Its not just CAP who gets the fakers...

[PHall]

Saw a guy outside Walmart on the way home from work(Needed a case for my glasses.) He was collecting money for Wounded Warriors.org. When I saw him, my instincts just said "FAKER!!!!". I thought this for the following reasons:

1) He was wearing the outdated dress greens. Now he could be retired or discharged. He was wearing it properly with shoes shined and pressed. But he also...

2)Was not wearing a cover standing just outside the door of Wally World.

3)He was wearing Infantry branch insignia but his unit patch was the 4th PsyOp Group and a SF combat patch. He also had an Infantry cord, CIB, and AAS wings. About 7 rows of fruit salad and 4 unit citations. There were no blue discs under the branch and US insignia on the lapels. I was straight infantry so I don't know if Infantry guys in  non-infantry assignments wear the discs.

4)He was wearing a SAPPER tab, but no SF tab. I guess he could have been attached or assigned to a SF group in a non-SF role without being tab qualified.

5)He was wearing a AR Overseas Training Ribbon so he might have been in a number of different branches and MOSs depending on his active and reserve time.

Everything about his uniform could have a logical explanation, but there were enough oddities to raise my "Faker" radar. I didn't talk to him or stop to stare at the uniform. I just did a couple of slow fly-bys
going in and out so I can't say if there was anything  wrong with the rack but like I said there were just a couple of little things that stood out. Does Walmart check the bonafides of these guys.

No, Walmart does not check out the folks who solicit outside their doors.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

3)I was straight infantry so I don't know if Infantry guys in  non-infantry assignments wear the discs.

I'm not sure if this touches on what you're getting at, but my dad was in the 4th Armored Division, Erlangen, West Germany.



He wore Infantry cross-muskets and "U.S." enlisted collar brass with blue discs and a blue shoulder cord on his Ike jacket.  He never wore the Armor insignia.



I asked him how he could be Infantry in an Armored division and he said that his Company, Battalion, I don't remember which (and I don't know a whole lot about how the Army does unit designation), was "Armored Infantry."  I know he spent a lot of time in an M-59 APC.

[PHall]

An Armored Division does have Infantry Battalions just like an Infantry Division will have Armor Battalions.
It's just that in an Infantry Division there will be more Infantry Battalions then Armor Battalions and the reverse in an Armored Division.
(This is a much simplified explanation.)

[bosshawk]

FyI: It is entirely possible for there to be folks from all 16 or 17 branches of the Army in a single Infantry or Armored Division or any other large formation.  They would still all wear the Division patch and their branch insignia.

[RogueLeader]

I know that if you are 11 mos enlisted, you wear the disk.

SAPPER is an engineer program and not restricted to SF.

Unit citations are from unit history, you wear what you wore when you get out.

[ol'fido]

I know what Sapper training is. I know how unit citations work. My question was if you are branched as infantry but not currently in an infantry slot do you wear the disks. Example: 11B working in division IG section. Does anybody know what branch insignia PSYOPs wears...MI..SF...??.

[RogueLeader]

Then the point of #4 was? 

[sarmed1]

the trick to the average SF faker with a combat patch is the tab.... do they have the Special Forces Tab on the combat patch side?   if so they are a faker (the actual SF tab is a qualification not part to the SF patch....that is just the sword and bolts with the airborne tab attached)

mk

[Duke Dillio]

Gotta love the ones who put the SF tab under the Airborne tab.  Another fun one I saw once was a 10th Mountain Division Patch with no mountain tab.  I did see one really old timer once with the 82nd Infantry for a combat patch.....From WWI....

[ol'fido]

Then the point of #4 was? 

The point was that he was not wearing an SF tab even though he had the SF combat patch so he wasn't tab qualified. The Sapper tab was incidental to my point.

[MSG Mac]

Gotta love the ones who put the SF tab under the Airborne tab.  Another fun one I saw once was a 10th Mountain Division Patch with no mountain tab.  I did see one really old timer once with the 82nd Infantry for a combat patch.....From WWI....

The 82nd was in France during WW I, But wasn't an Airborne unit until 1940 or 41. depending on how long ago you saw this gent, and his age, he might have been legit.

[ol'fido]

Gotta love the ones who put the SF tab under the Airborne tab.  Another fun one I saw once was a 10th Mountain Division Patch with no mountain tab.  I did see one really old timer once with the 82nd Infantry for a combat patch.....From WWI....

The 82nd was in France during WW I, But wasn't an Airborne unit until 1940 or 41. depending on how long ago you saw this gent, and his age, he might have been legit.

The 82nd division was Sgt. York's unit.

[Hawk200]

the trick to the average SF faker with a combat patch is the tab.... do they have the Special Forces Tab on the combat patch side?   if so they are a faker (the actual SF tab is a qualification not part to the SF patch....that is just the sword and bolts with the airborne tab attached)

mk

Unless they got it really early. Some early recipients got them without an Airborne tab. But the individual would have to be over 70 years old to have SF without Airborne tab.

[Hawk200]

I know what Sapper training is. I know how unit citations work. My question was if you are branched as infantry but not currently in an infantry slot do you wear the disks. Example: 11B working in division IG section. Does anybody know what branch insignia PSYOPs wears...MI..SF...??.

Yes, you wear the discs while still holding the MOS. Once in training for a new MOS, you usually lose the discs (this is usually the new school that directs this). The discs may not be worn again unless actively slotted in an 11 series position.

PSYOPS likely wears MI. Would have to know the specific MOS to say yea or nay. PSYOPS works with SF but it is not an SF branch. (There is an Intel Sergeant MOS in SF, but the guy would wear SF insignia, not MI, it's an 18 series MOS.)

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

Yes, you wear the discs while still holding the MOS. Once in training for a new MOS, you usually lose the discs (this is usually the new school that directs this). The discs may not be worn again unless actively slotted in an 11 series position.

Again using my dad as an example...

He wore the blue discs as a member of the 4th Armored, who Hitler's propagandists called "Roosevelt's Butchers" after they squashed two SS-Panzergrenadier units.

However, he was not in a combat MOS.  His main job was as radio repairman, and he was one of the earliest Specialist 4's, which he said at that time was supposed to be like an enlisted version of a warrant officer.

He said, "the Army always said they were going to send me to school for it but never did."

If he'd actually gone to the school, I wonder if he'd have lost the discs.

[SARDOC]

Yes, you wear the discs while still holding the MOS. Once in training for a new MOS, you usually lose the discs (this is usually the new school that directs this). The discs may not be worn again unless actively slotted in an 11 series position.

IIRC this is true.  Discs and the infantry cord are only worn when it's the soldiers Primary MOS, unless they have been awarded the Combat Infantyman's badge or the Expert Infantryman's badge...they the cord and the disks become permanent.

[lordmonar]

You know.....not to knock the army or anything.....but people complain about useless bling on CAP uniforms!

Trying to read and understand the Army regs on these things is next to impossible!

[Eclipse]

Looks pretty simplicated to me:

[lordmonar]

Really?

Infantry cords+branch insiniga+regimental number+infantry disk+battalion crest+divisional patch+combat patch+overseas stripes+longevity stripes+unit citations (all of them even those earned in WWI)+combat unit patch.

They are just as full of bling as CAP's uniforms.....more so in some ways.

[ol'fido]

Well, they do have about 172 more years of history and tradition to base such bling on.