat with an opposing armed military force.

What's the rationale behind the CIB being the highest?  The entire military (minus the strategic forces) is built around the infantryman engaging the enemy, gaining and holding ground. 

GC

The CIB has precedence for the Army, and Army only over all other sill badges.  (Except chaplain.)

You are referring to an Army philosophy of combat operations.  In the Army, many of their docterines do focus on the infantry holding ground.   (Thus they have the CIB as a Category/Group 1 badge, which takes precedence over the Category/Group 3 badges, which contain the aviation related.)

Other services do not award a CIB.  The Air Force allows it's wear, but it views (for obvious reasons) that aviation related badges are of higher precedence.

Thus, following the USAF traditions, as we often do, aviation badges take precedence over the CIB. 

And, FYI - the entire military is not built around the infantryman engaging the enemy, gaining and holding ground.  History (even recent times) shows that we have had many wars fought where land warfare was irrelevant.

[DNall]

I believe that if you have been duly awarded or have earned them you should be able to wear them. You have to have proof though.

uhh, no! It's only mil badges/decs/etc that are currently auth on the AF uniform by AF reg.

There's a couple dif interpretations that can be used & it's case by case (meaning badges, not indivs) at NHQ. That concerns the AF reg statement of can wear certain army badges/patches when attached & on perm duty with Army units. That is indeed a circumstance where a CIB would be authorized on an AF uniform, but the CAP member in their CAP status is not attached or on perm duty with an Army unit. Likewise, the AF fire protection & SF badges are not auth in CAP because the member is not in their CAP status serving in those capacities. This issue needs clarification from AF, but CAP isn't pushing for it cause the inevitable would cause a lot of people to remove badges they otherwise earned & are rightfully proud of.

Jump wings ARE authorized. They are not listed there because they are not another service badge (like a CIB for instance). They are also awarded in the AF under a dif name, so are considered an AF badge.

[JohnKachenmeister]

39-1 needs work.  The Army Combat Infantry Badge and Combat Medical Badge are both authorized, but the Combat Action Badge is not listed.

Why don't you add this under the thread worked elsewhere on this board about ambiguities in 39-1?

CAB is a recent invention of the Army. I believe it just came to being in the past year or two. 39-1 needs revision every 6 months, if not from our changes, from the other services' changes.

It has been around longer than that.  I think it was authorized shortly after the First Guf War.

[mikeylikey]

I think I read that badges from other services (specifically the Army) are not allowed to be worn on the new ABU's? 

Hope thats not true.

[JayT]

39-1 needs work.  The Army Combat Infantry Badge and Combat Medical Badge are both authorized, but the Combat Action Badge is not listed.

Why don't you add this under the thread worked elsewhere on this board about ambiguities in 39-1?

CAB is a recent invention of the Army. I believe it just came to being in the past year or two. 39-1 needs revision every 6 months, if not from our changes, from the other services' changes.

It has been around longer than that.  I think it was authorized shortly after the First Guf War.

May 2, 2005, first awarded June 29, 2005.