Customs/courteousies and the State Guard

[Hawk200]

A curiousity question for everyone. Got my own personal opininon on the matter, but was wondering what other folks might think.

Should CAP officers salute State Guard, State Defense Force, or State Militia officers?

Please note that I'm not talking about National Guard officers, I know where they stand.

[Major Carrales]

Hawk,

I don't know where you will stand on this, but I don't think it is out of line to even salute fire and law enforcement out of respect for the job they do.  It is along those lines that I was told by Active Duty folks that they choose to salute CAP Officers.  It is a modus of respect to what we do.

Don't know if that contributes...but that is my story and I'm stickin' to it. 

[Short Field]

Salutes are free - and we don't run out of them.   

[RiverAux]

I would salute SDF officers and would hope they would show the courtesy of returning it.  Like with other RealMilitary forces I wouldn't expect their folks to initiate a salute to CAP, but if they did, it should be properly returned.

I probably wouldn't salute firemen and police officers since in general that isn't part of their "culture" and would put them in the position of "do I return it or not" and if they've never been taught to salute might end up being embarrassed about doing it.

[RiverAux]

One could make the case (though a very weak case) that saluting SDF officers is required.  From CAPP-151 requires CAP members to salute "commissioned officers and warrant officers of the Armed Forces." 

The pamphlet does not actually define "Armed Forces" so there is some wiggle room to play with.   Federal law pretty strictly defines Armed Forces and SDFs are definetely not included in that definition and you could make an argument that a salute to them is not required.  However, as part of the organized militia of the states that have them, you could assume that "Armed Forces" meant anybody's armed forces and stretch "Armed Forces" to include them and come to the conclusion that a salute would be required.

If you stretched Armed Forces that far, would we also need to stretch it further to include a requirement to salute officers from Armed Forces of other countries?

Of course if you want to play this definition game, you could just as easily say that since "Armed Forces" wasn't defined that if an AF officer didn't have a weapon he wasn't part of the "Armed Forces" and a salute wouldn't be required.

Just a reminder, I'm not really arguing that saluting SDFs is required (I think they meant Armed Forces as defined by federal law), just pointing out that it wouldn't be hard to come to that conclusion.

[SDF_Specialist]

I don't see where it would be inappropriate to salute them. They have the same purpose as any other military branch. Protect and serve their country.

[Dad2-4]

I don't see where it would be inappropriate to salute them. They have the same purpose as any other military branch. Protect and serve their country.

+1

[mikeylikey]

Does it matter??  Salute them and drive on.  Big deal.  Now if you want them to salute you......perhaps we are just "salute crazy". 

[Stonewall]

Heck, I was in my AF uniforma and saluted a State Guard officer. 

I remember when I was a cadet NCO in CAP and marching in the MLK Jr. parade when I saw a Marine Corps JROTC cadet officer and saluted.  For some reason, I thought it was cool.

[AlphaSigOU]

And if you happen to recognize an officer of the armed services of a friendly foreign country, pop one off! Not that we see 'em that often in this neck o' the woods...

Brits got pips, crowns or stripes if you're dealing with the Army, Navy or Air Force.

Canadian officers wear stripes regardless of service.

The Mexicans... well here's a Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_ranks_and_insignia_of_Mexico

[Fireball]

      As a former NC State Defense Militia officer, I would render / return the salute without a second thought. As I recall back in my NCSDM days, we were strongly encouraged to salute CAP officers if we encountered them. I don't remember a SDF reg on it, but it probably came about because a lot of the NCSDM leadership were in or had been in CAP. After the NCSDM was disbanded, a lot of us joined CAP.

[KFreeman]

State Guard officers are commissioned by their respective state government's Military Department.

CAP officers are not commissioned.

I serve in ALSDF and ALWG CAP as a LTC (LtCol) in each organization. I hold both in high esteem and would be offended if the courtesy of a salute was not rendered/returned by either.

One salutes the uniform, not the person. I do not view it as a matter of opinion.

Regards,
Ken

[JohnKachenmeister]

And if you happen to recognize an officer of the armed services of a friendly foreign country, pop one off! Not that we see 'em that often in this neck o' the woods...

Brits got pips, crowns or stripes if you're dealing with the Army, Navy or Air Force.

Canadian officers wear stripes regardless of service.

The Mexicans... well here's a Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_ranks_and_insignia_of_Mexico

Mexico is "Friendly?"

[AlphaSigOU]

Mexico is "Friendly?"

Last I checked, we're not at war with 'em...  unless ya count the invasion of illegals!

[mikeylikey]

Mexico is "Friendly?"

Last I checked, we're not at war with 'em...  unless ya count the invasion of illegals!

What is an illegal?  hahahahhahahah

Seriously, what is the consensus......should CAP members salute SDF Officers.  My vote, YES.  They still have that piece of paper from a Governor.

[Tubacap]

When in doubt.... whip it out.  Of course, there is no harm here, and it can only build bridges for mutual respect between the organizations.  It also doesn't hurt our senior membership to exercise their right arms some more.

[Flying Pig]

by River Aux
I probably wouldn't salute firemen and police officers since in general that isn't part of their "culture" and would put them in the position of "do I return it or not" and if they've never been taught to salute might end up being embarrassed about doing it.

Id agree.  The only time Ive ever saluted as a cop is at a funeral during taps.   We as a culutre dont salute each other.  It wouldnt be inappropriate by any means, but most cops really wouldnt know how to respond.   You going to catch the guy/gal off guard and you going to have passed each other by the time they realize what you just did.   Then the next day in briefing hes going to tell everyone how this dude in a blue uniform saluted him.
A simple sincere greeting goes a long way.

As far as the SDF or Coast Guard Aux.....if they are wearing a military style uniform with a US military officer rank structure I say why not salute.  We probably have an idea what eachother are.  If a foreign military officer is in the US they almost always wear the US equivalant rank on their uniform in an obvious place.  Ive never met a foreign military member who expected you to know what they were.

[Grumpy]

What is an illegal?  hahahahhahahah

A sick bird?

[mikeylikey]

^

[Hawk200]

For the most part I was looking for whether or not it's required. The general concensus doesn't really seem to be that it is required, but that it won't hurt to do so.

I was curious as to whether or not people felt it was. I'm thinking that it pretty much falls under the "Why not?" category.

I'm not going to lock the voting at this time, I'd still like to see a few more people weight in. I think a total of a hundred votes would give me an excellent overall sampling.