how to get a crease in BDU pants

[LGM30GMCC]

Better not come to my AD unit! Most of the officers routinely wear flight suits while everyone else wears ABUs...

The flight suit is a prescribed daily work uniform for a lot of active and reservists.  It is not in CAP.

To use a phrase often used by and against you...'cite please.'

The restriction in 39-1 says 'Flight Crews Only' there really hasn't been much laying out what determines when someone is or is not 'Flight Crew.'

If you use the standard 'only when in the performance of Flight-related duties' you are going to get in the same trouble that folks have in the USAF. What defines 'Flight Related Duties'? For some office folks who support flight operations aren't doing flight related duties, others view is if you are part of an operations or operations support squadron and of a career field that is authorized a flight suit, you're golden. Commanders tend to define this differently as they see fit. Some of this is because culturally the USAF is controlled by pilots.

If folks are doing ES Training related to MS/MO are they a flight crew? Once they land, lock chalk and debrief from a sortie are they still flight crew? Or do they have to change into another uniform? If someone was doing MO work and suddenly is needed as AOBD do they have to change? If someone flies to a meeting for a unit visit in a CAP aircraft and departs that night back to their home base should they only wear the flight suit for the trip itself?

There is a reasonable argument to be made that CAP intends for folks not to wear the flight suit the way the USAF wears it, but if you switch into the utility uniform (which is essentially identical in style) suddenly it's ok?

It's a little more ambiguous than I think some folks would like (Myself included) with exactly what the intent is regarding this. Personally, I believe someone who was anti-aircrew mentality slipped that rule in there and just hoped it would make things all nice and easy. It really isn't that simple. Barring that, leaving it to the discretion of a unit (or higher) commander to decide when someone does or does not constitute aircrew works for me as long as the flight suit is being worn properly.

I think their main reason for wearing flight suits is to look cool. They had no real reason for wearing them, it isnt functional.

That's also debatable as well. For one, it very much is designed as a functional uniform. It's function though is much better suited to sitting down than walking around. (Those pockets in strange places become a lot more usable and actually easier to access than BDU pockets once you are sitting down.)

Some things are black and white. Unfortunately, unless you have some cite that is more clear than the 'Flight Crews Only' this isn't one of them. And when it comes down to a gray area like this, it quickly becomes 'Commander's Discretion'

[Garibaldi]

AFAIK, none of the aircrew in our unit even OWN a flight suit. They all fly in the golf-shirt combination. The only people I've seen in flight suits on SAREXes were fairly new. My feeling is that most of the oldies are tired of wearing flight suits and wear what's comfortable.

[SarDragon]

Unless you're in a wing that requires them. Mine does.

[CadetColonelToBe]

My feeling is that most of the oldies are tired of wearing flight suits and wear what's comfortable.

actually everyone who wears flight suits (which half of our seniors) all say they are really quite comfy... and breezy.

[stillamarine]

Not sure the issue with ironing creases in bdus. WIWAD I ironed all my own uniforms except my dress and service jackets. I was able to put creases in my bdus quite easily with the appropriate application of starch and a hot iron. I dont ever recall having a problem with it. I've never been a fan of dry cleaning. Even now as a cop I iron my own uniforms even though I know I can get a great discount with dry cleaning.

[abdsp51]

I always used starch and an iron.  Creases in the pants general fell out from pounding pavement and climbing in and out of a car all day long. A hot iron and starch will do the trick but starch the inside of the pants to help them hold a little bit longer.

[Eclipse]

Better not come to my AD unit! Most of the officers routinely wear flight suits while everyone else wears ABUs...

The flight suit is a prescribed daily work uniform for a lot of active and reservists.  It is not in CAP.

To use a phrase often used by and against you...'cite please.'

The restriction in 39-1 says 'Flight Crews Only' there really hasn't been much laying out what determines when someone is or is not 'Flight Crew.'

Pretty straightforward.

1 - Are you qualified or a trainee in an aircrew specialty?  If yes, goto 2, if no, goto 4.

2 - Are you going to fly that day? If yes, goto 3, if no, goto 4.

3 - You are 'Flight crew' wear flight suit. goto end.

4 - You are not 'Flight Crew'. Wear other. goto end.

[SarDragon]

Actual situation:

Show up at mission base in a flight suit, ready to fly. Flight takes off, weather goes sour, RTB. Get an offer to do MRO. What's a guy to do?

[RogueLeader]

Actual situation:

Show up at mission base in a flight suit, ready to fly. Flight takes off, weather goes sour, RTB. Get an offer to do MRO. What's a guy to do?

Change into my bdu's that are in my base gear.

[PHall]

Actual situation:

Show up at mission base in a flight suit, ready to fly. Flight takes off, weather goes sour, RTB. Get an offer to do MRO. What's a guy to do?

Change into my bdu's that are in my base gear.

If the IC has no problem with him working the radios in a flight suit, why should you?

[RogueLeader]

I don't care what he does. That is what I would do, and have done.

[Maj. Joe Mora]

Starching BDU's is a really bad idea, the starch will not let the fabric breathe; and when working outside they can get very hot and uncomfortable.

The BDU is a working uniform, and any unit requiring creases is misguided. A steam iron will make the uniform look sharp and neat. It is not a dress uniform by any means.

[rustyjeeper]

You don't need creases in your BDU's.  Ironing is plenty, and some would suggest too much for a field uniform.

my squadron says we have to have creases in them...

your squadron is WRONG!
they just need to present a decent appearance.
Flat pockets etc, all show pride in the uniform. Vreases in a field uniform are just plain "A _ al".....IMHO

[AngelWings]

Starching BDU's is a really bad idea, the starch will not let the fabric breathe; and when working outside they can get very hot and uncomfortable.

The BDU is a working uniform, and any unit requiring creases is misguided. A steam iron will make the uniform look sharp and neat. It is not a dress uniform by any means.

I use heavy starch to convert my BDU's to winterweight. Works real well!

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

There is a reasonable argument to be made that CAP intends for folks not to wear the flight suit the way the USAF wears it, but if you switch into the utility uniform (which is essentially identical in style) suddenly it's ok?

Good point, especially given that 39-1 makes an untenable distinction between the "CAP blue flight suit" and the "CAP utility uniform."  The flight cap is authorised for one, but not the other, when the only difference (supposedly) that one is made of NOMEX and the other isn't.  However, a lot of CAP crews wear the non-NOMEX bag (which is much cheaper) as a flight suit, and I am reasonably sure that not a few wear the flight cap.  Since the only real way to tell what the fabric is, is to look at the manufacturer's tag, how can compliance with this very open-ended reg expect to be followed?

[PHall]

Starching BDU's is a really bad idea, the starch will not let the fabric breathe; and when working outside they can get very hot and uncomfortable.

The BDU is a working uniform, and any unit requiring creases is misguided. A steam iron will make the uniform look sharp and neat. It is not a dress uniform by any means.

I use heavy starch to convert my BDU's to winterweight. Works real well!

Why?

[RogueLeader]

Starching BDU's is a really bad idea, the starch will not let the fabric breathe; and when working outside they can get very hot and uncomfortable.

The BDU is a working uniform, and any unit requiring creases is misguided. A steam iron will make the uniform look sharp and neat. It is not a dress uniform by any means.

I use heavy starch to convert my BDU's to winterweight. Works real well!

Why?

You ask why.  My friend, I ask: why not?

The answer is that it saves the amount of BDU's needed.  Starch in the Winter makes summer weight heavy like winter weight, so I don't have to have some for summer and winter.

[Critical AOA]

So we must be flying to wear the flight suit but we don't have to be hiding from anyone to wear camo.  Sounds reasonable.   

[SarDragon]

So we must be flying to wear the flight suit but we don't have to be hiding from anyone to wear camo.  Sounds reasonable.   

You're preaching to the choir, pal. This has been beaten to death so many times on here that I'm surprised the pages haven't turned red.

The flight suit is a duty specific uniform, to be worn when performing aircrew duties. Wearing it for any other purpose is, IMHO, just foe the kool factor, and we already have enough of that as it is.

Regarding camo utilities - that's what our parent organization wears. Economy of scale helped make it the best option at the time, and today, there is still no better option.

[Critical AOA]

Ok, but in regards to the "cool factor", I believe many people like camo and the tiger stripes, etc. due to their believing it is cool.  That is why so many civilians who never were military can be seen wearing it.  Personally, I don't think camo is all that cool and I think that the BDUs look sloppy on 90%+ of the people who wear them.  Just my opinion for the little it is worth.

I do agree that this subject has been beaten to death but when I see people rejecting the idea of someone wearing a flight suit except when they are flying but advocate wearing a camouflaged field uniform to indoor meetings, I must laugh.  To me it is silly.