CAP receipient of the Air Force Organizational Excellence Award.

Started by Chappie, September 20, 2016, 04:46:37 PM

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RRLE

Quote from: Eclipse on September 21, 2016, 05:36:27 PMAnd there isn't - the CGAux has no "corporate component" per se.  The Association is more akin to a complicated booster club with input.  It's a funding mechanism, not a part of the CGAux.

The original reason the AuxAssInc was formed was to hold the copyrights to the Aux's Public Ed (PE) materials. Since the USCGAux is a government organization it cannot copyright its publications nor stop anyone from copying them for free. So the Commandant of the USCG authorized the USCGAux to create the AuxAssInc to hold the copyrights, trademarks etc. That does tie to fund-raising since PE is one of the three largest sources of revenue for the USCGAux.

Since CAP already is a private corporation, it didn't need a separate body to own its copyrights.

kwe1009

Quote from: Капитан Хаткевич on September 21, 2016, 11:08:33 PM
Quote from: shuman14 on September 21, 2016, 08:58:17 PM
QuoteWhich would be stupid. 

Stupid how? That's how unit awards work, every Joe and Jane in the unit during the qualifying period of the award gets a ribbon to wear on their uniform.

Did a lot, did a little, did nothing at all, everyone gets the ribbon.

Because literally the whole organization would get it. Not a unit. If everyone has it, no one has it.

It happens in the USAF.  If the 1st Air Force received a unit/organization award then every military member who was assigned to that unit for at least one day during the award period gets the ribbon.  I have organizational awards that I received and I was in a unit about 5 or 6 levels down from the HQ.  It just depends on how the award was written and the scope of recipients.

Майор Хаткевич


PHall


lordmonar

Quote from: RiverAux on September 21, 2016, 09:38:50 PM
Is there still that discrepancy between the CAP uniform and award regs where one says that you can wear US awards authorized by a competent authority and the other one says that they must have been earned while in service?
Easy to fix.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

lordmonar

Quote from: coudano on September 21, 2016, 11:46:31 PM
So 18 year old cadet snuffy earns the AFOEA via being in CAP during the time of the cite.
He goes and enlists in the USAF.

Does he walk in to BMT with an AFOEA ready for his blues at graduation parade?

:clap:
Sure.....it will go with is NDSM, BMTS ribbon, Marksmanship ribbon and honor grad ribbon.
Of course he needs to bring the supporting documents.
This is no different than the prior service (Army NG types usualyl) who wore their army ribbons day 1.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

lordmonar

PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Shuman 14

Quote from: Капитан Хаткевич on September 21, 2016, 11:08:33 PM
Quote from: shuman14 on September 21, 2016, 08:58:17 PM
QuoteWhich would be stupid. 

Stupid how? That's how unit awards work, every Joe and Jane in the unit during the qualifying period of the award gets a ribbon to wear on their uniform.

Did a lot, did a little, did nothing at all, everyone gets the ribbon.

Because literally the whole organization would get it. Not a unit. If everyone has it, no one has it.

The organization IS the unit. How hard is this to grasp. Similar things have happened in the past... just not in CAP.

Now it has happen to CAP, enjoy the success, accept the award humbly and gratefully, and move on... all glory is fleeting.
Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 - 1998, 2000 - 2003, 2005 - Present     CAP: 2013 - 2014, 2021 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000      Active Army: 2003 - 2005                                       USCGAux: 2004 - Present

Shuman 14

Quote from: coudano on September 21, 2016, 11:46:31 PM
So 18 year old cadet snuffy earns the AFOEA via being in CAP during the time of the cite.
He goes and enlists in the USAF.

Does he walk in to BMT with an AFOEA ready for his blues at graduation parade?

:clap:

Yes absolutely. Prior Service types continue to wear awards from their previously earned awards, the USCGAux does not have a cadet/midshipman program but an 18 year old could join and later enlist/commission into the USCG and wear any USCG/DOT/DHS awards he/she earned in the USCGAux.

I just fail to see how this is such a hard concept to grasp.
Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 - 1998, 2000 - 2003, 2005 - Present     CAP: 2013 - 2014, 2021 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000      Active Army: 2003 - 2005                                       USCGAux: 2004 - Present

Shuman 14

Quote from: Eclipse on September 22, 2016, 02:57:05 AM
Quote from: MHC5096 on September 22, 2016, 12:05:21 AM
If the award is officially awarded to the cadet and his personnel record is updated to reflect the award then the answer is yes. I had one of my CGAUX troops pick up a commission as a LTJG with the Navy JAG Corps. When he graduated from ODS was able to wear the Coast Guard Unit Commendation, Coast Guard Meritorious Unit Commendation and the 3 Coast Guard Meritorious Team Commendations he had been awarded in the CGAUX.


Quote from: MHC5096 on September 22, 2016, 12:05:21 AM
No reason why this would be any different.

Other then they are, completely different situations, both practically and from a regulatory standpoint.

As has been discussed on this board far more then one would probably assume considering this is CAPTalk and not CGAUXTalk,
Coast Guard Auxiliarists are fully authorized to receive a number of CG decorations under their status as the Aux.

Civil Air Patrol is not afforded that ability.

Which clearly changed on the 20th of September 2016.  ;)

Thank you Madame Secretary.
Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 - 1998, 2000 - 2003, 2005 - Present     CAP: 2013 - 2014, 2021 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000      Active Army: 2003 - 2005                                       USCGAux: 2004 - Present

Eclipse

Quote from: shuman14 on September 22, 2016, 01:31:45 PM
Which clearly changed on the 20th of September 2016.

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

"That Others May Zoom"

Shuman 14

Quote from: Капитан Хаткевич on September 22, 2016, 03:46:26 AM
What's the last award the whole Air Force got?

I cannot answer that question but the ENTIRE Coast Guard received a Presidential Unit Citation on 13 September 2005:

https://www.uscg.mil/auxiliary/awards/PUC_citation0506.pdf

And I quote the last line of the citation before the signature block:

QuoteAll Coast Guard members are authorized to wear the Presidential Unit Citation ribbon with a special clasp in the form of the internationally recognized "hurricane symbol".
(emphasis mine)

All is all.  ;)
Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 - 1998, 2000 - 2003, 2005 - Present     CAP: 2013 - 2014, 2021 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000      Active Army: 2003 - 2005                                       USCGAux: 2004 - Present

Shuman 14

Quote from: Eclipse on September 22, 2016, 01:33:27 PM
Quote from: shuman14 on September 22, 2016, 01:31:45 PM
Which clearly changed on the 20th of September 2016.

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

Hey don't get mad at me Sir, that Air Force changed the rules on you for wanting to recognize the efforts and results of CAP.
Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 - 1998, 2000 - 2003, 2005 - Present     CAP: 2013 - 2014, 2021 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000      Active Army: 2003 - 2005                                       USCGAux: 2004 - Present

Eclipse

Quote from: shuman14 on September 22, 2016, 01:43:09 PM
Quote from: Eclipse on September 22, 2016, 01:33:27 PM
Quote from: shuman14 on September 22, 2016, 01:31:45 PM
Which clearly changed on the 20th of September 2016.

And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon.

Hey don't get mad at me Sir, that Air Force changed the rules on you for wanting to recognize the efforts and results of CAP.

At least as published and public, no "rules have been changed" - the USAF presented the Nat CC with a streamer for the flag.
It's very likely the downstream ramifications were not even considered.

Clearly people will "do what they will do" but "changing the rules" takes more then a desktop conversation and a photo-op.

A few years ago, HWSRN was handing out guard decorations to members of a wing that were "piloting" a sliced-bread-program
that turned out to be the bad idea many knew it was.  That didn't fly, either.

"That Others May Zoom"

Shuman 14

HWSRN was not at the Secretariat level of the Department of the Air Force either.
Joseph J. Clune
Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police

USMCR: 1990 - 1992                           USAR: 1993 - 1998, 2000 - 2003, 2005 - Present     CAP: 2013 - 2014, 2021 - Present
INARNG: 1992 - 1993, 1998 - 2000      Active Army: 2003 - 2005                                       USCGAux: 2004 - Present

coudano

Quote from: Eclipse on September 22, 2016, 01:49:01 PM
"changing the rules" takes more then a desktop conversation and a photo-op.

Where have you been for the last... like... 10 years?

The rules about what it takes to change the rules have changed...

Майор Хаткевич

Quote from: PHall on September 22, 2016, 07:12:49 AM
Quote from: Капитан Хаткевич on September 22, 2016, 03:46:26 AM
What's the last award the whole Air Force got?

National Defense Service Medal
Air Force Training Ribbon


Both of which take more than just hitting a CAP roster within stated time period. NDSM, sure, it it's not applied to all members automatically.

abdsp51

Quote from: shuman14 on September 22, 2016, 01:29:48 PM
Quote from: coudano on September 21, 2016, 11:46:31 PM
So 18 year old cadet snuffy earns the AFOEA via being in CAP during the time of the cite.
He goes and enlists in the USAF.

Does he walk in to BMT with an AFOEA ready for his blues at graduation parade?

:clap:

Yes absolutely. Prior Service types continue to wear awards from their previously earned awards, the USCGAux does not have a cadet/midshipman program but an 18 year old could join and later enlist/commission into the USCG and wear any USCG/DOT/DHS awards he/she earned in the USCGAux.

I just fail to see how this is such a hard concept to grasp.

Except CAP is not prior service and does not have that type of a relationship with the USAF.  Sorry a cadet awarded this will not be able to wear it upon graduation of basic.  The BMT, NDSM, and the GWOT service (if that is still being awarded) yes but this one sadly know. 

You really need to stop trying to say what CAP and the USAF will and won't do since you have absolutely no clue about it or the admin side of things. 

abdsp51

Quote from: lordmonar on September 22, 2016, 10:14:52 AM
Quote from: coudano on September 21, 2016, 11:46:31 PM
So 18 year old cadet snuffy earns the AFOEA via being in CAP during the time of the cite.
He goes and enlists in the USAF.

Does he walk in to BMT with an AFOEA ready for his blues at graduation parade?

:clap:
Sure.....it will go with is NDSM, BMTS ribbon, Marksmanship ribbon and honor grad ribbon.
Of course he needs to bring the supporting documents.
This is no different than the prior service (Army NG types usualyl) who wore their army ribbons day 1.

Except CAP service especially as a cadet are not prior service.

MHC5096

Quote from: Капитан Хаткевич on September 22, 2016, 03:46:26 AM
What's the last award the whole Air Force got?

The AFOUA or AFOEA were awarded to a bulk of the units in the USAF for service on 9/11.
Mark H. Crary
Lt Col, CAP (1990-Present)
DDC-P, CGAUX (2011-Present)
MSgt, USAF (1995-2011)
QM2, USN (1989-1995)