Death of the orange PAWG cap?

[Mitchell 1969]

But rather, help me come up with an argument that will go further than wing level in CAC. 

CAC has no business involving itself in uniform issues unless an echelon commander has asked for your input, and then
it would only be in regards to uniform issues specific to cadets.

No. It should quite rightly be in regards to issues specific to whatever said echelon commander has directed. Nothing says that a CAC can't be directed to look at non-cadet matters.

[Eclipse]

The first failure of a CAC is when they involve themselves in trying to change the senior program.

The second is when they start self-directing because their respective commanders aren't asking them to
consider any issues.

The third is when a CAC involves themselves in matters regarding uniforms items, recruiting or retention.

The forth is when commanders treat them as if the "A" stood for "Activity".

[Luis R. Ramos]

Nothing says that a CAC can't be directed to look at non-cadet matters.

I though that CAC meant Cadet Advisory Council.

Not Can Assign Council...

The name says it. By saying Cadet Advisory it is for issues related to cadets only!

Flyer

[LSThiker]

The first failure of a CAC is when they involve themselves in trying to change the senior program.

That depends.  If it is a change to the CP professional development, then getting the input from cadets may be beneficial.  Cadets may not be getting the proper cadet development that they need or want from the seniors that are supposed to be training them.  Getting input on how to adjust the cadet-senior relations throughout the wing from cadets is important.

Now matters regarding finance, logistics, flying, sure. 

The second is when they start self-directing because their respective commanders aren't asking them to
consider any issues.

This is not necessarily a failure of the CAC.  It is a failure of the commanders and the CP officers.

The third is when a CAC involves themselves in matters regarding uniforms items, recruiting or retention.

Actually, regarding recruiting and/or retention, the CAC may be a perfect venue.  Who better to understand problems with recruiting and retention of cadets than cadets themselves.  If the problem of retention is simply because the cadets are no longer interested in what the state is providing them, I would definitely say that is a cadet related issue that can be addressed by the CAC to the wing commander.

The forth is when commanders treat them as if the "A" stood for "Activity".

Again, not a failure of the CAC, but rather a failure of the command and CP officers for assigning them these tasks.  However, that being said, the planning of a cadet activity should always include cadets, especially when considering what activities the wing should host in the future.

[JeffDG]

Nothing says that a CAC can't be directed to look at non-cadet matters.

I though that CAC meant Cadet Advisory Council.

Not Can Assign Council...

The name says it. By saying Cadet Advisory it is for issues related to cadets only!

Flyer

Can just as easily be considered an Advisory Council comprised of Cadets, in which case, the Commander would be free to seek their advice on any issue.

[sarmed1]

Plus I will bet a safety vest is more effective for visibility. Not only because of the reflective material but because it is larger than a measly hat with no reflective strips.

Flyer

On the/from the ground you are correct, but I was shown pictures taken by someone in PAWG from an aircraft; pic 1 was GT with PAWG ornage hats on and orange vests, 2nd was BDU hat and orange vest, much more visable with the orange hat vs not.

Even without pack/LBE covering, most aerial visability is only a small amount over the shoulders (unless you have the back drapped on topof a pack)

not saying this is an argument for (I hate the thing personally) just it really is more visable from the air

mk

[Luis R. Ramos]

Can just as easily be considered as an Advisory Council composed of cadets?

I think that is as contradictory as stating parking in driveways and drive in parkways.



But what can I say? I am not a native English speaker!



Flyer

[brent.teal]

I hate these things too.  Whats even funnier is that we are required to remove the button on top of the orange baseball cap for safety purposes. 

[a2capt]

Whats even funnier is that we are required to remove the button on top of the orange baseball cap for safety purposes.

Is that actually in writing someplace?

[RMW14]

I am not sure where the previous poster is from in PA but I don't think that it is required to remove the little knob thingy on the top. It maybe required or recommended at his/her unit.

I, personally, remove the little knob thing on all my hats because that little thing hurts if it gets hit by something. I actually started removing them before I joined CAP as a cadet.

[brent.teal]

Well, perhaps I misunderstood but they made it sound like it was a wing thing.  Could be one of those things that some people rib you for if they see it.

[Eclipse]

PAWG's supp also requires Left Handed Smoke Benders as team equipment...

[Panache]

Whats even funnier is that we are required to remove the button on top of the orange baseball cap for safety purposes.

Is that actually in writing someplace?

No, it's most certainly not in writing, nor is it "required."  It's just one of those unwritten things everybody does that gets passed along verbally, but it's definitely not mandatory.

I was told that the reason we remove the little knob-thingee is because if you're wearing your orange cap in a plane, and you're also wearing a headset, the top strap of the headset presses against the knob which, in turn, digs into the top of your skull. 

[Mitchell 1969]

The first failure of a CAC is when they involve themselves in trying to change the senior program.

The second is when they start self-directing because their respective commanders aren't asking them to
consider any issues.

The third is when a CAC involves themselves in matters regarding uniforms items, recruiting or retention.

The forth is when commanders treat them as if the "A" stood for "Activity".

Failure? Really? I did every one of those things on Cadet Advisory Councils. They have me a white ribbon with a gold star on it. Do they usually give those for failures?

(Maybe the commanders didn't ask us to do much. But the advisors appointed by the commanders seemed to be on top of things and seemed to like the results).